These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Intergalactic Summit

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
12Next page
 

PAUX: Legion of Faith
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Raphael Ordo
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#1 - 2013-05-23 00:06:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Raphael Ordo
I know how you feel. But there is another way.

In favour of PIE's 10 year celebrations and my own ascention within the PIE Auxiliary Force, I conducted a speech above Amarr Prime today:


Brothers and sisters of all races,

I come from a family with traditions.
Traditions that binds us all.
Traditions that defines us all.

My history is not more grand than any other capsuleer to this day.
I claim no status of having ascended above the life of others, be that of the Caldari liberalist, or the life-long Minmatar slave.
Believe me, no one is lesser in the eye of the Creator.

"In the beginning all things were as one.
God parted them and breathed life into his creation
Divided the parts and gave each its place
And unto each, bestowed purpose"
- The Scriptures, Book I 1:4

It is said that the True Amarr were blessed from the very beginning of time, chosen as God's children. 
Yes, they were blessed. And Yes, they were chosen. 
Blessed, with the knowledge to imply the message of God into their culture, their society and their traditions. 
Chosen, to deliver His message to the deepest corners of the galaxy.

And they did.
But not before long, other Empires came along with different views on life. Differences that, in some cases and even to this day, has ended in the waste of life itself.

People, especially those outside of the Empire, tend to blame and argue that the Amarr is a closed religious society unable to be open to new ideas and new people.
Over and over, history has proven these people wrong, unable to understand our amarrian society as a whole.

The formation of the Ammatar Mandate and the Empress´ will to apply a royal heir to to lead it. Even the creation of the Khanid Kingdom, to name a few, have their own stories of acceptance into the Empire. 
The Amarr even embraced my own family, who was originating from the Caldari Lai Dai corporation, and greatly intertwined with the Adakul philosophy.
Several families of Caldari descent crossed over to borders of the Amarr Empire during the Gallente-Caldari war, centuries ago.
My family eventually settled into adakul monestaries within the realm of King Khanid II, in the wake of the Kingdom's creation. The Ordos and the other Caldari families that followed, contributed much to the Khanid Kingdom's initially compromised economy through shares and mere business contacts. The ruling Amarr Emperor not only allowed this change, but embraced it along side his own Empire. This led to the turning point in history with the creation of the Carthum Conglomerate corporation, that ultimately marked and bridged a new and holy cooperation between the State and the Empire.

Our adversaries will say our decisive choice to scour the heavens in golden ships is our weakness. Meanwhile, our combat records, and any who dare to oppose us, will say otherwise.
One should not take lightly on the assumptions of others without proper empirical judgement behind it.. Not even my words should be taken as facts before being tested thoroughly.

It is the Amarrian tradition not to recognize every other ideal, religion, bloodlines and blasphemy out there as a fact.
If it had, the Amarr wouldn't be the largest and oldest surviving Empire in human history.
I've mentioned traditions several times now.
So what is traditions?
the word "tradition" itself derives from the old Amarrian language tradere or traderer literally meaning “to transmit”, “to hand over” and “to give for safekeeping”.

Therefore, I invite you, be you Caldari, Minmatar or Gallente, to come and feel our traditions and composition of a real brotherhood as it was meant it to be!
Values that consider the whole of mankind.
Traditions that makes us into what we ultimately can become.
Purpose in being be a part of history, and something even greater than any empire, state, federation or republic.

This is PIE.
This is the Legion of Faith.

There is an old adakul saying:
"Through traditions, we will come together.
Through cooperation and unity, we strive forward.
Through faith in our actions, we acknowledge purpose.
Through purposes, we find peace. Through peace, we will find God."

"Surround yourself with the faithful, Stand together, for there is no strength like it under the heavens."
- The Scriptures, Book of Missions 71:21

Come brethren of humanity!
Let us claim our holy birthright, and unite in golden cuirasses under the flags of our origins.



Join our public relay channel "PIE Public", and take your first real steps in life towards a greater purpose.
Samira Kernher
Cail Avetatu
#2 - 2013-05-23 00:57:16 UTC
By His light and His will.

Thank you for holding this wonderful speech tonight, Legionnaire.
Sepherim
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#3 - 2013-05-23 01:29:16 UTC
Indeed, it's a wonderful speech. My apologies for being late to attend to the first time it was spoken, Legionnaire, but duties prevented me from being on time.

Sepherim Catillah Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris Liuteneant Ex-Imperial Navy Imperator Commander
Anabella Rella
Gradient
Electus Matari
#4 - 2013-05-24 06:35:13 UTC
That's got to be one of the most long-winded recruiting spiels I've seen. You know that there's a special section of the GalNet for this sort of thing, yes?

That point aside, please tell me why I, a Matari whose ancestors you attempted to subjugate by force and failed, should willingly adopt your religion, traditions, culture etc. and forsake my own? I'm already part of something larger than myself that seeks to better my people and my nation but, not at the expense of others. Why would I want to be a slave to an Amarrian so that in several generations my descendants could possibly be freed to become second class citizens in a monolithic, theocratic, totalitarian empire?

I'm quite interested in your answers to these questions.

When the world is running down, you make the best of what's still around.
Samira Kernher
Cail Avetatu
#5 - 2013-05-24 07:08:11 UTC
Anabella Rella wrote:
I'm quite interested in your answers to these questions.


Are you? None of the answers will convince you, and you probably already know what they will be.
Anabella Rella
Gradient
Electus Matari
#6 - 2013-05-24 15:45:15 UTC
Samira Kernher wrote:


Are you? None of the answers will convince you, and you probably already know what they will be.


I don't recall asking you a godsdamned thing, traitor. I was speaking to the OP but yes, I am most interested in his answer.

Let's hear it. Here's your chance to sell all of us "unenlightened" why we should stop resisting you and accept your vision of what's best for humanity.

When the world is running down, you make the best of what's still around.
Anabella Rella
Gradient
Electus Matari
#7 - 2013-05-24 15:52:04 UTC
I'm also wondering why you're not allowed into the real PIE? I know it's because you guys aren't Amarrians but, shouldn't that tell you something? That your masters don't consider you equal to them so, they created a separate second class corporation for all you who wish to fight and die for them yet, aren't good enough to sit at the same table with the "true" faithful?

When the world is running down, you make the best of what's still around.
Samira Kernher
Cail Avetatu
#8 - 2013-05-24 16:07:11 UTC
Anabella Rella wrote:
I'm also wondering why you're not allowed into the real PIE? I know it's because you guys aren't Amarrians but, shouldn't that tell you something? That your masters don't consider you equal to them so, they created a separate second class corporation for all you who wish to fight and die for them yet, aren't good enough to sit at the same table with the "true" faithful?


We recognize our place. Our bloodlines must still prove themselves worthy of God, and so we are not equal. We simply have the humility to accept this, something that you in your stubborn pride will never understand.
Sepherim
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#9 - 2013-05-24 23:53:58 UTC
Anabella Rella wrote:
I don't recall asking you a godsdamned thing, traitor. I was speaking to the OP but yes, I am most interested in his answer.


You do realize that this kind of replies will probably make it difficult for people to take you seriously and reply seriously to you, no?

Sepherim Catillah Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris Liuteneant Ex-Imperial Navy Imperator Commander
Fredfredbug4
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2013-05-25 00:50:23 UTC
Quite a wonderful speech. PIE has always been among the best the Empire have to offer and seem to defy the negative bias many have towards the Amarr. Alas, your words, while inspiring are rather too optimistic for this day and age, but great to think about nonetheless.

If only your nation abolished slavery. Yes it is one of the traditions you talked about and while it has kept the Empire together, it has isolated it from much of New Eden. I feel if slavery was done with, the Amarr would find countless friends and allies in the cluster.

Watch_ Fred Fred Frederation_ and stop [u]cryptozoologist[/u]! Fight against the brutal genocide of fictional creatures across New Eden! Is that a metaphor? Probably not, but the fru-fru- people will sure love it!
Vincent Rekmus
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#11 - 2013-05-25 06:38:47 UTC
We shouldn't abolish slavery. It is more than a mere tradition.

Great speech.
Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
#12 - 2013-05-25 06:55:58 UTC
Samira Kernher wrote:
We recognize our place. Our bloodlines must still prove themselves worthy of God, and so we are not equal. We simply have the humility to accept this, something that you in your stubborn pride will never understand.


And yet this is exactly why I would never join PIE. Yes, I admire their piety, loyalty and achievements... but I was raised to believe that the definition of Amarrian was anyone who believed in the Amarrian Faith and that all Amarrians are equal in the eyes of God, regardless of their heritage.

"That," my mother said, "is what separates us from those savages in the Republic. They talk about 'race' and 'bloodlines' but we know that it is what is in our souls that define who we truly are."

Sadly, PIE doesn't seem to share such enlightened views.

http://youtu.be/t0q2F8NsYQ0
Anabella Rella
Gradient
Electus Matari
#13 - 2013-05-25 08:21:32 UTC
Sepherim wrote:


You do realize that this kind of replies will probably make it difficult for people to take you seriously and reply seriously to you, no?


Think what you will but, I wanted a direct answer from the OP, not Kernher. As he is the person who wrote the speech and started this discussion (and presumably knew the meaning and intentions of his words) it should have been he who answered the questions that I posed. I was seeking clarification on several points contained in the speech.

Unless Kernher now counts telepathy among her skills it's highly doubtful that she would be qualified to answer for the OP.

When the world is running down, you make the best of what's still around.
Samira Kernher
Cail Avetatu
#14 - 2013-05-25 09:01:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Samira Kernher
Katran Luftschreck wrote:
Samira Kernher wrote:
We recognize our place. Our bloodlines must still prove themselves worthy of God, and so we are not equal. We simply have the humility to accept this, something that you in your stubborn pride will never understand.


And yet this is exactly why I would never join PIE. Yes, I admire their piety, loyalty and achievements... but I was raised to believe that the definition of Amarrian was anyone who believed in the Amarrian Faith and that all Amarrians are equal in the eyes of God, regardless of their heritage.

"That," my mother said, "is what separates us from those savages in the Republic. They talk about 'race' and 'bloodlines' but we know that it is what is in our souls that define who we truly are."

Sadly, PIE doesn't seem to share such enlightened views.


Only the Amarr are Chosen. This is written in Scripture. It is improper to believe that those of us who turned from God and had to be Reclaimed are equal to those who have never strayed.

The gates of Heaven are open only once. It is a great mercy that God has granted the rest of us a second chance at all.

We might all be faithful, but only the Amarr are God's Chosen, for they never strayed from His light.

Anabella Rella wrote:
Think what you will but, I wanted a direct answer from the OP, not Kernher. As he is the person who wrote the speech and started this discussion (and presumably knew the meaning and intentions of his words) it should have been he who answered the questions that I posed. I was seeking clarification on several points contained in the speech.

Unless Kernher now counts telepathy among her skills it's highly doubtful that she would be qualified to answer for the OP.


And this is why I have not answered the questions you posed to Legionnaire Ordo. Though your question about why we are not allowed in the core PIE itself was targeted more broadly.
Rorin Cutter
The Legion of Spoon
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
#15 - 2013-05-25 10:32:05 UTC
Hail Friends, and neighbors.

I apologize for missing this speech. For sure PIE has always been on the forefront of Loyalist cause.
And this makes me proud to be called a friend.

As is clearly seen in the Scriptures:

"In the beginning all things were as one.
God parted them and breathed life into his creation
Divided the parts and gave each its place
And unto each, bestowed purpose"
- The Scriptures, Book I 1:4

The place and purpose for Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris is on the Forefront of the fight to bring Gods words, and knowledge, as well as protect and expand the influence of the Empire!

Deus Fides Empire and the Curatores Veritatis Alliance salute you for your efforts! We will always be proud to call you Friend.

Rorin Cutter
Legatus legionis of Deus Fides Empire



To find out more about DFE visit: Home of DFE
Raphael Ordo
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#16 - 2013-05-25 10:35:49 UTC
Anabella Rella wrote:

That point aside, please tell me why I, a Matari whose ancestors you attempted to subjugate by force and failed, should willingly adopt your religion, traditions, culture etc. and forsake my own? I'm already part of something larger than myself that seeks to better my people and my nation but, not at the expense of others. Why would I want to be a slave to an Amarrian so that in several generations my descendants could possibly be freed to become second class citizens in a monolithic, theocratic, totalitarian empire?

I'm quite interested in your answers to these questions.


To this day, Minmatar identify themselves first and foremost through their clan. Each of the seven major tribes has a tribal leader; this person serves pretty much the same position as a president or a head of state for the tribes. The authority of the tribe leader is unquestioned within the tribe, but he has little or no power outside his tribe.
I see no difference in your accusations against the Amarrian Empire, than in your own urbanized tribal life, found on Matari.
In the distant past these clans constantly warred against each other.
The Amarr liberated the Minmatar race, bringing technology, faith and purpose with them.

It's not about casting aside ones own self, and subjugate ourselves to anything.
The main focus in my speech is also not to talk down any other race. As said, the Amarr may be the chosen. Us, born outside the Empire, may not have the same blessing as our chosen brethren. But we are as vast as they are. And through faith and pure will of true understanding of the cosmic fundamentals we all lean back unto.
I found this through deep adakul meditation and faith, combined. I did not have to "forsake" my own culture or traditions. We are what we are, and we, the Legionnaires, deeply acknowledge that. And through this - We can find peace, instead of hatred.

There is too much hatred all around us to begin with. Hatred between races, hatred between factions and hatred between individuals..
We are better than this. He made us better than this. His will was not for us to destroy ourselves.
God has given us this opportunity. This power of immortality. The power to aquire wisdom.
Wisdom and hatred does not combine well.

It all comes out clear, once you at least try to understand and embrace the truth.
I urge to to open your eyes, and see what is now, not what was before.

Katran Luftschreck wrote:
Sadly, PIE doesn't seem to share such enlightened views.


I can only urge you not to deal with this in absolutes. God didn't make this world solely in black and white.
Altough human expression tends to vary from place to place, know that your views are more shared than you already may know. Especially within the Praetoria.

May Darshan guide your path to God.
Rorin Cutter
The Legion of Spoon
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
#17 - 2013-05-25 12:11:57 UTC
Raphael Ordo wrote:
Anabella Rella wrote:

That point aside, please tell me why I, a Matari whose ancestors you attempted to subjugate by force and failed, should willingly adopt your religion, traditions, culture etc. and forsake my own? I'm already part of something larger than myself that seeks to better my people and my nation but, not at the expense of others. Why would I want to be a slave to an Amarrian so that in several generations my descendants could possibly be freed to become second class citizens in a monolithic, theocratic, totalitarian empire?

I'm quite interested in your answers to these questions.


To this day, Minmatar identify themselves first and foremost through their clan. Each of the seven major tribes has a tribal leader; this person serves pretty much the same position as a president or a head of state for the tribes. The authority of the tribe leader is unquestioned within the tribe, but he has little or no power outside his tribe.
I see no difference in your accusations against the Amarrian Empire, than in your own urbanized tribal life, found on Matari.
In the distant past these clans constantly warred against each other.
The Amarr liberated the Minmatar race, bringing technology, faith and purpose with them.

It's not about casting aside ones own self, and subjugate ourselves to anything.
The main focus in my speech is also not to talk down any other race. As said, the Amarr may be the chosen. Us, born outside the Empire, may not have the same blessing as our chosen brethren. But we are as vast as they are. And through faith and pure will of true understanding of the cosmic fundamentals we all lean back unto.
I found this through deep adakul meditation and faith, combined. I did not have to "forsake" my own culture or traditions. We are what we are, and we, the Legionnaires, deeply acknowledge that. And through this - We can find peace, instead of hatred.

There is too much hatred all around us to begin with. Hatred between races, hatred between factions and hatred between individuals..
We are better than this. He made us better than this. His will was not for us to destroy ourselves.
God has given us this opportunity. This power of immortality. The power to aquire wisdom.
Wisdom and hatred does not combine well.

It all comes out clear, once you at least try to understand and embrace the truth.
I urge to to open your eyes, and see what is now, not what was before.

Katran Luftschreck wrote:
Sadly, PIE doesn't seem to share such enlightened views.


I can only urge you not to deal with this in absolutes. God didn't make this world solely in black and white.
Altough human expression tends to vary from place to place, know that your views are more shared than you already may know. Especially within the Praetoria.

May Darshan guide your path to God.



May we agree to disagree, heh
God did indeed make everything and everything solely in black and white. But no worries, those that argue about "Gods Will" and what it could be, might be, or should be only need to read the scriptures. His will is there for all to see. There is no need to "soft sell" to non beleivers. They will be reclaimed, one way or another.

-Rorin
Cipher7
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#18 - 2013-05-25 12:19:46 UTC
Katran Luftschreck wrote:
Samira Kernher wrote:
We recognize our place. Our bloodlines must still prove themselves worthy of God, and so we are not equal. We simply have the humility to accept this, something that you in your stubborn pride will never understand.


And yet this is exactly why I would never join PIE. Yes, I admire their piety, loyalty and achievements... but I was raised to believe that the definition of Amarrian was anyone who believed in the Amarrian Faith and that all Amarrians are equal in the eyes of God, regardless of their heritage.

"That," my mother said, "is what separates us from those savages in the Republic. They talk about 'race' and 'bloodlines' but we know that it is what is in our souls that define who we truly are."

Sadly, PIE doesn't seem to share such enlightened views.


Ehehehe

Someone lied to you

You always will be "incomplete faith" because you're not "True Amarrian" but just a conquered person, if you were born Amarrian you would have "complete faith" and qualify for higher offices, better corps, etc.

Where you see races in the Republic? We're like 42 flavors of Quafe.

Talk to my Gallente mother and my half verokhior father.

I have more diversity in my body than you have in your whole empire.

Never in my life have I heard anything about "Where are your parents from, what bloodlines do you have etc." No one has ever asked me that. The elderly people in my town, they say "my son" or "my boy."

You know, many Matari might be financially poor but socially we are LIGHT YEARS ahead of everybody else, we are where your empire will be in another 10,000 years of social evolution.

The Gallente are close behind us, but they still have something to learn about "welcomin outsiders." Matari don't have "outsiders" we have clan brothers and sisters. Work together, fight together, eat together, ride and die together.

You Amarr are so hostile, you treat each other like dirt.
Cipher7
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#19 - 2013-05-25 12:20:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Cipher7
double post sorry
Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#20 - 2013-05-25 13:07:32 UTC
Samira Kernher wrote:


Only the Amarr are Chosen. This is written in Scripture. It is improper to believe that those of us who turned from God and had to be Reclaimed are equal to those who have never strayed.

The gates of Heaven are open only once. It is a great mercy that God has granted the rest of us a second chance at all.

We might all be faithful, but only the Amarr are God's Chosen, for they never strayed from His light.


It is interesting isn't it ? Are the True Amarr God's Chosen, or more broadly the greater Amarria ?

Political food for thought.
12Next page