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Clarification on Electus Matari actions in Federation space today

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Gosakumori Noh
Coven of One
#81 - 2013-05-09 14:33:05 UTC
Halete wrote:
Gosakumori Noh wrote:
Vagary.


No, child. Wrong still! Now act not so supercilious whilst flaunting such a grasping understanding of our late Ray of Matar.



A brave face under the pretty ink, but the messianic pattern could scarcely have been clearer, returning us to: poor Midular, a religious leader born to a civilization too hopelessly superficial to know what that means.
Halete
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#82 - 2013-05-09 15:37:50 UTC
I see perfectly what you are trying to illustrate, but I still disagree with why you are saying it. You are caught up in another of your strange fantasies, my love.

We will then agree, at least, that the Republic is superficial.

"To know the true path, but yet, to never follow it. That is possibly the gravest sin" - The Scriptures, Book of Missions 13:21
Liuni Kalthis
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#83 - 2013-05-09 20:15:22 UTC
I leave for about a week and it seems space is exploding all around us. With one fleet gone, I just hope the Amarr don't get any wise ideas.
Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#84 - 2013-05-10 11:34:32 UTC
Del Vikus wrote:
Our "religion" does not back us into a corner with dogmatism and the insane droolings of prophets. Our shamans -- of which Ava is an honoured member -- give us advice and guidance, but do not rule over us in the tyrannical way the citizens of the Empire seem to crave.


The Voluval looks perfectly like spiritual, dogmatic tyranny to me. To my eyes, it is mostly a petty matter of pots and kettles here.
Andreus Ixiris
Duty.
Stay Feral
#85 - 2013-05-10 13:35:02 UTC
Liuni Kalthis wrote:
I leave for about a week and it seems space is exploding all around us. With one fleet gone, I just hope the Amarr don't get any wise ideas.

It was fifteen Naglfars. As much as I grieve the pointless loss of life the destruction of those fifteen dreadnoughts incurred, it's not like the Minmatar lost anything close to causing a serious dent in their numbers. I'm fairly certain that either Electus Matari or Re-Awakened Technologies could, in a pinch, manufacture suitable replacements if the Republic Fleet desperately needed them.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient
Electus Matari
#86 - 2013-05-10 13:36:01 UTC
At the risk of revealing some intel on our operational capacity: yes, we could.
Caellach Marellus
Stormcrows
#87 - 2013-05-10 13:37:55 UTC
The loss of physical ships is irrelevant.

The pointless loss of good men and women however, can you rebuild them? No.

When your gut instincts tell you something is wrong, trust them. When your heart tells you something is right, ignore it, check with your brain first. Accept nothing, challenge everything.
Andreus Ixiris
Duty.
Stay Feral
#88 - 2013-05-10 13:39:24 UTC
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:
At the risk of revealing some intel on our operational capacity: yes, we could.

I hardly think that's new intel - I, along with a large section of the IGS, have been aware (and depending on the person, either respectful or deeply envious) of EM's formidable industrial base for years.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.
Rodj Blake
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#89 - 2013-05-10 21:36:20 UTC
An illegal order is one which does not need to be obeyed.

This is something that the Electus Matari chose to ignore.

Dolce et decorum est pro Imperium mori
Nick Bete
Highsec Haulers Inc.
#90 - 2013-05-10 22:18:51 UTC
Lyn Farel wrote:

The Voluval looks perfectly like spiritual, dogmatic tyranny to me. To my eyes, it is mostly a petty matter of pots and kettles here.


You really don't have a clue, do you? What's tyrannical about the Voluval? Please enlighten us.

You should quit pretending to be some kind of rational voice and wear your bias towards the Empire proudly. You're not fooling anyone. Those who regularly read your little snipes understands and personal attacks know differently.
Nick Bete
Highsec Haulers Inc.
#91 - 2013-05-10 22:22:37 UTC
Rodj Blake wrote:
An illegal order is one which does not need to be obeyed.

This is something that the Electus Matari chose to ignore.


So you'll be disobeying orders from your authorities if you feel them to be illegal then Blake? Oh wait, that can't happen in your Empire since all orders come from your god and are vetted by the Theology Council, right? Roll
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#92 - 2013-05-10 22:29:31 UTC
Just because the radicals on your side act like idiots doesn't mean you have to follow them to their moronic behavior. Leave the "I blindly follow orders" to the fascists and religious zealots in the Caldari State and Amarr Empire.

Just because the FIO and elements in the Minmatar Republic are acting like idiots doesn't mean we have to.

Also, I am encouraged that several Caldari and Amarr supporters in here are wearing JUSTK T-Shirts. Your admiration for our corporation is touching, and maybe someday you will concede that freedom and democracy are superior to religious zealotry and corporate fascism.

o/
Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#93 - 2013-05-10 22:43:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Lyn Farel
Nick Bete wrote:
Lyn Farel wrote:

The Voluval looks perfectly like spiritual, dogmatic tyranny to me. To my eyes, it is mostly a petty matter of pots and kettles here.


You really don't have a clue, do you? What's tyrannical about the Voluval? Please enlighten us.

You should quit pretending to be some kind of rational voice and wear your bias towards the Empire proudly. You're not fooling anyone. Those who regularly read your little snipes understands and personal attacks know differently.


You only see what you want to see. Maybe should you read closer then? I may not have had arguments with a lot of Amarrians in the recent times, but that does not mean that I never had. You can ask to PIE Inc, or even lady Vitalia who provoked me into a duel for my position, once, if you are not convinced. Or just read my more recent answers on the subject of slavery in the Khanid Kingdom, or on Merimeth Serum recent moves.

As for the Voluval, some might say that letting marks dictate, or at least, point the way to go for a living is pretty tyrannical. It is, a point of view, not an absolute truth, but a valid point of view nonetheless.

And, if you are not convinced by the validity of the point of view, maybe you should pay a visit to Vo'Shun on Arzad / Starkmanir Prime, or to the various tongue-mutilated or exiled unfortunate individuals of the lottery, someday.
Gosakumori Noh
Coven of One
#94 - 2013-05-10 23:32:52 UTC
Lyn Farel wrote:
Nick Bete wrote:
Lyn Farel wrote:

The Voluval looks perfectly like spiritual, dogmatic tyranny to me. To my eyes, it is mostly a petty matter of pots and kettles here.


You really don't have a clue, do you? What's tyrannical about the Voluval? Please enlighten us.

You should quit pretending to be some kind of rational voice and wear your bias towards the Empire proudly. You're not fooling anyone. Those who regularly read your little snipes understands and personal attacks know differently.


As for the Voluval, some might say that letting marks dictate, or at least, point the way to go for a living is pretty tyrannical.


Some might say that it is a spirituality as deep as ink on pretty faces: an empty little ritual for empty little minds.
Caellach Marellus
Stormcrows
#95 - 2013-05-10 23:52:10 UTC
Nick Bete wrote:
Lyn Farel wrote:

The Voluval looks perfectly like spiritual, dogmatic tyranny to me. To my eyes, it is mostly a petty matter of pots and kettles here.


You really don't have a clue, do you? What's tyrannical about the Voluval? Please enlighten us.

You should quit pretending to be some kind of rational voice and wear your bias towards the Empire proudly. You're not fooling anyone. Those who regularly read your little snipes understands and personal attacks know differently.


Your constant obsession with Miss Farel's posting is starting to border stalker level creepiness.

Would help if you were actually right in your comments though.

When your gut instincts tell you something is wrong, trust them. When your heart tells you something is right, ignore it, check with your brain first. Accept nothing, challenge everything.
Rodj Blake
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#96 - 2013-05-11 07:34:49 UTC
Nick Bete wrote:
Lyn Farel wrote:

The Voluval looks perfectly like spiritual, dogmatic tyranny to me. To my eyes, it is mostly a petty matter of pots and kettles here.


You really don't have a clue, do you? What's tyrannical about the Voluval? Please enlighten us.


The way it leads to mutilation, exile and worse doesn't exactly make it a shining beacon of freedom.

Dolce et decorum est pro Imperium mori
Rodj Blake
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#97 - 2013-05-11 07:37:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Rodj Blake
Nick Bete wrote:
Rodj Blake wrote:
An illegal order is one which does not need to be obeyed.

This is something that the Electus Matari chose to ignore.


So you'll be disobeying orders from your authorities if you feel them to be illegal then Blake? Oh wait, that can't happen in your Empire since all orders come from your god and are vetted by the Theology Council, right? Roll


I ask you to cast your mind back several years to when fleets led by myself assisted in the bringing to justice of an Imperial heir who had issued illegal orders to his forces.

You see, the Empire has a complex system of checks and balances to ensure that it's difficult for people to overstep their authority, and when they do they are chastised accordingly.

This is different to the Republic, which is increasingly adopting a system of "What Shakor says, goes"

Dolce et decorum est pro Imperium mori
Laerise
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#98 - 2013-05-11 07:50:32 UTC
Rodj Blake wrote:
Nick Bete wrote:
Rodj Blake wrote:
An illegal order is one which does not need to be obeyed.

This is something that the Electus Matari chose to ignore.


So you'll be disobeying orders from your authorities if you feel them to be illegal then Blake? Oh wait, that can't happen in your Empire since all orders come from your god and are vetted by the Theology Council, right? Roll


I ask you to cast your mind back several years to when fleets led by myself assisted in the bringing to justice of an Imperial heir who had issued illegal orders to his forces.


I was there.

God's empire does not tollerate illegal orders and deals with them in a descisive and swift manner, this has been shown by the reverred brother Joshua.
Rodj Blake
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#99 - 2013-05-11 07:55:55 UTC
Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:
At the risk of revealing some intel on our operational capacity: yes, we could.


Will you use some of that operational capacity to replace Federal losses and provide compensation to the victims of your illegal aggression?

Dolce et decorum est pro Imperium mori
Katarina Musana
Clan Leshya Offworld Venture Enterprise
#100 - 2013-05-11 11:11:35 UTC
Gosakumori Noh wrote:

On to the sublime:

Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:
I voice my disagreement with the Federal decisions, but if it is my call, I will not start a war over them.


and

Elsebeth Rhiannon wrote:
I made a choice to follow the chain of command


Emphasis in the original oh dear Heavens it doesn't get better than that... all right, three of my Sebboi Plushies are better than that, but just barely. Tears of joy.


You do realize those two statements are not actually contradictory, right? Ms. Rhiannon did not choose to start a war over anything. If the events of that day do start a war, it will be because of actions that took place before Ms. Rhiannon's fleet acted, and would happen regardless of what Ms. Rhiannon's fleet did. The initial volley, the volley that would be the trigger that starts a war if one erupts from the events of that day, was fired by the Naglfar fleet, not by Ms. Rhiannon's fleet. That call was not Ms. Rhiannon's.



Quote:
On to poor Witch Midular:

As James pointed out elsewhere more politely, in life, the Matari "civilization" reviled her for being a woman of peace.


Not for being a woman of peace. For appearing to be simply trying to appease the Amarr Empire. At the time, I hated Midular. I saw her as a collaborator. I didn't understand what she was doing. In more recent time, I began to understand, though I still don't agree with all of it, and I respect her.

i would try to explain more, but it seems rather obvious you refuse to comprehend.