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Ice mining in w-space

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Martin Ehrenthal
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#1 - 2013-04-30 15:21:53 UTC
Since ice won't be mined in belt (that w-space lacks) anymore but in anomalies, could you add ice mining to w-space.

Mining in w-space is currently a silly think to do (we can't efficiently do t1 production and due to mass restriction hauling it to k-space is not really an option). However, if we could harvest ice for our fuel production, everybody would do mining when some ice would appear.

Please add contents for miners and for people who like to shoot miners.
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
#2 - 2013-05-01 23:41:25 UTC
If you add ice to w-space, you come very very close to making it entirely self sufficient.

You'll have people closing up the wormholes behind them.

Woo! CSM XI!

Fuzzwork Enterprises

Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Vaju Enki
Secular Wisdom
#3 - 2013-05-02 12:50:05 UTC
No.

The Tears Must Flow
Cyprus Black
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#4 - 2013-05-04 23:45:57 UTC
Steve Ronuken wrote:
If you add ice to w-space, you come very very close to making it entirely self sufficient.
How is this a bad thing? Nobody has ever fully explained why self sufficiency in a WH is a bad thing.

Summary of EvEs last four expansions: http://imgur.com/ZL5SM33
Michael Loney
Skullspace Industries
#5 - 2013-05-06 13:45:28 UTC
As a corporation that is looking to wormholes, being able to mine ice inside would make enough difference to try it out.

Right now there are a lot of factors that make wormhole attractive, less population, more isk/hr and more of a 'home' feeling.

Problem #1 is that to stay setup you need a source for fuel ( blocks or mats ) while the PI stuff is trivial wit the right planets the ice will forever be a bottleneck. You need to buy it or hope your static goes somewhere with ice.

I know after the expansion change that if ever high-sec ice belt was cleaned it would only make ~80% of the fuel needed.

Apply this to W-Space, have only enough ice spawn to run a small tower on each moon in the system. If you want to run a large tower then you need to reduce the total number of stations you have set up. Static links to systems with 15+ moons will be come very desirable. It will also drive conflict when someone wants to steal your ice supply ! All you have to do is out mine the hosts ice and after a while you can sell it back to them for a pretty penny. Or go into siege mode and do your best to prevent them getting ice products at all for a while.

And for some reason, sleepers really like ice, it should be annoying to mine ice with them around.
Friggz
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#6 - 2013-05-08 14:45:01 UTC
Cyprus Black wrote:
Steve Ronuken wrote:
If you add ice to w-space, you come very very close to making it entirely self sufficient.
How is this a bad thing? Nobody has ever fully explained why self sufficiency in a WH is a bad thing.


EvE is a sandbox, one sand box, one server, one universe. Letting people make their own pocket universe and shut everyone else out is everything EvE is not. Player interaction is everything in EvE and creating areas that allow you to shut yourself off from the rest of the universe removes what makes EvE unique.
Martin Ehrenthal
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#7 - 2013-05-13 11:08:31 UTC
We need to go to k-space to sell our blue loots, to sell T3 and to buy T2 / faction / deadspace ship or modules.

We also can do T1 production in w-space; we can build our Moros or archon out of our gravimetric sites. Yet very few do it. We still buy them in LS.

Ice mining wouldn't make w-space self-sufficient, it would just be one more activity to do (with le logistics drawback).

Even if it was using the same mechanics than in k-space where it will re-spawn in the same limited set of systems, it would make some system more valuable. It would be something new to fight for.
Tiger Armani
End-Game
#8 - 2013-05-13 11:49:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Tiger Armani
It's just funny when people think WH dwellers would like to be isolated.

Adding ice belts would just remove redicilous hauling to make our towers stay online.

As mentioned in previous posts, we need to visit HS all the time.

Ice mining would give more action in WHs. With removal of grav sites, people will mine less in WHs.
So no more juicy targets. Give us ice. and this will change.

less hassle with fuel blocks, more time for PVP
yodayblack
AirHogs
Hogs Collective
#9 - 2013-05-14 23:03:22 UTC
Just give us ice. Living in a wormhole hauling ice in with mass restrictions is painful. Hell we would settle for crappy high sec ice if we had to. Just give us the stuff we need for fuel. Also no wormhole is ever locked down. Dont believe me go watch a clarion call. You can find any hole you want.
Vincent Gaines
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#10 - 2013-05-15 15:35:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Vincent Gaines
Steve Ronuken wrote:
If you add ice to w-space, you come very very close to making it entirely self sufficient.

You'll have people closing up the wormholes behind them.

You still need to sell the sleeper loot, get resupplied, and to find people to explode.


So no, we would not.

However, it would increase mining operations in w-space, and increase targets to...explode.


I, personally, enjoy making explosions. Don't you?

Not a diplo. 

The above post was edited for spelling.
Vincent Gaines
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#11 - 2013-05-15 15:42:04 UTC
Friggz wrote:

EvE is a sandbox, one sand box, one server, one universe. Letting people make their own pocket universe and shut everyone else out is everything EvE is not. Player interaction is everything in EvE and creating areas that allow you to shut yourself off from the rest of the universe removes what makes EvE unique.



If you think that w-space is isolated and that you don't interact with people, then you have absolutely no clue what you're talking about.

Even if you close your static, you still have k162s coming in. You still have errant outbounds, some that go to null, LS, even HS.

Like you said, eve is a sandbox. Just because I don't like to play in your corner doesn't mean you should dictate what we put in ours.

Not a diplo. 

The above post was edited for spelling.
Theia Matova
Dominance Theory
#12 - 2013-05-15 16:23:33 UTC
Hmm I think the idea is so and so. But after thinking it a bit I like the idea. I lived in WH for quite sometime and regular mining and sites nor pvp doesn't really keep you busy. Since for PVP you kinda need a gang. Sites you need also hole scouts kind of.

If ice belts would be added to WH it would mean that people that did not have gangs could so something smaller risk. Also when ice was in WHs it would mean that WH corps wouldn't need to transport goods so often causing that stuff would stockpile in POSes so when you eventually get blow one up.. well just imagine.

I believe that in overall this would be a good change gameplay wise. Sure it can have effect that I cannot figure out just now anyway

+1 until someone proves me wrong.
Cage Man
Fusion Enterprises Ltd
Pandemic Horde
#13 - 2013-05-15 23:00:27 UTC
Have the ice randomly spawn in Class 4's. Make them worth something. An no i don't live in one.. anymore anyway Blink
Nariya Kentaya
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#14 - 2013-05-18 15:06:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Nariya Kentaya
Martin Ehrenthal wrote:
Since ice won't be mined in belt (that w-space lacks) anymore but in anomalies, could you add ice mining to w-space.

Mining in w-space is currently a silly think to do (we can't efficiently do t1 production and due to mass restriction hauling it to k-space is not really an option). However, if we could harvest ice for our fuel production, everybody would do mining when some ice would appear.

Please add contents for miners and for people who like to shoot miners.

1) No ice, logistics are supposed to be tedious and an issue, its what makes wormholes hard to live in, and keeps alot of the jokes out.

2) Hard to haul ore to k-space? what? back when i lived in a C6-C6 with SYJ, i had a corpmate who ALWAYS mined the gravs, and ALWAYS hauled it out no problem, now that i live in a C5-C3, he still does the same thing, because he knows how to scan when he overdoes the mass.
samualvimes
Brothers At Arms
#15 - 2013-05-18 18:56:59 UTC
Martin Ehrenthal wrote:
Since ice won't be mined in belt (that w-space lacks) anymore but in anomalies, could you add ice mining to w-space.

Mining in w-space is currently a silly think to do (we can't efficiently do t1 production and due to mass restriction hauling it to k-space is not really an option). However, if we could harvest ice for our fuel production, everybody would do mining when some ice would appear.

Please add contents for miners and for people who like to shoot miners.



You went into a Wh to live in a harsh enviroment so get on with it.

If you've never tried PvP in EvE it's quite possible you've missed out on one of the greatest rushes available in modern gaming.
Reaver Glitterstim
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#16 - 2013-05-19 04:29:33 UTC
Cyprus Black wrote:
Steve Ronuken wrote:
If you add ice to w-space, you come very very close to making it entirely self sufficient.
How is this a bad thing? Nobody has ever fully explained why self sufficiency in a WH is a bad thing.

I think self-sufficiency should be possible in wormhole space.

FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."

Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."
Chitsa Jason
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#17 - 2013-05-27 02:01:54 UTC
Wormhole space should not be self sufficient. Any space in that matter should be tied to others in some manner. We do not want to have closed gate communities in EvE.

Burn the land and boil the sea You can't take the sky from me
corbexx
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#18 - 2013-05-27 23:14:42 UTC  |  Edited by: corbexx
Chitsa Jason wrote:
Wormhole space should not be self sufficient. Any space in that matter should be tied to others in some manner. We do not want to have closed gate communities in EvE.



Even if ice was put in to wh space it still wouldnt be self sufficent, you'd still have to buy your mods (unless you fancy using t1 mods, still have to buy t2 ships. You'd also have to buy your pos mods as these cant be made in wh space.(you also have to come out to sell your tags although that techincally wouldnt be affecting you being self sufficient)

you'd also have to hope the ice was the right sort for your own tower.

So please chista before you make sweeping comments atleast make sure they are correct. yes they potentially would be more self sufficent but they wouldnt by any means be closed gate.

I dont even know if it would be good or bad. If they showed up on d scan it would be pretty risky mining them. Very easy to find and catch people in them. I could also see people using bomber alts to just camp them.

Putting them in c4 space might attually help make them useful (although i'd still rather they just had 2 statics)

Corbexx for CSM X - Wormholes still deserve better
Chitsa Jason
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#19 - 2013-05-28 01:00:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Chitsa Jason
corbexx wrote:
Chitsa Jason wrote:
Wormhole space should not be self sufficient. Any space in that matter should be tied to others in some manner. We do not want to have closed gate communities in EvE.



Even if ice was put in to wh space it still wouldnt be self sufficent, you'd still have to buy your mods (unless you fancy using t1 mods, still have to buy t2 ships. You'd also have to buy your pos mods as these cant be made in wh space.(you also have to come out to sell your tags although that techincally wouldnt be affecting you being self sufficient)

you'd also have to hope the ice was the right sort for your own tower.

So please chista before you make sweeping comments atleast make sure they are correct. yes they potentially would be more self sufficent but they wouldnt by any means be closed gate.

I dont even know if it would be good or bad. If they showed up on d scan it would be pretty risky mining them. Very easy to find and catch people in them. I could also see people using bomber alts to just camp them.

Putting them in c4 space might attually help make them useful (although i'd still rather they just had 2 statics)


2 statics for C4s would be more useful indeed. Having ice in wspace does not make 100% self sufficient I do agree but it makes it more self sufficient than it is. I would rather have more unique resources in wspace than the ones which are already in kspace.

Also you are in no holes. nice did not see that coming :)

Burn the land and boil the sea You can't take the sky from me
yodayblack
AirHogs
Hogs Collective
#20 - 2013-05-29 04:51:00 UTC
Chitsa Jason wrote:
Wormhole space should not be self sufficient. Any space in that matter should be tied to others in some manner. We do not want to have closed gate communities in EvE.



Have you ever been to null? That is a huge closed gated community. In fact some times they really CLOSE the gate by locking it down with smart bombs,bubbles and fast locking dessy's. Theres no reason to ever leave null except to sell your wares, or gank carebears. Why should wormholes be any different. They are 0.0 space, why not treat them with the same privileges that null gets. They get ice, all the ore, stations, jump clones, sov. All we are asking for is just something that would allow wormholes to do what they are there to do. Live on the edge of the world in unknown space, not this constant running back to high sec for fuel.
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