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Don't remove grav sites
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Kamorain Dinard
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2013-04-30 04:18:46 UTC
So, I haven't been able to find a thread about this but, I'd be surprised if there wasn't one given that a lot of people seem to feel strongly about it. Please feel free to link it in a reply if you know of one.

As I understand it, grav sites are being removed in Odyssey and being replaced with anomalies that contain ore or ice. I don't have anything against adding anomalies like this but, I think it's a real shame that grav sites are being removed since it is removing a fun feature from the game and I don't see any reason to do it.

Probing takes some skill and effort whereas scanning for anomalies doesn't. By not having sites that require probes to find, that contain ore, CCP are removing one of the reasons to do proper exploration. Finding a grav site that is worth mining* is exciting and, it's pretty satisfying to scan one down and then go mine it. Changing grav sites into anomalies just makes it a matter of moving from system to system until you find one which takes all the skill and excitement out of it.

I suggest keeping some grav sites and having them contain more valuable ore than is normally present in the system they are in. To make them worthwhile, this would have to be at least as valuable as the ore in the anomalies in the system but, even if they just contained the same ore as the anomalies, at least they'd have less people so still be worthwhile. It'd be cool if they contained ice too.

* yeah, most grav sites aren't at the moment, at least in high sec anyway, because the belts have more valuable ore in abundance
DeLindsay
Galaxies Fall
#2 - 2013-04-30 05:04:27 UTC
Quote:
I think it's a real shame that grav sites are being removed since it is removing a fun feature from the game and I don't see any reason to do it.


CCP explained the 'reason' fully in the post about changing up the way Ice is distributed in Eve, along with all other Minerals. Basically it's like this, they want to move more players into Low/Null and one way to do that is relocate some of the aspects of Highsec carebear lives out of Highsec and into Low/Null. They are reducing the total amount of Ice in Highsec by ~20% and moving it from a "never depletes static belt" to an anom. My guess is that by doing so they figured why not make all "hidden" belts anoms so that's what they're doing. Yes it sucks for those of us who trained up scanning skills and got good at finding Gravi sites amongst others but oh well.

Would it have been nice for CCP to JUST change the Ice to anoms instead of ALL Gravi sites, sure, but that's not what they're doing, so we have to deal with the change.

The Operative: "There are a lot of innocent people being killed in the air right now".

Capt. Malcolm Reynolds: "You have no idea how true that is".
Alx Warlord
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2013-04-30 05:52:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Alx Warlord
Probably moving also Ores to these Anoms will be a hard punch against bots.

CCP stated in the fanfest that is also a good Idea Removing the many small Asteroid belts and replacing them with a few Larger ones.

We can expect big changes in Odyssey. Lets see how them play and then we resume complaining : )

But, Yes.... I'm woried. Expecially about this changes in WH-Space.

Please read these!

New POS system New SOV system
Iudicium Vastus
Doomheim
#4 - 2013-04-30 06:10:26 UTC
Yes, I am saddened that grav sites are being moved to regular anomalies. Not only for the worth of them and the skill needed to find them, but also the relative 'safety' of them. Under current system a ganker/WT would need to probe you down if they see in dscan there are barges out but not in the normal belts. These probes would then be visible on dscan and give warning that someone is looking for them. Was also the only reason I mined in lowsec, using grav sites since I would have warning I am being probed out.

[u]Nerf stabs/cloaks in FW?[/u] No, just.. -Fit more points -Fit faction points -Bring a friend or two with points (an alt is fine too)
Alx Warlord
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2013-04-30 06:18:42 UTC
Iudicium Vastus wrote:
Yes, I am saddened that grav sites are being moved to regular anomalies. Not only for the worth of them and the skill needed to find them, but also the relative 'safety' of them. Under current system a ganker/WT would need to probe you down if they see in dscan there are barges out but not in the normal belts. These probes would then be visible on dscan and give warning that someone is looking for them. Was also the only reason I mined in lowsec, using grav sites since I would have warning I am being probed out.


Indeed, this rises the risk up to a level that will kill mostly of the null-sec mining.

Also Don't forget that There are now Rare NPCs that drop tags in low-sec belt... so there will also be more people roaming the belts....

This also affects the security of most Null-sec mining OPS.... Miners of big alliances will have to be twice careful now. And Miners from small alliances will have to find another job.

Please read these!

New POS system New SOV system
Uber Saijin
Thermal Collision Consortium
#6 - 2013-04-30 14:49:28 UTC
Iudicium Vastus wrote:
Yes, I am saddened that grav sites are being moved to regular anomalies. Not only for the worth of them and the skill needed to find them, but also the relative 'safety' of them. Under current system a ganker/WT would need to probe you down if they see in dscan there are barges out but not in the normal belts. These probes would then be visible on dscan and give warning that someone is looking for them. Was also the only reason I mined in lowsec, using grav sites since I would have warning I am being probed out.



I completely agree and support this and add that is makes wormhole mining even harder. It makes wormhole space even less attractive even though it is the most dangerous space in the game.
Little Dragon Khamez
Guardians of the Underworld
#7 - 2013-04-30 14:54:20 UTC
Wormhole space is not the most dangerous in the game, you are 7 times more likely to be killed in null.

Dumbing down of Eve Online will result in it's destruction...
Ruze
Next Stage Initiative
#8 - 2013-04-30 14:56:49 UTC
Little Dragon Khamez wrote:
Wormhole space is not the most dangerous in the game, you are 7 times more likely to be killed in null.


I would agree with this. Your 90% less likely to see anybody else in w-space. It's the most lonely ... right up to the point you let your guard down.

That said, I would think there were more hisec deaths than null.

If you're driven to threaten others with harm or violence because of what they do in game, you can't separate fantasy from reality. That "griefer/thief" is probably more sane than you are. How screwed up is that?
Bucca Zerodyme
Good For Nothing Corporation
#9 - 2013-04-30 15:08:32 UTC
If you have less belts, then ratting is more difficult right?
monkfish2345
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#10 - 2013-04-30 15:47:16 UTC
Just wait till all belts are removed in favor of anoms.

then we will see some tears :)
Friggz
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#11 - 2013-04-30 15:49:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Friggz
I have a feeling this is the first step in removing static belts entirely. Respawning them after downtime gives one time zone an advantage and I don't think CCP likes that. It also allows them better control of the distribution of resources as how many anoms and how much ore they have can be adjusted on the fly, unlike now where some systems have 3 belts and others have over a dozen.

I think you are going to see much larger changes to mining down the line. The leaked CSM chat logs state they are working on a mini-game for mining, and I think the mini-game we got for exploration is a test to see how well it flies. If it turns out players hate it, it's better that they mess up exploration than mess up mining which is critical to the economy.

So basically... I'd say it's all a work in progress at this point.
Xavier Thorm
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#12 - 2013-04-30 16:47:19 UTC
People saying that this will be bad for nullsec mining probably haven't mined in nullsec. Whether your in an grav site or belt with the current system, you dock up the moment there's a hostile in the system (or preferably within a few systems, since you should have that intel). The new system won't change that one bit.
sabre906
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2013-04-30 16:58:15 UTC
Ruze wrote:
Little Dragon Khamez wrote:
Wormhole space is not the most dangerous in the game, you are 7 times more likely to be killed in null.


I would agree with this. Your 90% less likely to see anybody else in w-space. It's the most lonely ... right up to the point you let your guard down.

That said, I would think there were more hisec deaths than null.


Oh please! In some systems deep inside the blue nether regions of sov null, you don't see hostiles for months on end. And once some scary neut shows up in local, everybody docks up.Lol
Velicitia
XS Tech
#14 - 2013-04-30 17:11:10 UTC
monkfish2345 wrote:
Just wait till all belts are removed in favor of anoms.

then we will see some tears :)


WTB T2 Tear Buckets.Cool

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia
Kamorain Dinard
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#15 - 2013-04-30 19:44:04 UTC
DeLindsay wrote:
CCP explained the 'reason' fully in the post about changing up the way Ice is distributed in Eve, along with all other Minerals. Basically it's like this, they want to move more players into Low/Null and one way to do that is relocate some of the aspects of Highsec carebear lives out of Highsec and into Low/Null. They are reducing the total amount of Ice in Highsec by ~20% and moving it from a "never depletes static belt" to an anom. My guess is that by doing so they figured why not make all "hidden" belts anoms so that's what they're doing. Yes it sucks for those of us who trained up scanning skills and got good at finding Gravi sites amongst others but oh well.

Would it have been nice for CCP to JUST change the Ice to anoms instead of ALL Gravi sites, sure, but that's not what they're doing, so we have to deal with the change.


I don't see how moving ice to anoms has anything to do with grav sites really. At the moment ice doesn't appear in grav sites. It'd be nice if they re-instated grav sites and added ice to them but, that's tangential IMHO.

monkfish2345 wrote:
Just wait till all belts are removed in favor of anoms.

then we will see some tears :)


Personally, I think changing all normal belts to anoms is a good thing. I don't see why anyone would shed any tears over it. Anoms are trivial to find so they aren't really any different than normal belts except that they can respawn. It just means the belt respawns in a sensible way instead of only at DT. The only people I can see being hurt by this are bots that mine in high sec (but, I can't see it really being a problem for them either really after a small amount of reprogramming) and people who just jump on right after DT to mine out belts without moving from highly populated areas.

Friggz wrote:
I think you are going to see much larger changes to mining down the line. The leaked CSM chat logs state they are working on a mini-game for mining, and I think the mini-game we got for exploration is a test to see how well it flies. If it turns out players hate it, it's better that they mess up exploration than mess up mining which is critical to the economy.


The exploration mini-game doesn't look very good to me but, I guess I should wait and try it before judging.



I don't see any reasons here why they couldn't keep grav sites. Hopefully they'll come to their senses and reinstate them in a later patch.
Ruze
Next Stage Initiative
#16 - 2013-04-30 19:49:08 UTC
sabre906 wrote:
Ruze wrote:
Little Dragon Khamez wrote:
Wormhole space is not the most dangerous in the game, you are 7 times more likely to be killed in null.


I would agree with this. Your 90% less likely to see anybody else in w-space. It's the most lonely ... right up to the point you let your guard down.

That said, I would think there were more hisec deaths than null.


Oh please! In some systems deep inside the blue nether regions of sov null, you don't see hostiles for months on end. And once some scary neut shows up in local, everybody docks up.Lol


I've afk'd a lot for various reasons. Some of the worst hatemail I've ever received.

If you're driven to threaten others with harm or violence because of what they do in game, you can't separate fantasy from reality. That "griefer/thief" is probably more sane than you are. How screwed up is that?