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So I was an idiot and started a duel (enjoy my sweet sweet tears)
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Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#41 - 2013-05-12 20:43:52 UTC
Why do we not need a warning? Because we already have safeties. But it's okay, let's continue sliding down that slippery slope. The game will be better, you guys!

Coming in 2014 to en EVE near you: dueling insurance. Just pay a PLEX, and any ships you lose in duels will be immediately respawned at the closest station. We'll have ladders and leaderboards and everything!

Oh, and of course, the war declaration mechanic will be removed entirely. Due to, uh, "code" stuff.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted
Illini Vaille
Doomheim
#42 - 2013-05-12 21:08:29 UTC
In the green security thing mode, it should issue a warning. In the yellow and red ones, it should not.
Charlie Jacobson
#43 - 2013-05-12 21:20:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Charlie Jacobson
18th century pistol duels often resulted in death. Those guys didn't have the luxury of respawning in a fresh clone. HTFU


Xen Solarus wrote:
Came expecting to see epic implant losses.

Left disapointed.


Also this^

I support James 315 and the New Order of Highsec
Sentamon
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#44 - 2013-05-12 21:42:46 UTC
If people think a warning will help, or stop the complaints from, lezy people that don't do one bit of research themselves, you've got a surprise coming.

~ Professional Forum Alt  ~
Private Pineapple
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#45 - 2013-05-12 21:53:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Private Pineapple
baltec1 wrote:
Private Pineapple wrote:


And? What exactly is the issue with putting in a small clarification to duel requests? Are you really arguing against putting in a simple "Podding is also allowed in this." clarification just so there's at least some text to prevent further confusion? If so, why? Simply saying "this is common sense" is not reason enough to withhold useful clarifications. I am genuinely curious why you are arguing against such a clarification. It does not hurt you and benefits other people who have a different thought process than you do and do not really follow up on other things like you do.


People have been getting podded in high sec for the last decade. We dont need a wall of text that nobody will read to tell us that sitting in your pod after a fight is a very bad idea.

Its simply not needed.


edit: better response coming

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Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#46 - 2013-05-12 21:56:22 UTC
Charlie Jacobson wrote:
18th century pistol duels often resulted in death.

From infection though.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#47 - 2013-05-12 21:59:56 UTC
Private Pineapple wrote:

Yes, but typically with consequences which people are fine with. But.. wall of text? You already get a wall of text / dialog box when you receive a duel request. One more line magically makes it a wall of text?


Nobody reads it to start with, adding even more will do nothing.

The info is already out there and has been for months before retribution even hit sisi. Its a pointless waste of time.
Jayrendo Karr
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#48 - 2013-05-12 22:07:43 UTC
This topic is not about removing podding from duels, it's about the fact that there is no confirmation message to ensure that you chose correctly. I've been issued challenges right after undocking, I would hate to think I have to lose my ship because I might mistake it for some other pop-up.
Private Pineapple
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#49 - 2013-05-12 22:16:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Private Pineapple
baltec1 wrote:
Private Pineapple wrote:

Yes, but typically with consequences which people are fine with. But.. wall of text? You already get a wall of text / dialog box when you receive a duel request. One more line magically makes it a wall of text?


Nobody reads it to start with, adding even more will do nothing.

The info is already out there and has been for months before retribution even hit sisi. Its a pointless waste of time.


Many people read the dialog box. Just because you do not does not mean many other people do not.

Anyways, an easy image as to what I am talking about is here: image

You are arguing against something that does not harm you and takes only a CCP intern all of two minutes to put in?

However, you need to realize I am not arguing for the OP. I am arguing for the dialog box to explain just one thing about Limited Engagements that would have been guessed otherwise. The OP is asking for a confirmation box for those ISSUING the duel request. Which is not a unreasonable request at all and would take around 15-30 minutes to do. I only put out those numbers because I work in the software industry and have worked with many systems while having my share of those small, tedious tasks (small text edits and dialog box additions included).

.
Lady Areola Fappington
#50 - 2013-05-12 22:17:18 UTC
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Why do we not need a warning? Because we already have safeties. But it's okay, let's continue sliding down that slippery slope. The game will be better, you guys!

Coming in 2014 to en EVE near you: dueling insurance. Just pay a PLEX, and any ships you lose in duels will be immediately respawned at the closest station. We'll have ladders and leaderboards and everything!

Oh, and of course, the war declaration mechanic will be removed entirely. Due to, uh, "code" stuff.


Even better idea! Your ship explodes, but becomes unlootable. So long as you get back to it in your (unpoppable) pod, you can repair it and hop back in!

We can offset how OP that would be by causing some module damage that you need to dock up to fix.

All for one extra PLEX a month. Think of the extra subs and $$$ CCP would get!




Ohh, also, I propose that anyone under 2.5mil SP be immune to PVP unless they choose to engage. Yaknow, for the newbies.

7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided. --Eve New Player Guide
Private Pineapple
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#51 - 2013-05-12 22:21:13 UTC
Lady Areola Fappington wrote:
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Why do we not need a warning? Because we already have safeties. But it's okay, let's continue sliding down that slippery slope. The game will be better, you guys!

Coming in 2014 to en EVE near you: dueling insurance. Just pay a PLEX, and any ships you lose in duels will be immediately respawned at the closest station. We'll have ladders and leaderboards and everything!

Oh, and of course, the war declaration mechanic will be removed entirely. Due to, uh, "code" stuff.


Even better idea! Your ship explodes, but becomes unlootable. So long as you get back to it in your (unpoppable) pod, you can repair it and hop back in!

We can offset how OP that would be by causing some module damage that you need to dock up to fix.

All for one extra PLEX a month. Think of the extra subs and $$$ CCP would get!




Ohh, also, I propose that anyone under 2.5mil SP be immune to PVP unless they choose to engage. Yaknow, for the newbies.


You really are failing even at a strawman argument as nothing we have said imply anything you just said. So basically you are pulling these words out of your ass.

.
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#52 - 2013-05-12 22:24:44 UTC
Private Pineapple wrote:
You really are failing even at a strawman argument as nothing we have said imply anything you just said. So basically you are pulling these words out of your ass.

We're pulling these words out of a decade-long experience with this game and the direction its development is heading in.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted
Jayrendo Karr
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#53 - 2013-05-12 22:27:34 UTC
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Private Pineapple wrote:
You really are failing even at a strawman argument as nothing we have said imply anything you just said. So basically you are pulling these words out of your ass.

We're pulling these words out of a decade-long experience with this game and the direction its development is heading in.

Once you challenge someone, your fate is in their hands. There are warnings before you enter lowsec that say "hey you're entering losec, you can be killed. Do you wish to continue?" Why not with duels?
Lady Areola Fappington
#54 - 2013-05-12 22:28:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Lady Areola Fappington
Private Pineapple wrote:

You really are failing even at a strawman argument as nothing we have said imply anything you just said. So basically you are pulling these words out of your ass.



Actually, I'm not even trying to make an argument. I'm mocking people who didn't realize they were playing EVE. You know, hard cold game where your day can be ruined....

If you need a special dialogue box warning you that your pod can be popped when engaging in combat, well...

7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided. --Eve New Player Guide
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#55 - 2013-05-12 22:31:08 UTC
Jayrendo Karr wrote:
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Private Pineapple wrote:
You really are failing even at a strawman argument as nothing we have said imply anything you just said. So basically you are pulling these words out of your ass.

We're pulling these words out of a decade-long experience with this game and the direction its development is heading in.

Once you challenge someone, your fate is in their hands. There are warnings before you enter lowsec that say "hey you're entering losec, you can be killed. Do you wish to continue?" Why not with duels?

Because reacting to a glove slap is somewhat different from crossing the street.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#56 - 2013-05-12 22:31:25 UTC
Private Pineapple wrote:


Many people read the dialog box. Just because you do not does not mean many other people do not.

Anyways, an easy image as to what I am talking about is here: image

You are arguing against something that does not harm you and takes only a CCP intern all of two minutes to put in?



It already tells you that the fight is a limited engagement and that concord will not get involved. If people stick around in their pod and get whacked its their own daft fault.
Jame Jarl Retief
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#57 - 2013-05-12 22:36:24 UTC
Welcome to EVE. This game has rules within rules within rules, and some of those rules are exceptions, and some of those exceptions are exceptions themselves, and some of those aren't even rules, just more like general guidelines, assuming the server behaves and logs show something.
Private Pineapple
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#58 - 2013-05-12 22:40:22 UTC
Lady Areola Fappington wrote:
Private Pineapple wrote:

You really are failing even at a strawman argument as nothing we have said imply anything you just said. So basically you are pulling these words out of your ass.



Actually, I'm not even trying to make an argument. I'm mocking people who didn't realize they were playing EVE. You know, hard cold game where your day can be ruined....

If you need a special dialogue box warning you that your pod can be popped when engaging in combat, well...


Actually, I understand your side. I do and I am part of it all of the time, but the reality is that your side is irrelevant in this case. There are many other dialog boxes that prevent people from making a bad decision without being informed first. For example, there's the dialog box when you are making a buy order that is way beyond the regional average or when you're buying at a price that is way beyond the regional average. There's also the dialog box for anyone who enters lowsec for the first time ever.

To be consistent, a small clarification should be added as to what a Limited Engagement could entail (in this case, podkilling) that way EVE isn't an "uninformative game" that it used to be, and still is in some ways. Again, to be consistent, a dialog box should be added for those who want to confirm their duel request. Someone could click it by accident...

baltec1 wrote:
Private Pineapple wrote:


Many people read the dialog box. Just because you do not does not mean many other people do not.

Anyways, an easy image as to what I am talking about is here: image

You are arguing against something that does not harm you and takes only a CCP intern all of two minutes to put in?



It already tells you that the fight is a limited engagement and that concord will not get involved. If people stick around in their pod and get whacked its their own daft fault.


Did you not read the text in between the two pictures? It is unintuitive that Concord would still not get involved even in pod killing. Anyways, are you still complaining about the tiny modification that will not change your playstyle at all? Absolutely no change to you at all? Seems strange.

.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#59 - 2013-05-12 22:44:50 UTC
Private Pineapple wrote:


Did you not read the text in between the two pictures? It is unintuitive that Concord would still not get involved even in pod killing. Anyways, are you still complaining about the tiny modification that will not change your playstyle at all? Absolutely no change to you at all? Seems strange.


No concord protection means no concord protection. You are literally given 2 warnings, a third is simply not needed.

Dev time, no matter how little should not be wasted on things that do not require fixing.
Private Pineapple
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#60 - 2013-05-12 22:47:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Private Pineapple
baltec1 wrote:
Private Pineapple wrote:


Did you not read the text in between the two pictures? It is unintuitive that Concord would still not get involved even in pod killing. Anyways, are you still complaining about the tiny modification that will not change your playstyle at all? Absolutely no change to you at all? Seems strange.


No concord protection means no concord protection. You are literally given 2 warnings, a third is simply not needed.

Dev time, no matter how little should not be wasted on things that do not require fixing.


There is only one warning. The dialog box is the only one I know of. But either ways, my modification does not add any warnings at all*. It adds information to let the user make better decisions as to what he wants to do.

As for you saying it does not require fixing... well... from the list of logical fallacies:

Quote:
Appeal to Tradition: (also "If it ain't broke, don't fix it"). The fallacy that a standpoint, situation or action is right, proper and correct simply because it has "always" been that way, because people have "always" thought that way, or because it continues to serve one particular group very well.. A corrupted argument from ethos (that of past generations). (E.g., "In America, women have always been paid less, so let's not mess with long-standing tradition."). The reverse of this is yet another fallacy, the "Appeal to Innovation," e.g., "It's NEW, and [therefore it must be] improved!"


*I am against any second/third warnings, by the way - in OP's case there is no warning for issuing a duel request ... there should be one. There is a warning dialog box for ejecting your ship, there should also be one for issuing a duel request. Consistency, plain and simple.

.