Ships & Modules

Hello, newb here.

While focusing on economics for the time being, eventually I will switch into training ships and combat skills and what not. I already have basic Amarr frigs and destroyers. The next step would be cruisers I guess (which are needed anyway for battleships, if I'm not mistaken). So the decision is whether to go ahead and train Amarr cruisers when I make this upcoming training switch, or cross train into something else.

At any rate, I've read quite a bit of stuff about how Amarr cruisers suck. But the thing is, a lot of the stuff I read was dated. I'm not sure if things have changed with recent re-balancing and tiericide.

On another note, I have read a few times that Amarr has decent battleships and capital ships. But it was just a few quips - don't know how accurate it was.

Questions:

1. What is the current consensus out there on Amarr cruisers? Do they still suck? Or have they been brought up to the level of other cruisers, roughly?

2. What is the current consensus on Amarr battleships and capitals?

Up to this point been fairly non-committal in my training, only training basic Amarr frigs, destroyer, and energy turret level I. Other than that I've stuck to things like industry, or ship skills that affect ships of all races. The point is, I can cross train without losing much in terms of investment, if that is the best thing to do.

I'm not going to ask "which are the best ships" or "which ships should I use," as I'm sure these questions have been beaten around the forums like a dead horse. I will simply ask the questions above, and then present you my meta-plan below for approval or commentary.

Meta plan:

If Amarr cruisers are still deemed to suck, and Amarr battleships/capitals are anywhere from 'suck' to 'not any better than anything else out there,' I will consider training into another race.

If Amarr cruisers are still deemed to suck, but Amarr battleships/capitals are anywhere from 'quite good' to 'outstanding,' I will consider going ahead and training Amarr cruisers, since I eventually plan to be in battleships and capitals anyway.

If Amarr cruisers are deemed to be decent at this juncture, I will go ahead and train into them.

How does this meta plan sound?

Thanks for all your help!

Is this because their suckiness dissipated because of recent rebalancing efforts and tiericide, or are you saying they never sucked?

I'm told the Omen makes an excellent nano ship now, the thing's quick which should allow it to make use of energy weapon range.

do not even consider capitals when training for early t1 subcaps. CCP is reducing the sub-cap skill requirements for getting into capitals. The performance of the archon and revelation should have no bearing on your choice.

before cruiser tiericide, amarr only had one good t1 cruiser, the arbitrator. Now they're a lot better. Their t2 cruisers have always been good, with the recon ships being particularly nasty. Amarr BC's have also gotten a boost whereas before they were inferior. Energy turrets have some interesting things to them, but like an above poster said, they're not so great for PVE, (mostly because they suck capacitor, and are bad against anything that isn't blood raider, sansha, or rogue drone). good damage projection and instant ammo switching a big plus, however. One thing to note about amarr ships, is that they're completely armor focused, while gallente/minmatar ships can often go both ways. The amarr armor resistance bonus is much stronger than the rep bonus some gallente ships have.

Ehhh.....

Well, the proph is better....

So if I may be so bold, I will attempt to state the 'consensus' position here?

- Amarr cruisers don't suck.
- Amarr battlecruisers... aren't as bad as they once were.
- Don't worry about which cruisers to get into for sub-cap, if your eventual goal is cap.
- Amarr has a good drone boat cruiser.
- However... drone boats aren't so good for PvE? (don't think I've heard that one before, in fact I think I've heard the opposite?)

Bottom line: If someone is already trained into Amarr frigs/destroyers, nothing wrong with going ahead and training Amarr cruisers.

You're living in the past. Rifters suck, the rupture is meh now, the hurricane is suck, maelstrom not used as much in fleet. Cyclone is ok, thrasher good. Gallente has a much more impressive sub-cap lineup now. Amarr are ok I guess for now, but in answer to OP I would go gallente- their caps are arguably the best too.

Negative comments on drones for PVE are "in" right now. They are the product of an overreaction to CCP's recent NPC AI changes. NPCs now switch aggro to drones. The wailing and gnashing of teeth is in full swing.

The truth is, however, that the new drone mods in combination with drone-bonused hulls make for very effective L2 and L3 mission runners. Hammerhead IIs and Hobgoblin IIs are all you need. Heavy drones are less practical. I have been using an untanked MWD Algos for L2s (fly out to 40k and juggle the drone aggro) and it's not just fast it's *gasp* fun. Cookie-cutter Vexor shreds L3s.

Meh drones aren't as bad for missioning as people are saying, in lower level missions there isn't that much dps/ewar on the field and you'll normally lose alot less drones (I grinded L2s in an Arbitrator recently and I lost like 1 drone every 10 missions), in higher level missions you should be using sentry drones which can be instascooped and redeployed which helps alot and you should use lights/mediums only when the rats are close by so you can usually pull them in time. Sure you'll lose a drone a two here and there, but it's not going to cut into your profits very badly, in fact it's comparable to buying ammo for other type of weapons, my tengu can burn a million isk of ammo per mission easily which equates to guaranteed losing 1 drone every mission.