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-3 attributes. Remap?

Author
Osiris Andras
Intergalactic Space Maoris
#1 - 2013-02-28 07:53:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Osiris Andras
If this isn't the appropriate sub forum please move.

So, I recently started this character back up again after abour 4 years. In other words, he was last active before learning skills were removed

He currently has
26 Int
20 Per
19 Char
30 Willpower
24 Memory

(Full set of +4's)

If I go to remap I have -3 attribute points. He was originally assigned attributes out of ignorance and then focussed on Leadership since WP used to be the primary modifier (now its Charisma. wtf)

Question: Remap? This character is still focussing on fleet leadership, lvl 4 missions and eventually I'll get into PVP (ie he's a pilot not a miner/trader/industrialist)
MuraSaki Siki
ChuangShi
Fraternity.
#2 - 2013-02-28 08:20:28 UTC
if you remap, you need to fill back the pool, so you will lose 3 point,

Therefore, you should leave your leadership skills behind, after train up others skills, rush in char and train leadership

Osiris Andras
Intergalactic Space Maoris
#3 - 2013-02-28 08:29:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Osiris Andras
MuraSaki Siki wrote:
if you remap, you need to fill back the pool, so you will lose 3 point,

Therefore, you should leave your leadership skills behind, after train up others skills, rush in char and train leadership



I know I'll lose three attribute points but seeing as WP is not a primary modifier for any skills, am I gimping myself by not remapping for perception? Are those three extra points really worth keeping if the distribution is that wonky? Most of the skills I need to focus on at the moment are gunnery, drones and EWAR

Leadership skills are very established already so I should correct my statement by saying he won't be training hugely into leadership any tiime soon
Sable Moran
Moran Light Industries
#4 - 2013-02-28 09:32:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Sable Moran
1. Charisma has always been the primary attribute for leadership skills.

2. Willpower is primary for T2 ship skills, so it's not entirely useless.

Check this: http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Attributes#Skills_and_Attributes

Please note that that list is _not_ 100% accurate. There are many anomalies e.g. the already mentioned T2 ship skills but also the jump clone skill in Science and a few whole categories.

One more thing, those -3 points. You do not lose them, it's just that you do not get to decide where they end up to.

Sable's Ammo Shop at Alentene V - Moon 4 - Duvolle Labs Factory. Hybrid charges, Projectile ammo, Missiles, Drones, Ships, Need'em? We have'em, at affordable prices. Pop in at our Ammo Shop in sunny Alentene.

MuraSaki Siki
ChuangShi
Fraternity.
#5 - 2013-02-28 10:32:10 UTC
Sable Moran wrote:
1. Charisma has always been the primary attribute for leadership skills.

2. Willpower is primary for T2 ship skills, so it's not entirely useless.

Check this: http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Attributes#Skills_and_Attributes

Please note that that list is _not_ 100% accurate. There are many anomalies e.g. the already mentioned T2 ship skills but also the jump clone skill in Science and a few whole categories.

One more thing, those -3 points. You do not lose them, it's just that you do not get to decide where they end up to.


oh, thanks for correct my mind in "-3" point.
Osiris Andras
Intergalactic Space Maoris
#6 - 2013-03-02 05:33:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Osiris Andras
Sable Moran wrote:
1. Charisma has always been the primary attribute for leadership skills.


I could have sworn back in 2007 it was willpower... anyway that doesn't matter

Sable Moran wrote:
One more thing, those -3 points. You do not lose them, it's just that you do not get to decide where they end up to.


Really? Because the bar at the bottom of the remap shows -3, then if I take points out of willpower, say 5 of them, then click on the + sign for perception, it only lets me put 2 in. I reckon MuraSaki Siki is right - I will lose those 3 points if I remap

I want to know if others have experienced this and if the 3 points will make a noticable difference if they're stuck in willpower.
Sable Moran
Moran Light Industries
#7 - 2013-03-05 16:47:09 UTC
Osiris Andras wrote:
Sable Moran wrote:
One more thing, those -3 points. You do not lose them, it's just that you do not get to decide where they end up to.


Really? Because the bar at the bottom of the remap shows -3, then if I take points out of willpower, say 5 of them, then click on the + sign for perception, it only lets me put 2 in. I reckon MuraSaki Siki is right - I will lose those 3 points if I remap

I want to know if others have experienced this and if the 3 points will make a noticable difference if they're stuck in willpower.


There is a minimum value for attributes (currently 19 I believe, not quite sure though) . Previously in eve history it was possible to create characters whose attributes were lower than that. So if you are now remapping such a character you have now choice but to assign some of your points to that attribute hence why I said you don't get to decide where they go.

A 'classic' example I guess is the caldari acura, you could make a very low charisma acura character back then and to this date some people have refrained from making attribute respec on those characters.

There were other bloodlines like that too e.g. Gallente Intaki with a very low perception attribute.

Hope this clarifies the situation for you.

Sable's Ammo Shop at Alentene V - Moon 4 - Duvolle Labs Factory. Hybrid charges, Projectile ammo, Missiles, Drones, Ships, Need'em? We have'em, at affordable prices. Pop in at our Ammo Shop in sunny Alentene.

Storm Novah
Yada Industries
#8 - 2013-03-05 23:25:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Storm Novah
Sable Moran wrote:
There is a minimum value for attributes (currently 19 I believe, not quite sure though) .

Base stats for a new toon is 19 for Charisma and 20 for the rest. Thats without remap or implants.
Kimimaro Yoga
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#9 - 2013-03-10 07:11:02 UTC
The minimum # of points you can have in a stat under the current system is 17.
Looking at your current remap and assuming +4's in every attribute, it appears you have -1 in perc and -2 in char. If you remap you will have to fill those back in.
That said, at the moment you have the same 99 points as a new player, and 20 from implants. The sole advantage you currently have is three extra points moved around that couldn't be moved otherwise. Is that helping you? Not that I can see. The highest you have is willpower at 30, which is the primary attribute for T2 ship skills... but those skills have Perc secondary, and your perc is extra-low at 20. So you'd be getting 2400 SP/hr training those T2 ship skills ((30 + 20/2)*60). A player with the default uniform remap and +4 implants would be getting ((24 + 24/2)*60) = 2160. On the other hand, if you had an optimal 10 will and 4 perc remap, with +4's, you would be getting ((31 + 25/2)*60) = 2610 SP/hr.

If you were to train int/mem skills, which there are many of, you would be getting 2280 SP/hr, when you could be getting 2610. Anything else is even worse. Essentially the problem with your current remap is that its two best stats are will and int, and there are no will/int skills. Then you've also got SP in a third stat. So there is no single skill that actually takes advantage of those three extra relocated points you have, and no skill that uses your two highest stats at the same time. The only skills that you really can train well right now are T2 ship skills. For anything else you'd be better off coming up with a plan and remapping... even a generic 7 int/ 7 perc remap would make most skills train as well or better than what you currently have.

Time to make a plan and remap. Also, get skill planning software like Evemon.

Now recruiting: http://dogfacedesign.com/index.php/Recruiting-Posters/recruiting-poster-patr3

Osiris Andras
Intergalactic Space Maoris
#10 - 2013-03-14 04:49:02 UTC
Kimimaro Yoga wrote:
The minimum # of points you can have in a stat under the current system is 17.
Looking at your current remap and assuming +4's in every attribute, it appears you have -1 in perc and -2 in char. If you remap you will have to fill those back in.
That said, at the moment you have the same 99 points as a new player, and 20 from implants. The sole advantage you currently have is three extra points moved around that couldn't be moved otherwise. Is that helping you? Not that I can see. The highest you have is willpower at 30, which is the primary attribute for T2 ship skills... but those skills have Perc secondary, and your perc is extra-low at 20. So you'd be getting 2400 SP/hr training those T2 ship skills ((30 + 20/2)*60). A player with the default uniform remap and +4 implants would be getting ((24 + 24/2)*60) = 2160. On the other hand, if you had an optimal 10 will and 4 perc remap, with +4's, you would be getting ((31 + 25/2)*60) = 2610 SP/hr.

If you were to train int/mem skills, which there are many of, you would be getting 2280 SP/hr, when you could be getting 2610. Anything else is even worse. Essentially the problem with your current remap is that its two best stats are will and int, and there are no will/int skills. Then you've also got SP in a third stat. So there is no single skill that actually takes advantage of those three extra relocated points you have, and no skill that uses your two highest stats at the same time. The only skills that you really can train well right now are T2 ship skills. For anything else you'd be better off coming up with a plan and remapping... even a generic 7 int/ 7 perc remap would make most skills train as well or better than what you currently have.

Time to make a plan and remap. Also, get skill planning software like Evemon.


This is exactly the response I was after - thanks you muchly