EVE General Discussion

Damps? Really?

I don't recall the last time I was sensor damped.

Webbed, nueted, NOS'd and jammed sure.

Drone damage then?

Hey people, since this will go on Sisi soon and thus a Dev Blog may not be necessary, figured you would appreciate some comments on this.


Creating new ships is not a simple task and is almost never done right on the first attempt, as we need several iterations to outline, play and tweak with capabilities until we find a middle-ground we feel comfortable to release.

On this particular instance, the first pass that was spread around was particularly off the chart and needed to be brought down to more realistic numbers.

The role of the tier 3 battlecruisers is to bring battleship range and damage into mobile, small gangs by wielding large weapon systems, which translates into the following design points:

• Supposed to be good as a damage platform against larger ship hulls (read battleships, capitals targets) while being difficult to hit themselves by those ships due to decreased signature radius and increased mobility
• Better aimed for small, fast gang support than battleships due to their increased mobility
• Provide a learning bridge between battlecruisers and battleships, while being themselves a little cheaper than battleships
• Due to their large sized weaponry, supposed to be at a severe disadvantage against smaller hulls, especially at point blank range
• Have significantly less standing power than battleships, or even other battlecruiser tiers, thus less proficient in static engagements, where their mobility is less relevant

In case of the Talos, the initial web strength bonus was unfortunately contradictory with the previous goals, because when combined with its dronebay and blasters, it gave this ship the unique capability to dispatch smaller ship hulls significantly more easily than it should have been able to. It also lead to other issues, like acting as a cheap, effective tackle, put it in a dangerous spot to compete with Serpentis faction ships, or limiting this ship weapon systems to blasters only.

For being EVE players ourselves we know the concept of pinning anything in web range to a dead halt with 90% webs before melting faces down with 8 Neutron Blaster Cannons II to be incredibly fun (had a lot of joy with tier 3 battlecruiser first stats myself during the internal play tests ).

However, as designers, we cannot in good conscience release a ship whose bonuses obviously go against the role goals it is supposed to follow. We understand that in this case it unfortunately created a lot of disappointment, but sadly these things are bound to happen when taking first pass data as granted.

Because indeed, we would like you to realize the initial data that was spread around was just that, initial data, and that it is supposed and expected to change at any time during the development process.


Tl;dr: if it's not on TQ, please don't take it as final. Even when it's on TQ, remember it's susceptible to change with time.


Hope that helps a bit.

So.. there we go....
supercaps can not kill subcaps...
Bs/bc can not kill frigs ??

R U sure u know how to read?

So what is the Talos supposed to do against any BS that can field heavy drones and neuts?

It simply doesn't have the tank to hang out under the guns, and is neut vulnerable, so are we to understand its meant to be a rail ship, or just sub-par?

They say they dont want the ships to preform outside their roll, then make them worthless in compairison to multi roll ships. (a shield typoon will probialy be as cheep and as efective as a naga, with a better tank and drones.)

I know these changes may not be final by a long shot, and i shure hope they will not, because there is a reason no one flys the raven for pvp, and with out alittle help hitting smaller targets the naga will suffer the same fate. Regaurdless of price it will have a even crummyer tank and no one is going to fly it as long as the Tornado and Orical are more balanced in dps at range (that actualy hits for close to full damage.)

Same gose for the talos, your making its role out to be a slightly longer range gank brutix, not asking for the web back but for the love of jove dont make it another cookie cutter bonused ship.

Over all im not buying this Bull S*** that its a bridge into flying a BS, new pilots are more likely to jump stright into a BS and end up on a killboard as they are likely to jump into these new ships and do it twice as fast.

As for being a new super capital killer, these really arnt any better than a welp cain because at least welp cain fleets can cap the super out wit the newts in their utility highs.

So CCP , make these ships have a more defined roll than just a stepping stone desposable gank ship so people will actualy be compelled to fly the none amarr / mimatar ones, just like most the best pvp ships in the game are amarr / mimatar.

Onictus makes a good point here. If the devs had a lot of fun with the Talos, wouldnt players aswell? And could some other aspect be tweaked to prevent the Talos becoming a 'omgpwnzmobile'? Maybe it just has 2 mids (MWD/AB + Web) so it needs support? Or weakening its tank further?

I think (and I may be inviting pain upon myself in a future gank here) that the Gallente Blaster Boat pilots have waited a looooong time to get something good: 8 Neutron Blaster Cannon II face melting is that goodness.

Throw 'em a bone CCP.

C.

lol, sometimes i wish ccp would rate EVE for 18+ ppl

how about a little bit patience before you start to act like a little child?

i love thread starters like you, hopefully you'll play another game this winter.... b/c EVE is nothing for you

So these new ships are to be niche ships to be used in whelp fleets in null against the evil the super caps floating out there. I guess I won't be having one in my hanger then.

I am not saying these ships won't be used (well the Naga and Talos might be rather rare critters). But they will be used as the cheap ship replacements for the blobs which puts them below the status of drakes and cains because at least those ships can do other roles.

I am just disappointed as I am sure others here are as well that these new ships and their wonderful models will be nothing more than disposable platforms with no real use outside of the large alliances that can field them in lemming like numbers.