Ships & Modules

What makes the Mackinaw better than the Retriever. (1.) Is the daily yield of the Mackinaw over 15 days. (2.) Is the daily yield of a Retriever over 15 days.

1. [_____][_____][_____][_____][_____][_____][_____][_____][_____][_____][_____][_____][_____][_____][_____]

2. [____][____][____][____][____][____][____][____][____][____][____][____][____][____][____]

The slashed is ISK you would never make in a Retriever period, it comes from the Mackinaw small increase in yield and the time saved making drop offs. Once the slashed ISK earned crosses above the cost of buying the Mackinaw paying off your investment that is pure surplus profit pouring in. That Mackinaw over time earns you profit the Retriever would never ever make in the same amount of man hours.

If you were even fractionally as bright as you imagine yourself to be, you would probably understand a few things already, first and foremost of which is that the game design intentionally attempts to preclude more advanced ships from obsoleting less advanced ships, and that part of that balancing act is the fact that power is not a linear function of price. The consequence of this design decision is that, instead of a set of homogenized, "best" ships that everyone flies because they're clearly so much better than the alternatives, the position of "best" for any given individual varies according to their needs and situation. If Alice wants to do some AFK mining and minimize her loss potential in the case of a suicide gank, she has a good ship for that. If Bob wants to maximize his AFK mining and isn't overly concerned about his loss potential, he has a ship for that, too. This balance keeps a wide variety of ships in space, as opposed to a scenario where one simply outgrows a given ship class in a paltry 40 days and never uses it again.

The second thing is that, in a supply/demand driven market, linearly increasing yield would not actually result in linearly increasing income. If Exhumers had a yield advantage sufficient to obsolete their T1 counterparts, that supply increase would only serve to drive down mineral prices, making barges even more worthless than they would already be in an environment where they were obsoleted by exhumers (and, from experience, we already know that the low entry barrier and attention requirement of mining means that, yes, people would continue to mine, just for less money - we would most assuredly not maintain the current equilibrium prices).

The third really obvious thing that I'm sure you've realized because you're just so gosh-darn space-smart (your mom told you so, right?) is that "yield" is not the only characteristic of a mining ship. With 3 additional med-slots, a resistance bonus, better fitting, and higher base shield, armor, and hull, a Mackinaw can outtank a retriever by an extremely wide margin. Its additional drone bay also allows it to pack both a flight of mining drones and a flight of combat drones, allowing it to enjoy drone yield without having to sacrifice the ability to kill NPC rats.

Finally, I'm at a loss as to how an authentic smart-guy like yourself somehow failed to notice that the yield characteristics of a Mackinaw are very similar to those of a Retriever prior to training for and purchasing one. The stats are quite plainly available and easily compared, even without the benefit of any number of third party fitting applications. The description line stating that the ship is capable of making two strip-miners do the work of three is not unique to the Mackinaw, and is present in the Retriever description, as well.

actually it's 7500. already off to a bad start there.
also, that's not it. look at the ship bonuses, you get 5% more yield. not to mention other base stats being increased.
you're right, it should, however you're wrong because it does.
your yield isn't the same as the retriever, due to the ship's 5% yield bonus.
yes, it is literally the same ship but with it's primary attributes increased. that's how it works going from t1 to t2. how does it make it worth it? well if it's primary stat increases that means it's better at it's intended job.
congratulations you just complained about making more isk, do i need to point out how urgently you need a slap?

you're "disappointed and confused", well so is every one else in this thread. just, not for the same reasons.
oh finally, you make a legitimate point; yes, mining barge yield is too high given the comparison to exhumer yield. that doesn't mean exhumers should have more yield though, barges should just have less.
the 40 days and 200m was to fly a mackinaw.
why only a tiny improvement? because you're picking one non primary attribute of the mackinaw and getting butthurt.

you, are the reason people think miners are idiots. i hope you get ganked.

I'm afraid that that is how everything works.

If you purchase a set of cheap but servicable golf bats with which you can acheive drives of (let's say) 150yrds, you will find that switching out to a very expensive, carbon shaft, diamond studded sticks (worth hundreds of times as much) you will, if you experience any performance increase at all, only gain a few yards on the drive - call it a dozen at most... eight percent.

If you buy an expensive, state-of-the-art, German made assault rifle I'm afraid you won't find that your expendature offers a linear performance increase over a stamped steel, Russian model available for a tiny fraction of its price.

hint: it doesn't. they both have 3 lows.

the difference is 5%.
you're the second person i've corrected on exhumer yield mathematics today.

The Mackinaw is the same ship as a retriever, it is just the T2 version. T2 doesn't mean way bigger yield. Although the Mackinaw does get a 1% per level exhummer bonus the retriever does not. What a T2 Mackinaw does get over its T1 counterpart is better tank, more mid slots, a bigger ore hold, and a slight yield increase. The HULK is the big yield exhummer. it gets +3% per level on mining barge skill plus a +3% per level on exhummers skill. So with mining barge and exhummers skills at 5 the HULK gets 30% increase over base yield while the Mackinaw only gets 5% increase over base yield. Base yield being the same for all mining ships.

Yield of the Mackinaw and Skiff is the same. both only have a 1% per level of exhummers skill to yield. The mackinaw has the big ore hold, while the Skiff has the big tank. Their T1 counter parts the retriever and procurer fit the same roles, just slightly lower specs. What ever mining ship you fly if you have mining barge 5 and only exhummers 1 you will see very little difference between the T1 and T2 ships. But once you have exhummers trained to 4 or 5 you will see a significant difference. The differences become even bigger when you add on a maxed ORCA boost. mining is designed to be a fleet operation, solo mining without boosts produces very little income.

A solo Mackinaw even with maxed skills should bring in 15-17M/hr at best, while a max skilled HULK with maxed ORCA boost can bring in well over 30M/hr. Not a lot of isk considering you can easily make 60M/hr running level 4 missions, but considering how easily mining scales, and how easy is is to solo run a multiple account mining fleet, with several accounts mining becomes more profitable than mission running as running multiple accounts mission running does not scale very well past 2-3 accounts.

So sell it and fly your Retriever.

It's not like you bought a false advertised piece of equipment, everything a Mack is capable of is well documented, yet you manage to continue to find fault in everything and everyone else but yourself while maintaining a claim of higher intelligence the whole time.

what on earth is that procurer fit, it makes my eyes bleed O.O

It's at this point that I call....




TROLL


It's either that or a uniquely disrespectful, reprehensible pseudo-intellectual smart-ass idiot with zero grasp on reality.

Im a long time miner. Dont bother with exhumers until you have at least exhumers 3 preferably 5 and you can use t2 modulated strip miners with the appropriate mining crystal. Dont bother solo mining in a hulk unless your botting (which I dont endorse) Dont bother solo mining for money unless you can dedicate multiple accounts its time/reward ratio is not worth it. When I mined I had 3 characters in hulks and one running an orca. Eventually it just wasn't profitable enough and I decided to spend the extra money on those accounts buying plex instead. Hulks and other exhumers get their best results in a fleet with a fleet boosting orca that can act as a deposit for your ore. When you can consistently mine for hours without leaving the belt because you have an orca that never needs to move because you have the mining range boost form the orca an extra 14% means a helluva lot more then when your warping back to station every 3 minutes to drop your cargo.