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Contentions with Odyssey Expansion Proposals

Author
Kenshi Hanshin
WinterFel
RAZOR Alliance
#1 - 2013-04-25 18:51:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Kenshi Hanshin
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=223607
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=223611&find=unread
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=223608&find=unread
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=223610&find=unread
__________________________________________________________

There is much feedback and founded critic in both the Amarr and Caldari threads. All of the feedback has been brushed off with insulting and demeaning attitude by CCP Rise. Which is in violation of the respect clause of the EULA and common sense understanding of PR. Furthermore, he has ignored or dismissed concerns raised in both Minmatar and Gallente forums.

As these concerns were raised in the appropriate forums yet were ignored, I am escalating our complaints as a community.

In short, CCP Rise and to a lesser extent CCP Fozzie, are both hurting the game. As well as grossly and irresponsibly forcing their opinions into the game without regards to the player base. Below is a summary of the complaints I recall. If I missed any please add them!

Devs, you are not allowed to post any remarks till the list is complete. Any remarks by Devs must be respectful and demonstrate effort of understanding and action to fix issues raised. Any smart ass remarks such as:

"CCP Rise" wrote:
Closing the gap between new players and old players in some areas is definitely positive. If you notice that EVE gets to a point where you would rather have less ISK and SP let me know, we'll fix it asap.
will not be tolerated. [ https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2923417#post2923417 ]

Summary:

Amarr:

1) Abbadon needs the 5% resistance/level bonus due to the "Alpha Fleet Doctrines". Not that it matter much there anyway with hundreds of ships shooting you in the face. But at least it may just cause enough of a difference for logistics to save you.

2) Apocalypse is the iconic Amarr laser sniping BS. Yet it is unable to fit nor use Tachyon lasers (1400mm Arty & 425mm equivalents). If you do manage to fit them you have to choose between firing guns or tanking or not having a tank. This is unacceptable.

3) According to the original dev blogs (source in Amarr BS thread link) the Armaggedon was not to be changed. Yet now it losses the cap bonus to lasers. Becomes a "drone boat" and a mini Bhaalgorn. There community's disgust has been beat to death and necromancy applied with regards to this.

4) Laser's cap use is prohibitive and causes many of the existing issues with Amarr ships. Cap use is 3-3.5x the cap use of the equivalent hybrid weapon. The issue is especially noticeable with regards to beam lasers.

5) Laser powergrid requirements are also too draconian to allow their fitting to AMARR ships that are supposed to use them.

Caldari:

1) Missile mechanics need work to make them viable against turrets. There are numerous ideas suggested by players.

2) The Raven had no tank to begin with. The proposed Raven has less tank than any other BS other than the Scorpion!

3) The Scorpion is crap! As the ECM mechanic is broken! Fix that before making blanket changes to that ship. Better yet give the Caldari pilots a useful combat battleship. As the only useful PvP Caldari battleship is the Rokh.

Minmatar:

1) Their sig radius is much to small compared to their 'equivalents' of the other three races.

Gallente:

1) Hyperion proposed is and will be completely OP compared to the competition.

2) The dominix change was nice and that is the only one I liked.

Fellow pilots please add to list if I missed anything!
Dr Minx
J A V A
#2 - 2013-04-25 19:52:54 UTC
in before lock

i think ccp rise is one of the best appointments ccp have made
sabre906
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2013-04-25 20:39:30 UTC
Dr Minx wrote:
in before lock

i think ccp rise is one of the best appointments ccp have made


It actually follows an old CCP pattern of doing things because of "hey, it'd be interesting if we do this..." instead of attempting to responsibly balancing.

The new geddon is a prime example. Geddon is one of the few perfectly balanced boats out there. Yet CCP Rise choose to remove it, and introduce a new neut boat that has extreme potential to be game breaking. Why not just introduce a new model for your new toy, instead of breaking what's working for a whimsical experiment?
Kenshi Hanshin
WinterFel
RAZOR Alliance
#4 - 2013-04-25 20:56:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Kenshi Hanshin
Dr Minx wrote:
in before lock

i think ccp rise is one of the best appointments ccp have made


I value and respect your point of view. Yes, he had done excellent work in the previous two expansions. Yet, his present behavior and arrogance is and will be detrimental to the game we all enjoy. That is what I personally want to bring to the attention of CSM and CCP. If the age of your character is any indication, you have only just started your Eve journey. Which may be part of the reason for what I think is your incomplete view of the present issue.

He seems to have forgotten that when you ask for feedback you read, understand and analyze it. There are many great and valid points and concerns that were raised. Yet, in his replies he essentially said "f*ck you! I will do what I want anyway cause I am CCP and am always right." Which indicates that he doesn't understand an important concept in business: don't belittle your customers!

In a business such as this, it is paramount to maintain a healthy relationship of communication and action between customers and provider. This was done in the past. Yet, if a provider asks for feedback and then ignores or belittles the customer; problems arise. Potentially those problems could result in the end of a company.

CCP is a fairly good company compared to many of its 'competitors'. Blizzard and EA would be prime examples of jerk companies. I do not think that as a whole CCP wants to ruin the game that is Eve Online. I do understand that they want a better retention of newer players. Which is fine! I have no issue with that per-se. However, it has to be done in a way that doesn't cheapen the achievements of older players.

The same would go with regards to game mechanics. The game is best when there is a delicate but crucial balance between the ships and systems. There shouldn't be one ship that can lord over all the competition. Nor should a particular ship make such a drastic departure from the roots and lore of the flying race. For example, the Gallente are drone-masters. As such they should and do have the best drone boats in the game. Amarr are known for their armor-tanking and lasers. Caldari are known for their advanced shield, missile and electronic warfare capabilities. Minmatar are known for their ability to tank armor or shield but use versatile projectile turrets. These are the characteristics and the ideologies of the races that must be preserved in their ships.

If you want to fly drones. You specialized in Gallente. If you wanted to use lasers you specialize Amarr. If you want missiles, Caldari. If you want the versatility of projectile guns, Minmatar. The amarr and gallante are the two largest and imperialistic empires, opposed ideologically. Amarr are a religious and totalitarian government. Gallente are a 'freedom-loving' democratic crusader. Caldari are a capitalistic culture that broke free of the Gallente. Minmatar are a tribally tight culture and ex-slaves of the Amarr.

All this lore and backstory of the races is shown in their ships, preferred tactics etc. It is what makes the story we the players tell so powerful! I hope that you understand that Dr. Minx.

The last time CCP employee did something this game-breaking reckless it almost resulted in the end of Eve. I fully admit that I haven't played the game very long. Yet, I have watched you all and this game for the last few years with extreme attention. In the end I decided to invest some of my time and energy to play this game we enjoy...

I cannot stand by and let someone push an agenda that will be so destructive to the New Eden universe as a whole.
Kenshi Hanshin
WinterFel
RAZOR Alliance
#5 - 2013-04-25 21:58:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Kenshi Hanshin
CCP, please see following post:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2931451#post2931451

Please understand that I am a very reasonable person. Yet, I must be honest in saying that your employee's responses put me into a corner with no options. Thus this thread was opened.

If the devs demonstrate acknowledgement and action based on player feedback. Then I would have no grudge to pick. Yet, the response given does give me legitimate grounds for a grudge. Please understand that I wasn't looking for it. It was forced on myself and many of the other players. Please demonstrate that you are a responsible and reasonable company that deserves respect, in a mutual fashion.

Thank you very much for the work you have done and the wonderful game that EvE Online became. Please do not alienate large groups of the player-base!

____________________________________________________________________________________________________

foot-note: As an indication that I want to solve the issues raised in a mutually respctful manner, I have changed the topic title.
Cyprus Black
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#6 - 2013-05-08 18:12:54 UTC
See sig.

Summary of EvEs last four expansions: http://imgur.com/ZL5SM33

Bi-Mi Lansatha
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2013-05-09 11:05:47 UTC
Kenshi Hanshin wrote:
2) The Raven had no tank to begin with. The proposed Raven has less tank than any other BS other than the Scorpion!
It did lose some Defense, but gained a mid slot.... which could be used for tank.
I am not sure why they lowered Defense, but hardly a reason to get out the nails and erect some crosses. The changes in Defense will have virtually no impact on Raven usage, as they are too small and offset by other things.

Raven
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 7000(-500) / 5800(-841) / 6400(-241)

Slot layout: 7M(+1)
Bi-Mi Lansatha
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2013-05-09 11:08:47 UTC
Kenshi Hanshin wrote:
Caldari:

1) Missile mechanics need work to make them viable against turrets. There are numerous ideas suggested by players.

Cruise Missiles are getting a huge buff... and this is just to start.


Please keep in mind this change is not comprehensive. Following Odyssey, we hope to do more work to improve the missile systems in EVE by potentially adding new modules and/or interactions.

CCP Rise
Bi-Mi Lansatha
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2013-05-09 11:15:54 UTC
Kenshi Hanshin wrote:
...I am escalating our complaints as a community...
Who gave you that authority for the community?
Vaju Enki
Secular Wisdom
#10 - 2013-05-09 13:50:33 UTC
Cry me a river. What a disgusting post, i hope you get banned.

CCP is doing a great job with the ship rebalance, the fact that you don't like balance is your problem, not yours.

The Tears Must Flow

Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#11 - 2013-05-09 17:54:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Gizznitt Malikite
Kenshi Hanshin wrote:
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=223607
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=223611&find=unread
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=223608&find=unread
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=223610&find=unread
__________________________________________________________

There is much feedback and founded critic in both the Amarr and Caldari threads. All of the feedback has been brushed off with insulting and demeaning attitude by CCP Rise. Which is in violation of the respect clause of the EULA and common sense understanding of PR. Furthermore, he has ignored or dismissed concerns raised in both Minmatar and Gallente forums.

As these concerns were raised in the appropriate forums yet were ignored, I am escalating our complaints as a community.

In short, CCP Rise and to a lesser extent CCP Fozzie, are both hurting the game. As well as grossly and irresponsibly forcing their opinions into the game without regards to the player base. Below is a summary of the complaints I recall. If I missed any please add them!

Devs, you are not allowed to post any remarks till the list is complete. Any remarks by Devs must be respectful and demonstrate effort of understanding and action to fix issues raised. Any smart ass remarks such as:

"CCP Rise" wrote:
Closing the gap between new players and old players in some areas is definitely positive. If you notice that EVE gets to a point where you would rather have less ISK and SP let me know, we'll fix it asap.
will not be tolerated. [ https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2923417#post2923417 ]


I'm personally very happy with the work CCP's balance team has put in, and would first like to Thank them for their hard work, for their candid and open communication with the playerbase, and for representing CCP in a generally excellent manner.

Now, as for your complaints about "grossly and irresponsibly forcing their opinions into the game", about their "smartass remarks", and about your implicatations they are being disrespectful:

OMG WTF IS WRONG WITH YOU!!!! The remarks you quoted are COMPLETELY and TOTALLY acceptable. Grow some thicker skin already, as none of the examples you linked above are rude, inappropriate, or disrespectful. You either need to come up with some better examples, or apologize for your negligent and unqualified slander! In short, stop being a piece of **** throwing around bullshit accusations to gather attention.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#12 - 2013-05-09 18:03:58 UTC
Kenshi Hanshin wrote:

Summary:

Amarr:

1) Abbadon needs the 5% resistance/level bonus due to the "Alpha Fleet Doctrines". Not that it matter much there anyway with hundreds of ships shooting you in the face. But at least it may just cause enough of a difference for logistics to save you.

2) Apocalypse is the iconic Amarr laser sniping BS. Yet it is unable to fit nor use Tachyon lasers (1400mm Arty & 425mm equivalents). If you do manage to fit them you have to choose between firing guns or tanking or not having a tank. This is unacceptable.

3) According to the original dev blogs (source in Amarr BS thread link) the Armaggedon was not to be changed. Yet now it losses the cap bonus to lasers. Becomes a "drone boat" and a mini Bhaalgorn. There community's disgust has been beat to death and necromancy applied with regards to this.

4) Laser's cap use is prohibitive and causes many of the existing issues with Amarr ships. Cap use is 3-3.5x the cap use of the equivalent hybrid weapon. The issue is especially noticeable with regards to beam lasers.

5) Laser powergrid requirements are also too draconian to allow their fitting to AMARR ships that are supposed to use them.


1.) Bullshit... As explained very thoroughly, the 5% resists are simply obnoxiously potent. Go take a course in basic algebra, and then maybe you'll understand why the change is a good thing. As for the, because of "alpha fleet doctrines": Alpha fleets exist because of the limitless scaleability of remote reps, which are even more effective on ships with resistance bonuses. Again, if you go take a basic algebra course, you might understand how these are linked, and the balancing difficulties the Dev's Deal with.

2.) Most snipers use "range" to tank. Bitching about your inability to fit a tank and snipe is dumb. How about you focus on something a little more relevant rather than complaining cause you don't get the best of all worlds!

3.) I think the new Armaggedon is bad-ass... and fully support the changes. It will certainly add a new flavor to fleet doctrines, which will improve the overall game! Tell me, would you whine and ***** this much when your wife loses 100 kg's, changes careers, and starts a new hobby, or do you adapt to the changes and enjoy the new experiences...

4&5.) And they are reducing the base PG and cap consumption of many lasers. If this isn't enough, then go explain why... but realize many ships aren't designed to permarun guns and tank and . . . That's part of the pro's and con's of each weapon system.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#13 - 2013-05-09 18:22:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Gizznitt Malikite
Kenshi Hanshin wrote:

Caldari:

1) Missile mechanics need work to make them viable against turrets. There are numerous ideas suggested by players.

2) The Raven had no tank to begin with. The proposed Raven has less tank than any other BS other than the Scorpion!

3) The Scorpion is crap! As the ECM mechanic is broken! Fix that before making blanket changes to that ship. Better yet give the Caldari pilots a useful combat battleship. As the only useful PvP Caldari battleship is the Rokh.


1.) Missiles are a different beast than Turrets. And it's probably much more appropriate to balance turrets to make large turrets generally less potent against immobile small targets.

2.) The Raven is gaining a mid, gaining a healthy amount of speed, and Torps/Cruise Missiles are being improved. Is it no longer your passive regen missioning wet dream? Attack BS's in general have lower base HP, in exchange for more attack potency, speed, and agility. Pleae keep crying though!

3.) The Scorpion changes are awesome... and ECMis a very potent form of EWAR. They need to add more disruption BS's, not less.
p.s. Show me where the falcon touched you!


Kenshi Hanshin wrote:

Minmatar:

1) Their sig radius is much to small compared to their 'equivalents' of the other three races.


Gee, I wonder if that's a racial trait of their ship lines. How horrible for them to have racial traits like "more speed" or lower sigs!

Kenshi Hanshin wrote:

Gallente:

1) Hyperion proposed is and will be completely OP compared to the competition.

2) The dominix change was nice and that is the only one I liked.

Fellow pilots please add to list if I missed anything!


1.) If the Hyperion becomes OP, it will receive a nerf. In truth, CCP purposely wants some new ships to become FOTM with each patch. Gallente BS's have long played a subpar role in fleet engagements, and this might change that until the next "rebalance". So what...

2.) OMG, did you somehow forget to ***** some more? You were throwing such a tantrum, what's the trick to placating you?

To be honest, I am purposely quite terse in my replies because I feel you made a long bitching post that was completely unfounded, put in an inappropriate place, while tossing around unjust accusations and slander at CCP Devs.

This thread should be locked, because:
a.) There are already appropriate threads to discuss ship changes.
b.) Your accusations at CCP devs are bullshit (at least given the lame things you posted).
c.) Your ship change complaints are either poorly explained at best, generally unfounded, and typically wreak of "OMG their changing the balance of things, the sky must be falling".

/thread already!
Mallak Azaria
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#14 - 2013-05-09 23:45:26 UTC
Guy who has been playing for 10 months cries about awesome ship changes because he can't adapt. Nothing to see here.

I hope you get banned.

This post was lovingly crafted by a member of the Goonwaffe Posting Cabal, proud member of the popular gay hookup site somethingawful.com, Spelling Bee, Grammar Gestapo & #1 Official Gevlon Goblin Fanclub member.

Theia Matova
Dominance Theory
#15 - 2013-05-13 19:41:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Theia Matova
@OP, very good post ! However I would not put fingers on few CCP employees. CCP has also people responsible to look over the community. In anyway I think CCP is to blame as a whole.

The critisism again CCP is justified they neglected player input also. They are pushing more and more to Odyssey and people don't test half of it. You can see barely any input from SISI to the thread people are just like "math dictates this" screw your math. Amarr ships are very crap to fly, balance in some ways can be there they just are crap to fly. its not enjoyable experience. There are several issues that Amarr face.

What comes to resistance reduction. I believe it has been good thing from CCP. Actually I would like that the resistance bonus would be converted to something else. Because lets face it. +5% to every resistance for ships that can't dodge damage is simply just really big thing. It helps with rep and EHP. There needs to be other changes as well but I rather would take out all the omni resistance bonuses and change it with something else. Its anyway ridiculous that Amarr is the "passive armor" tank race *coughs* passive.. Er you mean buffer? It really sucks to fly amarr with the cap issues and all the fitting restrictions.

What you speak about most of the racial issues are very true. Thanks again for this really good post.
Theia Matova
Dominance Theory
#16 - 2013-05-13 19:50:02 UTC
sabre906 wrote:
Dr Minx wrote:
in before lock

i think ccp rise is one of the best appointments ccp have made


It actually follows an old CCP pattern of doing things because of "hey, it'd be interesting if we do this..." instead of attempting to responsibly balancing.

The new geddon is a prime example. Geddon is one of the few perfectly balanced boats out there. Yet CCP Rise choose to remove it, and introduce a new neut boat that has extreme potential to be game breaking. Why not just introduce a new model for your new toy, instead of breaking what's working for a whimsical experiment?


I see it still simply that they wanted to move the old typhoon problem to Amarr. It got removed from one race now it has to be bestowed to other. Its very sad. Amarr needs flexibility but this is ridiculous. You put missile slots and drones on that boat. Both being 2ndary weapon system for Amarr and now if you want to fly geddon you need both. Changes made to geddon was very short sighted. Yes its good ship. Its simply not Amarr. What needs changing is how lasers work in overall not that we get complete weapon system screw over. Lasers are most ****** weapon system in game and people fit projectiles guns to amarr ships that have laser bonuses. THAT IS SCREWED.

Balance out laser now please!
Theia Matova
Dominance Theory
#17 - 2013-05-13 20:15:12 UTC
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:

Kenshi Hanshin wrote:

Minmatar:

1) Their sig radius is much to small compared to their 'equivalents' of the other three races.


Gee, I wonder if that's a racial trait of their ship lines. How horrible for them to have racial traits like "more speed" or lower sigs!


Smaller minmatar ships are OP due to this. Some minny ships have about 20% more speed in comparison to other ships. That already means that
1) they can catch up anyone
2) they can run if they are not tackled
3) that 20% speed adds lot to speed tank on its own.

You add smaller signature to that +20% speed and you get evasion gods, that are hard to scan, MORE difficult to hit. Minmatars should have more signature radius in comparison to compensate all that what they get from the +20% speed.

Gizznitt Malikite wrote:

This thread should be locked, because:
a.) There are already appropriate threads to discuss ship changes.
b.) Your accusations at CCP devs are bullshit (at least given the lame things you posted).
c.) Your ship change complaints are either poorly explained at best, generally unfounded, and typically wreak of "OMG their changing the balance of things, the sky must be falling".
/thread already!


@Gizznitt, I do not agree with everything with Kenshin said but she has a point. CCP employees have over looked the threads and the comments. There are some changes that do bother the community. At least those flying those racial ships. Her concern is valid and I am glad someone speak out. You have proved that you are unable to take her feedback and instead of giving building critisism you troll. That makes you less in my eyes.

When you are happy with the changes and the continous Winmatar online you do not have to bring it on everyone else.
Shaera Taam
Khanid Prime Free Irregulars
#18 - 2013-05-14 02:20:14 UTC
Okay, so you lead with some-- uh--

Yknow, I'm sry, I realized it wasn't worth my time...

Good luck... Yer gonna need it...

Thus Spake the Frigate Goddess!

paritybit
Repo.
#19 - 2013-05-14 18:58:23 UTC
Just weighing in to say that I am glad newer players are capable of challenging me. I don't want to play a game where I get to walk all over a gang of players who have only been playing for 3 months simply because I can fly bigger, badder ships. If they manage to catch and engage me with the right ships, they should win. Expensive toys should not make you invincible.

And, if that's the best example you have of a smart-ass comment showing a lack of respect, you don't really have a case. He was using a little bit of sarcastic humor to defuse the argument. I think he's been very good for EVE and will continue to make improvements until such time as he nerfs something I really love and then I'll want him fired (you see? Humor, I'll never want him fired -- that's ridiculous).

I don't have a problem with any of the other issues you raised. I'm part of the community. Please stop complaining in my name, because I'm happy.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#20 - 2013-05-15 15:33:58 UTC
Theia Matova wrote:

Minmatar:

1) Their sig radius is much to small compared to their 'equivalents' of the other three races.

]
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:

Gee, I wonder if that's a racial trait of their ship lines. How horrible for them to have racial traits like "more speed" or lower sigs!


Smaller minmatar ships are OP due to this. Some minny ships have about 20% more speed in comparison to other ships. That already means that
1) they can catch up anyone
2) they can run if they are not tackled
3) that 20% speed adds lot to speed tank on its own.

You add smaller signature to that +20% speed and you get evasion gods, that are hard to scan, MORE difficult to hit. Minmatars should have more signature radius in comparison to compensate all that what they get from the +20% speed.


While the racial traits haven't been balanced in the past, CCP has done quite a bit to improve the balance while still maintaining flavor. For example:
Blaster tracking was improved to match their up-close-and-personal use. Null was brought more inline with Barrage. Tracking Enhancers are being nerfed. Ship speeds have been significantly rebalanced, so while the stabber might travel 30% fasters than a caracal or thorax, it's damage is pretty poor. While your three points make holding down Vaga's and Cynnabals very hard, I don't think the proposed changes to minmatar battleships is going to make them suddenly overpowered. Your points are mostly moot at the BS combat tier.

Theia Matova wrote:
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:

This thread should be locked, because:
a.) There are already appropriate threads to discuss ship changes.
b.) Your accusations at CCP devs are bullshit (at least given the lame things you posted).
c.) Your ship change complaints are either poorly explained at best, generally unfounded, and typically wreak of "OMG their changing the balance of things, the sky must be falling".
/thread already!


@Gizznitt, I do not agree with everything with Kenshin said but she has a point. CCP employees have over looked the threads and the comments. There are some changes that do bother the community. At least those flying those racial ships. Her concern is valid and I am glad someone speak out. You have proved that you are unable to take her feedback and instead of giving building critisism you troll. That makes you less in my eyes.

When you are happy with the changes and the continous Winmatar online you do not have to bring it on everyone else.


I personally have felt like CCP reads and responds to the threads very well. They may not respond to every single reply (and couldn't/shouldn't, but they've definitely listened to feedback and responded. Those threads have tons of dev reply posts explaining why they made some of the changes they have, noting revisions they made due to feedback, noting areas that still need reworking, etc. How can you possibly justify your statement that "CCP employees have overlooked the threads and the comments". Click on any of those threads, and just keep clicking the blue icon under the dev's name to skip from dev response to dev response. There are many dev replies in those threads, and I just don't understand how you can possibly justify your statement.

Please, how about you reply with exactly what CCP has overlooked rather than some broad ambiguous statement.


And while I definitely did not respond to Kenshi in a pleasant tone, I did not troll her either. I gave legit feedback (perhaps in a demeaning manner) on almost everything she brought up. Now, the reason I was so terse was because of this:

Kenshi Hanshin wrote:
There is much feedback and founded critic in both the Amarr and Caldari threads. All of the feedback has been brushed off with insulting and demeaning attitude by CCP Rise. Which is in violation of the respect clause of the EULA and common sense understanding of PR. Furthermore, he has ignored or dismissed concerns raised in both Minmatar and Gallente forums.


This statement frankly pissed me off. It was NOT backed up with any relevant or incriminating posts, was brutal towards CCP employees that I personally think are doing an excellent job, and frankly, was deceitful.

When replying to such over-the-top slander, I replied with lots of contempt, mockery, and scorn while still addressing the points brought up. Sorry if you think it was a troll.... perhaps my shock at the OP's audacity simply got the better of me!
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