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mind links need to go away

Author
Mole Guy
Bob's Bait and Tackle
#1 - 2013-04-28 17:00:47 UTC
this jumping from clone to clone to boost a fleet from armor to shield is gay.

and what about the changes in the new links? are we to choose which implant to boost? great bonuses to armor, but not so much to skirmish because i have the armor implant..example below.

"dont yell at me guys, i have to choose one or the other. do u want armor, or to you want web range? tell me now so i can clone jump and then fly the 15 systems back here to boost the one you want..."

that crap has to go.

adjust the links or whole system to give the same bonuses (maybe ad a new skill that gives max bonuses or whatever...)
i dont know what, but this multi implant clone thing taking up all my clones so i can boost and not having any clones left over for other slot 10 implants is for the birds...

its an old, outdated system.
commander aze
#2 - 2013-04-28 17:37:00 UTC
Mindlinks are an enherent risk item they cost a good amount so if you want a better. Having jump clones is a perfectly acceptable setup. It allows the booster to effectively boost one type of tank them forced to swap clones if they need the other tyoe

Choose one yanking type and make it standard for your fleet

Commander Aze For CSM XII

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=506400

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androch
LitlCorp
#3 - 2013-04-28 18:59:44 UTC
mindlinks are fine the way they are... you have clones geared towards the fleet you plan on running theres nothing broken abouf that
Kirimeena D'Zbrkesbris
Republic Military Tax Avoiders
#4 - 2013-04-28 19:27:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Kirimeena D'Zbrkesbris
androch wrote:
mindlinks are fine the way they are... you have clones geared towards the fleet you plan on running theres nothing broken abouf that

except that they are too powerful (50% boost to both passive and active fleet bonuses) without alternate solution.

Opinions are like assholes. Everybody got one and everyone thinks everyone else's stinks.

Alx Warlord
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2013-04-28 20:49:28 UTC
Mind-links are ok..... the pain are the clones....
Dave Stark
#6 - 2013-04-28 21:30:05 UTC
nerf the boosts, make all mindlinks affect all links/skills/etc

1 mindlink fit's all, but it provides less bonus.
Feligast
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#7 - 2013-04-28 21:35:58 UTC
Destroy the old one, put in the new one. How hard is it?
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#8 - 2013-04-28 22:59:03 UTC
CCP have already said they want to massivly downpower mind links contribution compared to the skill & module contribution.
Almost every other implant is somewhere from 3-6% benefit. Mind links being 50% benefit is just so out of scale.

One option I can see them taking is removing the specialist mind links in favour of generic mind links that give a bonus to all the boosts. Though I'm not sure it's an ideal solution. Or possibly racial mindlink lines. Matching the CS specs.
Goldiiee
Bureau of Astronomical Anomalies
#9 - 2013-04-28 23:29:57 UTC
Just to clarify, it doesn't give a 50% boost exactly, It replaces a 10% boost from a 17 day skill que with a Fixed 15% boost. and it changes a 2.5% to a 3.75% Command Bonus (that requires a 30+ day skill que).

So it's not changing every ship in a fleet from 50k EHP to 100k EHP, more like 50k EHP to 59k EHP.

Things that keep me up at night;  Why do we use a voice communication device to send telegraphs? Moore's Law should state, Once you have paid off the last PC upgrade you will need another.

Friggz
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#10 - 2013-04-29 00:09:14 UTC
Mole Guy wrote:
this jumping from clone to clone to boost a fleet from armor to shield is gay.


I'm not sure what clone jumping has to do with homosexuality. Unless your clone jumping procedure greatly different from mine.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#11 - 2013-04-29 00:13:46 UTC

Move mindlinkes from the booster character to the character receiving the boosts!!! This forces another level of synergy required to get the top-most benefit from boosters!
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#12 - 2013-04-29 00:18:25 UTC
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:

Move mindlinkes from the booster character to the character receiving the boosts!!! This forces another level of synergy required to get the top-most benefit from boosters!



Yeah! Everyone should have to fly around with hundreds of millions of ISK in their heads if they want to be able to compete with you and your friends!
Kirimeena D'Zbrkesbris
Republic Military Tax Avoiders
#13 - 2013-04-29 04:40:44 UTC
Goldiiee wrote:
Just to clarify, it doesn't give a 50% boost exactly, It replaces a 10% boost from a 17 day skill que with a Fixed 15% boost. and it changes a 2.5% to a 3.75% Command Bonus (that requires a 30+ day skill que).

So it's not changing every ship in a fleet from 50k EHP to 100k EHP, more like 50k EHP to 59k EHP.

It changes base link bonus from 2.5 to 3.75 that if you factor in other skills and bonuses adds up and overall difference is much larger than 1.25% and becomes a must have to apply links effectively.

If you take effective repair (both remote and local) instead of EHP you'll get almost (in some cases more than) 100% bonus with mindlink and only ~50% without it. So my point still stands: too powerful and too inflexible.

Opinions are like assholes. Everybody got one and everyone thinks everyone else's stinks.

DeLindsay
Galaxies Fall
#14 - 2013-04-29 05:49:19 UTC
Quote:
Destroy the old one, put in the new one. How hard is it?


I'm sure those out there with a clone that has a 1.2 billion Isk Mining Link will beg to differ.

Quote:
Almost every other implant is somewhere from 3-6% benefit. Mind links being 50% benefit is just so out of scale.


Hi, welcome to HG Implant slot 6, ALL of them give a 50% bonus to the other 5's secondary attribute. I can 100% guarantee you if they nerf down ALL Links (slot 6 & 10) to be less than the current 50% there will be a player revolt as it would make most/all HG sets much less useful. In fact without the 50% bonus, there are several sets that you could use the absurdly cheap Officer slot 6 Imp and be of a higher value with than the current Omega (if dropped much below it's current value of 50%).

Quote:
Just to clarify, it doesn't give a 50% boost exactly, It replaces a 10% boost from a 17 day skill que with a Fixed 15% boost. and it changes a 2.5% to a 3.75% Command Bonus (that requires a 30+ day skill que).

So it's not changing every ship in a fleet from 50k EHP to 100k EHP, more like 50k EHP to 59k EHP.


This. No matter how you spin the numbers, it's a small increase overall with the Mindlink than without.

Quote:
too powerful and too inflexible.


Not too powerful, yes inflexible but that's what JC's are for. It's not CCP's fault that whiny ass players can't be bothered to JC to the one that has XX Link in it. Or hell, why not have more than ONE damn booster in your fleet, like it's a hard training curve, really.

I trained for the Siege Imp back before there was even T2 Gang Mods, or Overheating even. Back then pretty much all the links were 10mil Isk. If they were again that cheap (or say sub 50 mil) then it wouldn't be unreasonable to have a player just swap them out every now and again without JC'ing. And sorry, but boohoo to all the whiners that say this or that is OP, it's also not CCP's fault that YOU and YOUR gang/fleet chose not to use the tools CCP has given you and the other team did.

The Operative: "There are a lot of innocent people being killed in the air right now".

Capt. Malcolm Reynolds: "You have no idea how true that is".

Goldiiee
Bureau of Astronomical Anomalies
#15 - 2013-04-29 06:26:43 UTC
Kirimeena D'Zbrkesbris wrote:
Goldiiee wrote:
Just to clarify, it doesn't give a 50% boost exactly, It replaces a 10% boost from a 17 day skill que with a Fixed 15% boost. and it changes a 2.5% to a 3.75% Command Bonus (that requires a 30+ day skill que).

So it's not changing every ship in a fleet from 50k EHP to 100k EHP, more like 50k EHP to 59k EHP.

It changes base link bonus from 2.5 to 3.75 that if you factor in other skills and bonuses adds up and overall difference is much larger than 1.25% and becomes a must have to apply links effectively.

If you take effective repair (both remote and local) instead of EHP you'll get almost (in some cases more than) 100% bonus with mindlink and only ~50% without it. So my point still stands: too powerful and too inflexible.

I use an OGB everyday, both with and without a Mindlink depending on the situation. I am very aware of the benefits and I think your estimation is more of a perception than a reality.

Things that keep me up at night;  Why do we use a voice communication device to send telegraphs? Moore's Law should state, Once you have paid off the last PC upgrade you will need another.

Kirimeena D'Zbrkesbris
Republic Military Tax Avoiders
#16 - 2013-04-29 09:13:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Kirimeena D'Zbrkesbris
Goldiiee wrote:
I use an OGB everyday, both with and without a Mindlink depending on the situation. I am very aware of the benefits and I think your estimation is more of a perception than a reality.

Bonus with mindlink is 35.16%, without 23.44% (to both resistances and repair duration). Lets do some simple math:

lets assume you have 100 ehp/s repair on some ship with 0 resistances before bonuses from any links, then you'll have
100 * (1/(1-duration bonus)) * (1/(1-res bonus)) or 237 ehp/s with mindlink and 170 without one. As you can see you'll get twice as much benefit for (both remote and local) repairs with link than without it. These numbers do not take into account stacking penalties that may happen on resistance bonus, but even then you'll get twice the bonus compared to mindlinkless.

Opinions are like assholes. Everybody got one and everyone thinks everyone else's stinks.

Shade Millith
Farmhouse.
Fraternity.
#17 - 2013-04-29 09:56:32 UTC
Mole Guy wrote:

and what about the changes in the new links? are we to choose which implant to boost? great bonuses to armor, but not so much to skirmish because i have the armor implant..example below.


Are they really nerfing T3 from 5% to 2% per level? I'd heard about it sometime last year, but since I haven't heard of anything since, I figured it might have just been a glancing thought.

Kinda invalidates all the training and the cost I spent on getting a Link Loki and Tengu.
Goldiiee
Bureau of Astronomical Anomalies
#18 - 2013-04-29 10:15:19 UTC
Kirimeena D'Zbrkesbris wrote:
Goldiiee wrote:
I use an OGB everyday, both with and without a Mindlink depending on the situation. I am very aware of the benefits and I think your estimation is more of a perception than a reality.

Bonus with mindlink is 35.16%, without 23.44% (to both resistances and repair duration). Lets do some simple math:

lets assume you have 100 ehp/s repair on some ship with 0 resistances before bonuses from any links, then you'll have
100 * (1/(1-duration bonus)) * (1/(1-res bonus)) or 237 ehp/s with mindlink and 170 without one. As you can see you'll get twice as much benefit for (both remote and local) repairs with link than without it. These numbers do not take into account stacking penalties that may happen on resistance bonus, but even then you'll get twice the bonus compared to mindlinkless.

Drop the Tengu, it's no longer a viable base to build your standards from as it already dead and getting buried on the 4th. Use a command ship as your base. and then adjust your totals by .5%.

Then consider that every time CCP Nerfs something it goes from OP (in many peoples eyes) to space junk. All the whiners got their pound of flesh with the CS nerf, let the dust settle from that before you and the rest of the 'Lets Ruin EVE' crowd goes after another item on the 'We lost the battle so lets change EVE list'.

Things that keep me up at night;  Why do we use a voice communication device to send telegraphs? Moore's Law should state, Once you have paid off the last PC upgrade you will need another.

Mole Guy
Bob's Bait and Tackle
#19 - 2013-04-29 10:51:08 UTC
Feligast wrote:
Destroy the old one, put in the new one. How hard is it?



when last i checked, the mining foreman link was almost 1.5 bil.
didnt think that one through did ya?

being a designated booster for fleet is one thing, but when we want to roam, or i want to boost for mining, we cant keep switching back and forth. 24 hour timer and all.
plus having 5 clones lying around all with +4's and a diff mind link in em is gay...

comment made about dropping the power and making the mindlink good for all boosting might be ok depending on how much its lowered.
just an idea.
Salpun
Global Telstar Federation Offices
Masters of Flying Objects
#20 - 2013-04-29 10:56:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Salpun
bad post

If i dont know something about EVE. I check https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/ISK_The_Guide

See you around the universe.

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