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CCP Any changes to Mining for Winter 2012?

First post First post
Author
rootimus maximus
Perkone
Caldari State
#181 - 2011-10-28 20:50:53 UTC
Elanor Vega wrote:
tier3 BC and destroyer buff is something that mining ships are not prepared for -> T1 ships that are not $$$ and yet get isk from insurance for illegal act and have a lot DPS -> and no changes to mining/miners -> a lot suicide ganks in Hi-sec


You're almost there. The new battlecruisers will hopefully lead to a huge increase in highsec ganking. That in turn will leave a lot of extra miners needing new ships, for which they'll have to pay a bit more money because the minerals they're mining just went up in value. Increased numbers of ships being destroyed (by whatever means) are good for miners.

Unless, of course, you're posting daily on the goonswarm forum to let them know where to come and find you. Twisted
Aquila Draco
#182 - 2011-10-28 21:36:12 UTC
rootimus maximus wrote:
Elanor Vega wrote:
tier3 BC and destroyer buff is something that mining ships are not prepared for -> T1 ships that are not $$$ and yet get isk from insurance for illegal act and have a lot DPS -> and no changes to mining/miners -> a lot suicide ganks in Hi-sec


You're almost there. The new battlecruisers will hopefully lead to a huge increase in highsec ganking. That in turn will leave a lot of extra miners needing new ships, for which they'll have to pay a bit more money because the minerals they're mining just went up in value. Increased numbers of ships being destroyed (by whatever means) are good for miners.

Unless, of course, you're posting daily on the goonswarm forum to let them know where to come and find you. Twisted


all i can say on this... we will see... What?
Severian Carnifex
#183 - 2011-10-28 22:29:07 UTC
rootimus maximus wrote:
Elanor Vega wrote:
tier3 BC and destroyer buff is something that mining ships are not prepared for -> T1 ships that are not $$$ and yet get isk from insurance for illegal act and have a lot DPS -> and no changes to mining/miners -> a lot suicide ganks in Hi-sec


You're almost there. The new battlecruisers will hopefully lead to a huge increase in highsec ganking. That in turn will leave a lot of extra miners needing new ships, for which they'll have to pay a bit more money because the minerals they're mining just went up in value. Increased numbers of ships being destroyed (by whatever means) are good for miners.

Unless, of course, you're posting daily on the goonswarm forum to let them know where to come and find you. Twisted



i dont think thats going to be the best thing for anyone at the end...
Hobogear
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#184 - 2011-10-28 22:31:07 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Apollo Gabriel wrote:
Tippia wrote:
If they could solve the latency issues, they should just blatantly steal Galaxy of Fire's mining minigame.
Can you find a youtube vid for me? I don't even know what I'm looking for and feeling lazy.
This. Basically, it's a game of “keep the reticle within the circle” where the circle keeps shrinking as you suck up more ore, and the reticle keeps bouncing around, trying to get away from the centre of the circle.

Better mining drills gives you more control (by slowing the slippage down and/or by increasing your ability to push back). More valuable ores can be had by first stripping away the outer layers and then drill at the core, when the circle is at its absolute smallest.

If you're too slow/hamfisted to control the drill, it slips outside the drill zone and starts overheating. Overheat too much, and the whole asteroid explodes, making you lose all the ore from it. At any time, you can simply stop and collect however much you've extracted so far (so if you're about to explode, it's better to just take what little you have, rather than try to fight for control and lose it all). Once you've stopped drilling — either by overheating, by interrupting the process, or by finishing up with the core drilling, the asteroid is no longer available for further attempts until it respawns. Of course, a lot of these details are matched to how GoF handles respawns and availability in general (it's an SP game so you have no real competition, and no-one gets upset if you just blow every last rock to pieces), so all of it isn't exactly directly transferrable to EVE… but some of the basic ideas might work.



I dont mine so it doesnt matter much to me other than i want more people to play eve so i like this idea. Maybe if they had two options. old style mining lower yeild or a style like that video where you could maximize your take in. Maybe even have gold or other precious metals come from the rock if you use a more percise mining style.
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
#185 - 2011-10-28 23:49:08 UTC
rootimus maximus wrote:
You're almost there. The new battlecruisers will hopefully lead to a huge increase in highsec ganking. That in turn will leave a lot of extra miners needing new ships, for which they'll have to pay a bit more money because the minerals they're mining just went up in value. Increased numbers of ships being destroyed (by whatever means) are good for miners.

Unless, of course, you're posting daily on the goonswarm forum to let them know where to come and find you. Twisted


The destroyer buff will lead to more ganking of exhumers. This will be bad for subscriptions as people cancel their mining accounts due to lack of profit. This will be good for those miners who stick around, but bad for CCP's financial situation.

Some folks will insist that EVE is not an AFK game and mining should not be done semi-AFK, in that case we should take away T1 manufacture, T2 invention, gas reaction, moon harvesting and other similar activities.

In the meantime, just be aware that killing all the fish in the ocean might mean there are no fish left, and no ocean to swim in.
Richard Hammond II
Doomheim
#186 - 2011-10-28 23:56:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Richard Hammond II
Make it so that when you start mining, anyone in a gank fit ship gets a message and a bookmark


lol thats just bad trollin sorry lol

Bah the new BCs are designed to be gank ships. Its safer to mine in 0.0 than it is in highsec now.

Goons; infiltration at its best - first bob... now ccp itself. They dont realize you guys dot take this as "just a game". Bring it down guys, we're rooting for you.

Mr LaForge
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#187 - 2011-10-29 00:27:31 UTC
Make it so the asteroids deploy defenses and throw rocks at you.

Its time Asteroids took a rock hard stand against this aggression.

Stuff Goes here

Richard Hammond II
Doomheim
#188 - 2011-10-29 00:54:12 UTC
Mr LaForge wrote:
Make it so the asteroids deploy defenses and throw rocks at you.

Its time Asteroids took a rock hard stand against this aggression.


Introduce collision damage an they throw themselves at you lol

Goons; infiltration at its best - first bob... now ccp itself. They dont realize you guys dot take this as "just a game". Bring it down guys, we're rooting for you.

Avila Cracko
#189 - 2011-10-29 06:35:47 UTC
bump

truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth.

Shamza
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#190 - 2011-10-29 07:34:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Shamza
I would recomment CCP check Galaxy on Fire 2 game for iOS. There is very simple but invovling mining system which would work perfectly for EVE. In short watch this video starting at 8:55

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bnCrw4ahldY
Masamune Dekoro
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#191 - 2011-10-29 08:42:42 UTC
Dont make miners work harder, make them smarter.

The probing/scanning 'minigame' could easily be adapted to mining roids too; scan down the best part of each roid to maximise yield. No gimmicky skilltest flash game required, just a short intuitive test for each new asteroid.
Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
#192 - 2011-10-29 08:50:40 UTC
Keep in mind that there is nothing you can do mechanics wise to stop and/or hinder bots that will not impact human players .. for an anti-bot to be effective you'd have to make life absolutely horrendous for legitimate players and thus kill that part of the game entirely.
Better to focus on making mining more fun/engaging so that people can stand it without having to resort to EULA violations .. let CCP do their bot handling in the background with whatever tools and reports they get.

Copy/Paste from a thread of mine on the now defunct forums:
Me wrote:
Something that has always bothered me with the mining system we have now is that it is too tree-huggery.
Mankind's methodology for extracting ore has always been: nuke everything and sift through the rubble. But Eve has surgical lasers gentle enticing rocks to hand over their valuables?

I propose we base it on one of the greatest games ever created: Asteroids!
Not only does it make more sense, but it will make militarized mining ops viable and mining in general more "fun".

Basic concept;
- All rocks break apart when subjected to brute force. Once they are gravel/dust they can be collected.
- Any force (DPS) will do. Strip Miners are attributed 1k DPS or there about. Gravel/dust clouds dissipate over time.
- [New module] Wide Tractor Field Array.
Exactly what it says on the tin, not strong enough to move larger solid objects (cans/wrecks), covers a conical area in target direction.
- WTFA are only usable on Rorqual/Orca and T1/T2 Mining Barge's. Rorqual/Orca are given bonuses to the size/speed of the field in place of or in addition to regular tractor bonuses.

Extra/Optional:
- [New Bomb] Gravitational Shear Bomb.
Designed to tear apart porous solid objects (refined metal = ships = denser). Honours the age-old tradition of throwing explosives at a problem.

And there it is, outline anyway. Protection details need never be bored to tears (probably still bored though), Rorqual's get a reason to join the belt parties and door is opened for hostile's to burn the fields.
Severian Carnifex
#193 - 2011-10-30 00:20:56 UTC
bump
Gheng Kondur
Serva Fidem
#194 - 2011-10-30 05:19:06 UTC
Just a comment on the tier 3 BCs, we will have to wait and see how they pan out, but if more expensive to build than a hulk, I can't see many people using them in that way.

If CCP also took on the "no insurance from concord kills" line even less likely unless a major grudge happening.

Hulks would need to be buffed to cope with the alpha strike from current ships before a tier 3 BC would become a viable option anyway, as they will no doubt cost more than the current gank ships.

I have no problem with a Hulk being dead to a alpha strike gank, as long as the ship costs and losses are comparable, which should be hulk loss after insurance being around the same as gank ship without insurance payout. We should then keep a convinient salvage ship in system and race for the salvage rights.
Wooly Akachi
What Could Go Wrong
Northern Coalition.
#195 - 2011-10-30 07:02:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Wooly Akachi
I think there should be some form of belt class.

B1 - current static belts
B2 - belts with "moving roids"
B3 - belts with "fast" moving roids that can damage your ship if they hit (only destroyable with non mining equipment ie missiles, drones, normal wepons)
B4 - belts which are a "blizzard" of crap wich require a lot of firepower to take down.

the B3 and B4 would belts would be very bad for bolts. make it iteresting for the CAP fleet (maybe small amount of minerals dropped, minerals would disperse after a min or 2 "cans timeout"). the rewards need to be worked out but hey mining would be fun!

just my 2 isk.
Halcyon Ingenium
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#196 - 2011-10-30 07:34:25 UTC
Make asteroid fields and ice comets that have to be scanned down. (And be sure you actually change the names from belt to field or comet. Asteroid belts were never belts.)
Make the warp in point for these fixed like in a mission.
Cruiser sized rats.
Names that reveal asteroid type removed, lets make ore scanners useful.
Also maybe mix ore types found in a single roid.
No minigames for mining; this can be botted quite easily.

By the way, since we're already talking, do you want to buy a rifter? I've got the cheapest rifters in Metropolis. If you can find a cheaper rifter, buy it!

Freeqa
Elite Space Brothers
#197 - 2011-10-30 08:01:17 UTC
Some of my thought:

- Make insurance doesn't pay out when concorded,
- Want Buffer mining ship ? Train BS lvl 3 and enjoy (fast enough to train and cheaper than T2 mining barge),
- New mining barge with cov ops cloak and probe launcher for exploration,
- A system like PI scan on roid (only on the bigger ones ?) in order to increase the mining amount in the first minutes.
Severian Carnifex
#198 - 2011-10-30 21:02:24 UTC
bump
Apollo Gabriel
Mercatoris
#199 - 2011-10-30 21:54:11 UTC
What I don't like about Suicide Ganking is that you have to wait for them to shoot before you get to do anything to them. If you dock up, you're effectively allowing them to bully you. If you swap to a BS, you are still letting them push you around. I wish there were other options for the miner who wanted to mine (not that I understand taht I don't mine as it's dull).
Always ... Never ... Forget to check your references.   Peace out Zulu! Hope you land well!
Viktor von Steiner
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#200 - 2011-10-30 22:34:30 UTC
This thread has a lot of good ideas how to make mining more entertaining, harder to automate for bots and at the same time still preserve the economic balance (same amount of ore enters the market) and the social group aspect. I'm a big fan of having to scan down all the belts and removing static belts, any noob these days learns how to scan down a grav site in the tutorial so that's not a game breaker.

CCP is often defending their long developing time for new systems with the explaining, that "the system has to be reusable somewhere else"; they said that about incursions, sleeper ai, planetary interaction and carbon ui.

Why not make surveying asteroids more interesting, by reusing the planetary interaction scanning system and apply it to asteroids. Basically you would have to "survey" a locked asteroid and play around with the sliders to identify what it contains and where to aim your laser at. This also goes well with the before mentioned idea of having veins inside the asteroids.