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Mach Vs. Navy Domi
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Arazel Chainfire
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#21 - 2013-03-27 18:52:02 UTC
Having flown the mach, the nightmare, and the navy domi all with almost perfect skills (only missing the last 2% from the respecive specialization skills), I can conclusively say that the order I prefer them in is Nightmare>mach>navy domi. Note, I fly all of these in gallente space, and get aroun 50% serpentis+30% angels+19%mercs/drones+1% else in the way of missions.

Essentially, each of them finishes missions in close enough to the same time that I don't really care about the minor difference. However, the navy domi maneuvers like a pig, and working with sentry drones (or any drones really) is a pita. I still use it for running missions like blockade with lots of damping, because sentry's don't care about that, but I prefer not to pull my navy domi out when given the chance.

As for the nightmare/mach, the mach has the advantage in maneuverability and damage type, but I mostly prefer the nightmare because I basically load IN multifrequency and hit F1 while slow-boating it to the next gate. If I ever run out of ammo, I can load regular multifrequency until I feel like motoring on over to a trade hub, where I can pick up enough ammo in a fast frigate to last me for the next year. Compared to the mach, I usually don't bother using faction ammo because of how fast it burns through it, and the extra hassle of getting it where my mission ships live requires using haulers, and then I also need to pick up several types of ammo. So the nightmare wins for me as far as lazyness goes. Also, since I usually dual/triplebox missions, it is a lot easier to control with the slower cycle time of guns across multiple clients.

From my personal experience, if you are only counting the completion time, they are all about the same. Once you take travel time into account, the mach becomes a clear winner, if you don't mind the bit of extra hassle for ammo etc.

For nullsec though, I just use a regular domi. PvE in null for me was more about killing time till the next fleet - not about actually making isk. I have much better ways to be doing that anyways.

-Arazel
Daniel Plain
Doomheim
#22 - 2013-03-27 18:53:42 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
sabre906 wrote:
Daniel Plain wrote:
it does actually. the only question i have is whether the machs dps are really that superior. my EFTfu tells me that a navy domi can get well over 1100 with t2 rails and DDA's etc, with better optimals than a mach, albeit worse falloff.


This is why you don't take advice from EFT warriors.


+1

Daniel,. EFT is like "DPS".

Dps can give you an idea of what will happen in game, but only a very broad idea because there are so many other factors. EFT can't really take every factor into consideration.

For a small example, look at a Tach Nightmare vs an Autocannon Mach (the 2 most common weapons set up for both ships). It would seem the nightmare would win all the time because much of the time it's nit firing in fall-off like the mach, so the machs raw dps advantage is lessened.

In (in-game) reality, the Nightmare suffers from "wasted dps" much more than the mach does. Sometimes it takes a nightmre more than 2-3 shots to kill a BS, the 3rd shot leaving the npc BS in hull. The 4th shot will kill that last 1 or 2 thousand points of structure, but the other 3-4 thousand points of damage the tachs would have done are "lost" (but the guns recycle time remains the same). This can be managed by micro managing ungrouped (or 2 groups of 2) guns, but it can't be totally eliminated.

The mach (and all ships) will lose some of this too, but since the mach is using fast firing damage over time weapons (unlike Tachs, which are alpha weapons) the lost damage affect is greatly lessened. Arty mach on the other hand is one of the worse ships for lost damage, hell , Arty anything really.

There are so many factors that impact success in game play, no tool like EFT is ever going to give more than just a general idea.


thank you for telling me what i have already known for years. do you also have anything to say that is on topic?

P.S.: LOL at grouping nightmare weapons.

I should buy an Ishtar.
Daniel Plain
Doomheim
#23 - 2013-03-27 18:56:51 UTC
Arazel Chainfire wrote:
Having flown the mach, the nightmare, and the navy domi all with almost perfect skills (only missing the last 2% from the respecive specialization skills), I can conclusively say that the order I prefer them in is Nightmare>mach>navy domi. Note, I fly all of these in gallente space, and get aroun 50% serpentis+30% angels+19%mercs/drones+1% else in the way of missions.

Essentially, each of them finishes missions in close enough to the same time that I don't really care about the minor difference. However, the navy domi maneuvers like a pig, and working with sentry drones (or any drones really) is a pita. I still use it for running missions like blockade with lots of damping, because sentry's don't care about that, but I prefer not to pull my navy domi out when given the chance.

As for the nightmare/mach, the mach has the advantage in maneuverability and damage type, but I mostly prefer the nightmare because I basically load IN multifrequency and hit F1 while slow-boating it to the next gate. If I ever run out of ammo, I can load regular multifrequency until I feel like motoring on over to a trade hub, where I can pick up enough ammo in a fast frigate to last me for the next year. Compared to the mach, I usually don't bother using faction ammo because of how fast it burns through it, and the extra hassle of getting it where my mission ships live requires using haulers, and then I also need to pick up several types of ammo. So the nightmare wins for me as far as lazyness goes. Also, since I usually dual/triplebox missions, it is a lot easier to control with the slower cycle time of guns across multiple clients.

From my personal experience, if you are only counting the completion time, they are all about the same. Once you take travel time into account, the mach becomes a clear winner, if you don't mind the bit of extra hassle for ammo etc.

For nullsec though, I just use a regular domi. PvE in null for me was more about killing time till the next fleet - not about actually making isk. I have much better ways to be doing that anyways.

-Arazel


tyvm, that was very informative.

I should buy an Ishtar.
Jenn aSide
Worthless Carebears
The Initiative.
#24 - 2013-03-27 19:15:30 UTC
Daniel Plain wrote:


thank you for telling me what i have already known for years.


You have not demonstrated your understanding, as evidenced by a thread comparing a -Machariel- to a NAVY DOMI then claiming "but EFT says" lol.

Quote:

do you also have anything to say that is on topic?


No, the topic is sensless.

Quote:

P.S.: LOL at grouping nightmare weapons.


Ah, so you've never flown one in PVE outside of high sec. Got ya.
Daniel Plain
Doomheim
#25 - 2013-03-27 19:20:16 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
Daniel Plain wrote:


thank you for telling me what i have already known for years.


You have not demonstrated your understanding, as evidenced by a thread comparing a -Machariel- to a NAVY DOMI then claiming "but EFT says" lol.

Quote:

do you also have anything to say that is on topic?


No, the topic is sensless.

Quote:

P.S.: LOL at grouping nightmare weapons.


Ah, so you've never flown one in PVE outside of high sec. Got ya.

look who is mad. don't mad bro. it's not your fault that you can't read, it's your school system.

I should buy an Ishtar.
Jenn aSide
Worthless Carebears
The Initiative.
#26 - 2013-03-27 19:46:05 UTC
Daniel Plain wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:
Daniel Plain wrote:


thank you for telling me what i have already known for years.


You have not demonstrated your understanding, as evidenced by a thread comparing a -Machariel- to a NAVY DOMI then claiming "but EFT says" lol.

Quote:

do you also have anything to say that is on topic?


No, the topic is sensless.

Quote:

P.S.: LOL at grouping nightmare weapons.


Ah, so you've never flown one in PVE outside of high sec. Got ya.

look who is mad. don't mad bro. it's not your fault that you can't read, it's your school system.


My school system taught me the mach is Awesome and a Navy Domi is a Regular Domi with camoflauge and an extra mid slot + more EHP......

Because my high school taught us to read.
Baggo Hammers
#27 - 2013-03-27 21:42:42 UTC
C'mon guys I like both of you!

A Shield tanked Navy Domi with T2 sentries and Rails can dish out a lot of damage. But I prefer my MWD Mach.

If you don't know where you're going, any road will take you there.
Adoris Nolen
Sama Guild
#28 - 2013-03-28 06:08:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Adoris Nolen
I prefer Domi's. Their ability to scale while multi boxing {3 or more at a time}. Not that useful in most lvl 4 missions though.
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