Ships & Modules

I wouldn't be caught dead in one of those cardboard and bailing wire contraptions held together with duct-tape and spit...-

Yeah I was busy fixing that post.

Point stands though, I've never seen hail used anywhere except battle clinic to bump up numbers.

Not the same but similar enough that one does not have a glaring advantage and all of them are not teeth kicked by Scorch.


No one says they do not or should not.


An ill-informed person reading this might think so but then again they would be wrong.

I am however saying that:

1. Artillery has "too much" Alpha in comparison to the other 2 Weapons Systems. Whilst Artillery should be an Alpha Weapon it should still not be the "God Choice". DPS from Beams and Rails would need to give an advantage over Artillery that is at this point moot.

2. L Scorch has pretty much killed Rails and Beams. Make Pulses a short range weapon with Arty changes to bring these back on the field.

They should follow a pattern like this:

Artillery: More Alpha (Less then currently)
Beam Laser: DPS Pump and Amarrs current fleet weapon.(Not Scorch)
Rail Gun: Middle ground between DPS and Alpha.

Yes you do. You absolutely positively megatively do.

That is called Rebalancing, not buffing and it is what this game needs more then the ineffective Hybrid Buff I saw. Nerf some buff others, change roles, bonuses and stats. Tweak ships so that when a player looks at a ship they can see 5 different uses for it and when you look at a Race you can pick out which are small gang, solo, fleet, blob, support, tackle, ect.

Didn't read past the first three pages, but here's what I think:

- Atrilleries are more or less fine, tought maybe have too much alpha. It's supposedly countered by lower dps, but depending of the time frame you're taking as a sample, the total can actually be higher than other weapon systems. Maybe a 20% lower alpha is in order, along with a rof increase to keep the same dps.

- Autocanons are out of whack. The things you can do with them are ludicrous. The Tornado, unless changed, will have 89km falloff with barrage and a pair of tracking enhancer (which it can fit without needing to sacrifice anything important). 89km falloff! Didn't some of the fineprint somewhere mention autocanons being a short range weapon?
The second problem with them is that they're dirt-cheap to fit. Which mean you can have a pretty oversized tank on a cruiser/BC-sized powergrid, and don't need to do any compromise to take the biggest AC tier. An armageddon can't use 7 mega pulse lasers + plates + MWD. A Dominix can't fit 6 neutrons + plates + MWD. Yet which minmatar BS has to use 650mm AC because 800mm wouldn't fit? There is none.
Let's look at FOTM ships in the last few years: Dramiel, Machariel, Cynabal, Vaggabond, Ishtar, Drake, Hurricane, Abaddon, Maelstrom. Notice a pattern here?

Yes, two are Minmatar, three are angels (which require Minmatar and Gallente skills), one is Gallente, one is Amarr and one is Caldari. Also, you forgot the Zealot, and the Cane, which would bring that to three Minmatar, two Amarr, one Gallente and Caldari.

From this it becomes obvious where the problem is: Angel faction ships.


Ishtars use sentries or heavies, ffs.

The issue with artillery balance is that fleet doctrines dictate the "in" weapons. Artillery seems overpowered because of alpha fleet. But if you get a hellcat fleet within range of an alphafleet then alphafleet gets torn apart. If blasters were any good they would also counter alphafleets with good warp ins. Rails just have a poor niche, being mediocre in putting strict kinetic damage on target at long range isn't really a good niche to fill and needs to be re-evaluated. At those ranges you need things to die fast, or immediately because either the warpin is a comin, or the target is a warpin'. I will say however it's awfully easy to fit a full rack of 1400's with no real compromise of tank, utility, or damage/tracking mods, even on abaddons *wink wink*.

Even with tracking enhancers barrage is a fairly poor tracker as anyone who's flown a vagabond can attest. That negative is reduced as transversal is reduced at long ranges, but barrage is still not the best in pure DPS, further reduced by a significantly wide gap between optimal and falloff. And don't forget these are large guns we're talking about. I'd be amazed if they can hit anything smaller than a cap, or at least a battleship reliably using barrage if it's moving with any decent speed. Furthermore, the tornado will, if lucky have as good of a buffer tank as the cyclone or hurricane if it even has that. Chances are it will be more like a well tanked Rupture.

Oh and the geddon has little trouble using 7 megapulses with 1600's and all the fixin's, it is a tight fit though needing a 3% pg implant or AWU 5 and a 1% I think, been quite a while since I've flown pvp geddons.

I would not actually be against altering requirements on autocannons and arty's or PG on the ships since it seems silly the only ship that actually has to use 650's for the lack of power is the Vargur. That spirit of balance also says I wouldn't mind them re-evaluating the purple elephant in the room that is scorch.

Only recently i've started to fly minmatar ships but i instanly noticed incredible versatility of autocannons. Superior tracking, falloff, rate of fire makes them definitely most universal. Fact that in mach i can shoot from melee range up to 65km with HAIL is actualy kinda OP and makes autocannons weapon of choice for most PVPiers.
CCP should rly do some small changes to it. (Mby take a bit from projectile weapons and give it to hybrids)

what she said

That combination was only an example. Same thing goes for vargur, cane, sleipnir, vagabond, cynabal....

However mach + "advanced" autocannons are way to strong.

Because you have no idea how to fly it?
Otherwise pulse harby wins all the time

Same with any amarr ship with ACs, they are only better if 1> The guy with lasers have no clue 2> You are putting the ships at point blank range, aka AC perfect range vs lasers. Of course if you are doing this blasters would work even better.