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Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
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Give Players a Bot

First post
Author
Gallamoth Sickle
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2013-03-23 20:02:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Gallamoth Sickle
This post is to propose a fix to the fact that eve is overrun with botters.

why is this such a big deal?

Because this entire world of eve is basically about making money, lets face it you don get any experience for killing rats or destroying hard to kill bots, or risking ur life for a hard to get asteroid... The only payoff in playing long hours in front of your computer at this game is ISK. The training of your character is completely separate thus making ISK in all the various ways the game allows you to, is the single and only reason to play the game. Now of course you say "Thats not the only reason!". Well yes you play to have fun you play to kill other pilots but in the end you must make vast amounts of ISK to do any of the things in this game that you like to do.
Players that can bot sit in high sec and make large amounts of money with no risk, and now that the mining barges have been changed to make them more resistant to suicide ganks that problem has gotten even worse. There are endless threads about how this game is moving more and more away from low sec and player vs player, to high sec and player vs environment. This statement i think we can all say is true.

"CCP is already hard at work stopping botters!"

First of all there is no way CCP can keep up with detecting and banning botters, they do their best but in the end have failed to make it undesirable to bot, and botting continues for over a decade now... So lets be honest and concede that CCP has failed to mitigate the influence of botting on the market and in turn the game. They have lost the battle and its too important a battle to lose because of as i said in the above paragraph EVE is about making money to do the things you love.

Ok so what can be done to fix it?

I propose a 3-pronged approach to eliminate botters and their 3rd party programs from the game completely.

2) Nerf the mining output of all ships by a flat percentage as this flat percentage nerf will come into play in next step.

1) Add in a type of "Mini-game" to mining.
Something like a power modulation bar. Where you try to keep the power in the center of the optimal mining zone the power modulation bar by hitting some buttons. The power will fluctuate randomly and the player must compensate. Keeping your power in the optimal zone yields bonus % to your mining yield (this compensates for the across the board nerf of mining yield).

3) GIVE EVERYONE A BUILT IN MINING BOT?!?!
Mining is already so boring you can almost feel your brain cells dieing with every cycle of your lasers. This is one of the reasons so many people use mining bots. Its not only because they can make money without being there but because to mine and make any decent usable ISK doing so requires un-godly amounts of mind numbing hours. So give people mining bots that will let them mine and gain reduced ISK per hour than being an active miner and using the modulation bar.
In this way you will basically be giving the player a passive ISK income to mach the passive experience they get. This will allow players to progress forward in the game (buying better ships, equipment) despite having their entire fortune wiped out in a pvp encounter or a mission failure. This will keep players from rage quitting eve and give new players a way to actually be able to afford new ships as they become available through training.
Obviously the devil is in the details by this i mean how much isk someone can make using the bot would have to be greatly reduced from the amount a player can make mining in person at the computer but at least this small trickle of ISK can recoup a players losses over time after a devastating loss of ships. Giving them time to cool off and re group rather then forcing them to sit in front of their computer for 8 hrs a day for the next 5 days just to get back to playing the game they want to play.
Alexa Coates
Coalition Of Misfits
#2 - 2013-03-23 20:03:54 UTC
how bout no

That's a Templar, an Amarr fighter used by carriers.

Gallamoth Sickle
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2013-03-23 20:05:57 UTC
how about you posted that 2 seconds after i posted topic so you didnt even read it
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#4 - 2013-03-23 20:07:39 UTC
Gallamoth Sickle wrote:

1) Add in a type of "Mini-game" to mining.
Something like a power modulation bar. Where you try to keep the power in the center of the optimal mining zone the power modulation bar by hitting some buttons. The power will fluctuate randomly and the player must compensate. Keeping your power in the optimal zone yields bonus % to your mining yield (this compensates for the across the board nerf of mining yield).
…so a bit like mining in Galaxy on Fire?
Gallamoth Sickle
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2013-03-23 20:14:14 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Gallamoth Sickle wrote:

1) Add in a type of "Mini-game" to mining.
Something like a power modulation bar. Where you try to keep the power in the center of the optimal mining zone the power modulation bar by hitting some buttons. The power will fluctuate randomly and the player must compensate. Keeping your power in the optimal zone yields bonus % to your mining yield (this compensates for the across the board nerf of mining yield).
…so a bit like mining in Galaxy on Fire?


i never played that game but if they are already doing something like this then maybe it would work. But this is just an idea and there could be millions of diff ways to do a mini game while mining
Lea Swiftfoot
Kingdom Mauraders Syndicate
#6 - 2013-03-23 20:14:18 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Ezwal
*Snip* Please refrain from personal attacks. ISD Ezwal
First off, mining is very profitable even if you do sit in front of your computer for 8 hours like myself. every haul i make 4 mil, and a haul is every 10 mins. = lots of isk. personally i just like to look at the lasers rip the rotating space rocks apart, and i also look up things on the market while im mining. overall very productive for me. personally i dont like botters and wouldnt want one myself because i get a sense of achievement from my mining. also, you can run missions for isk to replenish your ship losses, or go ratting in belts lower down.
ISD Tyrozan
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
#7 - 2013-03-23 20:18:14 UTC
This topic has been moved to the Features and Ideas Discussion forum.

ISD Tyrozan

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Murk Paradox
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#8 - 2013-03-23 20:31:05 UTC
Considering the pushes for pos changes and what not it might be a bit more feasible to have some sort of "mini pos" to park into a belt and have it mine for you. Like a bot, or PI installation, but at a slower rate than a mining exhumer.

This could also be improved upon by belt content and placement of said mini poses. It would also encourage highsec pvp (wardecs etc) for mining/industrial corps because you could also have defensive measures on them (smaller scale than full poses).

It would help eliminate the bot element (but not end it fully obviously) but also help in regards to market prices without having to worry about running multiple accounts just to fund your pvp pilot.

Since mining seems to be an integral element of eve, and has attracted an undesirable effect from people who do not wish to even play the game themselves.... this COULD be a way to help.

Not to say replace exhumers, leave those in, but it would also help to strip belts faster (more pos, even at slower rate) which would help curtail bots just flying back and forth.

How to apply that to ice, which is where the REAL problem is, is going to take some doing since ice rocks are freakin huge.

Maybe make those poses mine ice only, I dunno.

Feel free to poke holes in this, I'm only being a part of the conversation.

This post has been signed by Murk Paradox and no other accounts, alternate or otherwise. Any other post claiming to be this holder's is subject to being banned at the discretion of the GM Team as it would violate the TOS in regards to impersonation. Signed, Murk Paradox. In triplicate.

Saint Hecate
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#9 - 2013-03-23 20:33:42 UTC
I personally wouldnt call having one miner common nowadays. Id honestly say on average people have more than 1 account especially when mining. The major problem i see with the power modulation thing is its like most anti-bot mechanics, all it does is hurt/annoy the real player while the bot will find a way around it. Its like DRM in piracy. All it does is hurt the legit person.

OP I wont say your idea's are bad as you honestly put effort into thinking everything out but I dont think they will help in the way you expect.
Gallamoth Sickle
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2013-03-23 20:52:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Gallamoth Sickle
Saint Hecate wrote:
I personally wouldnt call having one miner common nowadays. Id honestly say on average people have more than 1 account especially when mining. The major problem i see with the power modulation thing is its like most anti-bot mechanics, all it does is hurt/annoy the real player while the bot will find a way around it. Its like DRM in piracy. All it does is hurt the legit person.

OP I wont say your idea's are bad as you honestly put effort into thinking everything out but I dont think they will help in the way you expect.


you might be right about bots finding a way around a modulation bar but its just an idea there has got to be somethign they can do to make in person mining more entertaining and un replicable by bots.

and you bring up a good point a lot of people have multiple mining accounts and a lot of those people also run bots.... on those accounts while they play their main pvp toon on their main computer. It doesnt take much to have a laptop running on the table with bots while you play main pvp toon all day.

thats just the problem those people that do do mining are ussually the ones that run multi accounts and bots most legit players give up mining all together and run missions for money. This is more of a reason to fix mining as a whole and eliminate botters in my opinion.
Hustomte
The Scope
#11 - 2013-03-23 20:56:40 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Ezwal
*Snip* Please refrain from personal attacks. ISD Ezwal
I have one toon, I mine with my corp (ie other players) and I play Eve with PEOPLE - not bots or myself.

In mission running I fly a Scimitar repping our lowbie corpmates so they can make standings, isk, and LP. They get better ships, learn skills from the older players and generally enjoy Eve Online.

Life is not about money and Eve is not about only isk.
*Snip* Please refrain from personal attacks. ISD Ezwal

...Signature...

ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
#12 - 2013-03-23 22:01:24 UTC
Right, first of, the OP has the right to post an idea to discuss and has the right to expect a civil and healthy discussion as a result. You don't have to agree, but post your arguments in a civil manner please. This goes both ways by the way.

Thread cleaned and reopened.

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ISD Ezwal Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

Jess Tanner
Bangworks Systems Inc.
#13 - 2013-03-23 22:05:57 UTC
Gallamoth Sickle wrote:
how about you posted that 2 seconds after i posted topic so you didnt even read it



no, nor should anyone
Azami Nevinyrall
172.0.0.1
#14 - 2013-03-23 22:14:40 UTC
Gallamoth Sickle wrote:
"CCP is already hard at work stopping botters!"


A simple look at Jita local calls BULLSHIT.

...

Gallamoth Sickle
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#15 - 2013-03-23 22:18:50 UTC
Jess Tanner wrote:
Gallamoth Sickle wrote:
how about you posted that 2 seconds after i posted topic so you didnt even read it



no, nor should anyone


well if you dont like the idea of a game created bot too bad cause your playing a game where everyone with a months supbscription in their bank account has one so...if you want to lvl the playing field for all players and eliminate botting all together id like to hear your alternative and better itdea
Sentamon
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#16 - 2013-03-23 23:46:19 UTC
Mining and EVE overall would be a lot more fun for everyone if you could send out a fleet of mining ships (bots if you will) that people could blow up instead of players sitting in a tanked up barge scared to lose their implants.

Just my 2cents.

~ Professional Forum Alt  ~

Zircon Dasher
#17 - 2013-03-24 00:21:06 UTC
Sentamon wrote:
Mining and EVE overall would be a lot more fun for everyone if you could send out a fleet of mining ships (bots if you will) that people could blow up


Have you met my friend MINING CORP CEO? This has been a semi-lucrative feature for the past decade Lol

Nerfing High-sec is never the answer. It is the question. The answer is 'YES'.

Gallamoth Sickle
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#18 - 2013-03-25 05:06:31 UTC
bump

have the devs said anything about their failure to combat botting and their plans to stop it?
sabre906
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#19 - 2013-03-25 05:45:41 UTC
+1 for bot.Big smile
Shaxx Traitoris
#20 - 2013-03-25 07:26:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Shaxx Traitoris
I can see a mining mini-game quickly becoming more tedious than the current system which allows focus on other monitors to watch YouTube, Netflix and por... tugal.

How to make it interesting? Ramp up the usefulness dramatically of null and low security space mining (which may or may not in fact be coming in Odyssey). The barges will follow and so will the pirate attacks and the need to repulse them.

Mercenaries, corporation mates and bounty hunters would need to rise in response. All of which sounds like a lot of fun for both sides, the miners just wanting to get the haul back to station with all their limbs and the defense force looking to protect their own with their lives.

Mining with real profit is not a solo operation as it is. You use multiple accounts and join mining corporations to help your bottom line. This would just extend it a bit further to require a player versus player alt too standing by and or a new militant wing of your corporation or one hired for the job. That is, if you even want to risk it for the new ramped up profit.

This is the point where you yell 'griefer', but without conflict there are no games or stories to be made and subsequently no entertainment. Without risk things are dull, without an opponent there is no game. Mining is no different than this.

And this is not an alt, I am still playing Skill Training Online at the moment and am simply offering a new player's opinion on the matter.
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