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Woot, woot. Now even easier to get out of a war dec.

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LHA Tarawa
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#141 - 2013-05-14 21:53:12 UTC
Andski wrote:
LHA Tarawa wrote:
1) give you you what you want. Easy kills against an unskilled PvPer. I NEVER, EVER, EVER choose this option.


If they're so unskilled why aren't you killing them off mercilessly



I'm the unskilled PvPer that you want to kill.... DUH.
Andski
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#142 - 2013-05-14 21:54:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Andski
DarthNefarius wrote:
FW BUTTON ship orbiting losses where greater then Incursion ship losses last summer? Bullshite


Right, incursions are super risky and dangerous, which is why everyone flies 4b faction-fit machariels to farm them endlessly

They're safer than any other present PvE that even comes close to its rewards

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#143 - 2013-05-14 21:55:34 UTC
LHA Tarawa wrote:
Mara Villoso wrote:

Maybe what we should ask first is, what is hisec for? What does hisec mean? Why is it there at all? If all it means is a 30 minute delay before someone can start shooting you (as suggested in this thread), what is its point?


Agreed. This is the KEY point of this topic.


It is my opinion that high sec exists as a mechanism for CCP to attract people of various play styles to the game. The game mechanics have been created that allow me to play the way I want to play, mostly avoiding ship-to-ship PvP, if I so desire. I see the existence of high sec, NPC corps, CONCORD, etc. as proof that CCP wants to accommodate many different play styles.

This is reinforced to me by statements at fanfest and other locations, where they say they consider solo and casual play style to be perfectly legitimate, and in their eyes, just as valid as hard core ship-to-ship PvP play style.



If you are one of those players that thinks EVE is a a cold, harsh place, super dangerous, and only accommodates hard core ship-to-ship PvP play style, then why do you think high sec exists?

We'll agree to removing pvp from high-sec when you agree to removing all ISK-making ability from same.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
#144 - 2013-05-14 21:57:52 UTC
Andski wrote:
DarthNefarius wrote:
What abou all the risk in exploighting the system to create FW LP almost out of thin air buy market manipulation? I recall Goons crying & screaming when that exploight was shut down & ill gotten gains taken.


You mean the time that the speculators lost hundreds of billions of ISK that they initially set aside, from their own fortunes? Right, that didn't carry any risk at all!


Are you telling my Mynna's alot lost 100's of billions in ISK before market manipulation made it look that way? Or are you talking about the maiterials that were refunded back? Sure you got those numbers straight kiddo?
An' then Chicken@little.com, he come scramblin outta the    Terminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system's    crashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children'
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#145 - 2013-05-14 21:57:57 UTC
DarthNefarius wrote:


FW BUTTON ship orbiting losses where greater then Incursion ship losses last summer? Bullshite


Smartbombing battleships on lowsec gates alone would have taken out a far higher number than incursions have. Incusions are NPCs and its in high sec, its literally just an advanced mission that requires a gang.
LHA Tarawa
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#146 - 2013-05-14 21:58:24 UTC
rswfire wrote:
The second "E" in "Eve" is not capitalized.


Correct. All 3 letters in EVE are capitalized.

I'm not sure what Eve is. A character I guess? A corp name?



However, when typing PvP, PvE and EVE so many times, and they are so similar, many people typo and accidentally put EvE, instead of EVE.


DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
#147 - 2013-05-14 21:59:48 UTC
Andski wrote:
DarthNefarius wrote:
FW BUTTON ship orbiting losses where greater then Incursion ship losses last summer? Bullshite


Right, incursions are super risky and dangerous, which is why everyone flies 4b faction-fit machariels to farm them endlessly

They're safer than any other present PvE that even comes close to its rewards


And there never are 4 billion ISK Incursion MACs that die? BS there is risk in sites & more risk then getting ganked flying from incursion to incursion.
An' then Chicken@little.com, he come scramblin outta the    Terminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system's    crashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children'
Andski
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#148 - 2013-05-14 22:00:06 UTC
DarthNefarius wrote:
Are you telling my Mynna's alot lost 100's of billions in ISK before market manipulation made it look that way? Or are you talking about the maiterials that were refunded back? Sure you got those numbers straight kiddo?


They were not given back what they invested into the scheme, they were given back some unrelated miscellany that was mistakenly taken away.

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Julius Priscus
#149 - 2013-05-14 22:01:38 UTC
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
LHA Tarawa wrote:
Mara Villoso wrote:

Maybe what we should ask first is, what is hisec for? What does hisec mean? Why is it there at all? If all it means is a 30 minute delay before someone can start shooting you (as suggested in this thread), what is its point?


Agreed. This is the KEY point of this topic.


It is my opinion that high sec exists as a mechanism for CCP to attract people of various play styles to the game. The game mechanics have been created that allow me to play the way I want to play, mostly avoiding ship-to-ship PvP, if I so desire. I see the existence of high sec, NPC corps, CONCORD, etc. as proof that CCP wants to accommodate many different play styles.

This is reinforced to me by statements at fanfest and other locations, where they say they consider solo and casual play style to be perfectly legitimate, and in their eyes, just as valid as hard core ship-to-ship PvP play style.



If you are one of those players that thinks EVE is a a cold, harsh place, super dangerous, and only accommodates hard core ship-to-ship PvP play style, then why do you think high sec exists?

We'll agree to removing pvp from high-sec when you agree to removing all ISK-making ability from same.



is there still a 24 hour timer for war decs?

if so CCP should remove them so war decs are instant, for the next expansion to offset the insta leaving corps in EVE..
LHA Tarawa
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#150 - 2013-05-14 22:01:40 UTC
Destiny Corrupted wrote:

We'll agree to removing pvp from high-sec when you agree to removing all ISK-making ability from same.


1) Who said anything about removing all PvP from high sec? If two groups want to fight in high sec, have at it boys.

2) As for removing all ISK making potential from high sec... well... first you'd have to get CCP to agree to a massive revenue cut that would likely put them out of business. Good luck with that proposal.
Andski
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#151 - 2013-05-14 22:01:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Andski
DarthNefarius wrote:
And there never are 4 billion ISK Incursion MACs that die? BS there is risk in sites & more risk then getting ganked flying from incursion to incursion.


I apologize that some incursion runners can't figure out how to get their shiny mods into a double-wrapped package, but that doesn't make incursion running risky. If it was truly risky, those 4bn machs would be much, much less common.

But don't worry, thought will probably be even more optional in the future so you don't have to worry about the big bad PvPers taking away your republic fleet gyrostabs and a-type invulns.

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Danni stark
#152 - 2013-05-14 22:02:48 UTC
Iudicium Vastus wrote:
Andski wrote:
Vincent Athena wrote:
If you change the rules about NPC corps and wars, the player will play a different game for the duration of the war.

Bottom line: You cannot force someone to log in. For many players PvP combat is a big pile of stress they just do not want in their life, much less in a recreational activity, and they will avoid it.


Hopefully you and them can find a game that better caters to your desire for risk-free gameplay with no consequences for your choices.


Sandbox sweetie. I always wonder why people treat one method of play as the single only legit and ruling style while others are invalid.
PvP'ing/Dec is someone's playstyle, while avoiding a wardec is also just another playstyle.


except not logging in as a method of avoiding a war dec isn't a playstyle since you're not playing the game.
otherwise you might have a point.

Ice Mining Skill Plan.
LHA Tarawa
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#153 - 2013-05-14 22:03:14 UTC
Julius Priscus wrote:

is there still a 24 hour timer for war decs?

if so CCP should remove them so war decs are instant, for the next expansion to offset the insta leaving corps in EVE..


Yes, there is still a 24 hour timer.

Result of removing the timer would be that all carebears would quit, CCP would suffer a massive revenue drop, and they'd be bankrupt. I kind o' doubt that is their plan.
EI Digin
irc.zulusquad.org
#154 - 2013-05-14 22:03:20 UTC
With the upcoming changes to make highsec more competitive and to make wardec evasion even more trivial it's going to be a lot more difficult to justify being able to discard wars at your leisure.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#155 - 2013-05-14 22:05:33 UTC
Andski wrote:

But don't worry, thought will probably be even more optional in the future so you don't have to worry about the big bad PvPers taking away your republic fleet gyrostabs and a-type invulns.


Maybe.






Maybe not.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Andski
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#156 - 2013-05-14 22:06:49 UTC
LHA Tarawa wrote:
Yes, there is still a 24 hour timer.

Result of removing the timer would be that all carebears would quit, CCP would suffer a massive revenue drop, and they'd be bankrupt. I kind o' doubt that is their plan.


Just like all the carebears quit and CCP went bankrupt when suicide ganking was more prevalent, when reforming corps to evade wars was considered an exploit and when groups like Privateers could have like 300 wardecs at once without the cost going up at all

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Iudicium Vastus
Doomheim
#157 - 2013-05-14 22:08:07 UTC
LHA Tarawa wrote:
Julius Priscus wrote:

is there still a 24 hour timer for war decs?

if so CCP should remove them so war decs are instant, for the next expansion to offset the insta leaving corps in EVE..


Yes, there is still a 24 hour timer.

Result of removing the timer would be that all carebears would quit, CCP would suffer a massive revenue drop, and they'd be bankrupt. I kind o' doubt that is their plan.


Besides, even as it currently stands, I believe joining the aggressing corp in-space, in front of a soon-to-be-WT just to get a instajump on them is already considered exploit. Wars starting too soon (less than 24hours) would just make this type of scenario more widespread. Turning non-WT into WT in space in just moments.

[u]Nerf stabs/cloaks in FW?[/u] No, just.. -Fit more points -Fit faction points -Bring a friend or two with points (an alt is fine too)
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#158 - 2013-05-14 22:09:17 UTC
LHA Tarawa wrote:
Destiny Corrupted wrote:

We'll agree to removing pvp from high-sec when you agree to removing all ISK-making ability from same.


1) Who said anything about removing all PvP from high sec? If two groups want to fight in high sec, have at it boys.

2) As for removing all ISK making potential from high sec... well... first you'd have to get CCP to agree to a massive revenue cut that would likely put them out of business. Good luck with that proposal.

1. You can't cherry pick gameplay like that. If you're allowed to grind money, put up towers, et cetera et cetera, you should be exposed to the risk of competing parties being able to take it away from you by force. This game's economy will collapse in on itself if everyone is able to barf money in high-sec without any risk whatsoever.

2. I never said that's what I actually want. What I want is to be able to go after people who make money, in order to make that money my own. This want fits in very well with the whole player-driven theme EVE possesses.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted
Praetor Meles
Black Mount Industrial
Breakpoint.
#159 - 2013-05-14 22:10:10 UTC
Popcorn refill required.

Also, winter expansion to include the eagerly awaited "logging on" patch. No matter where you are in the world, CCP goons will kick down your door and drag you to a laptop as soon as you are wardecced.

[insert random rubbish that irritates you personally] is further evidence that Eve is dying/thriving*

  • delete as required to make your point
LHA Tarawa
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#160 - 2013-05-14 22:10:20 UTC
Andski wrote:
LHA Tarawa wrote:
Yes, there is still a 24 hour timer.

Result of removing the timer would be that all carebears would quit, CCP would suffer a massive revenue drop, and they'd be bankrupt. I kind o' doubt that is their plan.


Just like all the carebears quit and CCP went bankrupt when suicide ganking was more prevalent, when reforming corps to evade wars was considered an exploit and when groups like Privateers could have like 300 wardecs at once without the cost going up at all



More players now, or then?

CCP further in debt now, after dropping gazillions into Dust, or then?

NPC corps then?


AND, more specifically, on point.... there was no war dec timer then? You could issue a war dec, and immediately start shooting other players?

That must have been long before I started playing.