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I iz confuzed
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Allyourisk Are Belongtous
Doomheim
#1 - 2013-02-28 05:22:25 UTC
Hi all, please help an industry newbie with a little problem. Kindly refer to this screenshot: http://dl.eve-files.com/media/1302/confusionreigns.jpg

As part of the tutorials I was given a 5-run Navitas blueprint which I decided to build, not so much to make a profit off it (I'll be making a loss) than just to have done it and learn about Industry Stuff.

From the screenshot you can see the mineral requirements for me and my skills, which are of course less than perfect. What you can't see from the screenie (silly me) is that I had slightly more than 5x of each of the minerals I should have needed .

When I tried to build the ships however, I was presented with the quote you can see in the screenie. Where before the "Extra Materials" requirement was zero, now I had to bring in some more Extra Materials.

I just can't figure out what I'm missing here. If some kind soul could explain that to me I would rather appreciate it. Thanks.
Skorpynekomimi
#2 - 2013-02-28 11:00:07 UTC
The 'extra materials' are just something that got added to all frigate/cruiser blueprints in a patch a while back.

Essentially, your calculations were wrong. Rework your spreadsheet and try again.

Economic PVP
Ifly Uwalk
Perkone
Caldari State
#3 - 2013-02-28 11:50:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Ifly Uwalk
Again, the "Extra Materials" needed was zero. Not that I would actually use a spreadsheet for this, but if I were to use one, regardless which one, it would still return a zero.

I thought that was obvious from the screenshot and the OP but maybe not. Show Info - no Extra Materials needed; get quote - some Extra Materials needed.

Why - that's what I'm trying to figure out.

Edit: alt-poasting ftw. vOv
Elena Thiesant
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2013-02-28 12:03:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Elena Thiesant
If you did a show info on the blueprint, it doesn't distinguish between normal and extra materials. It's only on the quote screen that they're shown separately. (For T1 ships that is)

I seem to recall there is/was a bug in the material amounts so that the BP shows less than actually required. Can't recall details though
Lady Ayeipsia
BlueWaffe
#5 - 2013-02-28 19:31:04 UTC
Elena Thiesant wrote:
If you did a show info on the blueprint, it doesn't distinguish between normal and extra materials. It's only on the quote screen that they're shown separately.

I seem to recall there is/was a bug in the material amounts so that the BP shows less than actually required. Can't recall details though


As of last night, this did not seem true. I was looking at t2 200mm acs & t2 280mm howies.

For the howies, all materials were listed as extra. For the ace, only the minerals were listed as normal. All othwe components were listed as extra.
Elena Thiesant
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2013-02-28 21:34:22 UTC
Lady Ayeipsia wrote:
Elena Thiesant wrote:
If you did a show info on the blueprint, it doesn't distinguish between normal and extra materials. It's only on the quote screen that they're shown separately.

I seem to recall there is/was a bug in the material amounts so that the BP shows less than actually required. Can't recall details though


As of last night, this did not seem true. I was looking at t2 200mm acs & t2 280mm howies.

For the howies, all materials were listed as extra. For the ace, only the minerals were listed as normal. All othwe components were listed as extra.


That's T2 blueprints.
Go look at the materials for a Vexor (a ship that has had extra materials since December). It shows all the minerals under the materials category and the Extra Materials list is empty. Go to build one though and you get a breakdown that has minerals of all types in both materials and extra materials.
http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/blueprints/0/626/0/5/0/5

The blueprints only show extra materials properly when those materials aren't also in the base materials. So T2 blueprints show the distinction correctly, the T1 ships don't.
Bridgette d'Iberville
Better Killing Through Chemistry
#7 - 2013-02-28 22:24:56 UTC
I had the same problem with the tutorial a few months ago. You can see my post (with attached screenshot) here:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2377415#post2377415

I submitted a bug report. First time they said it wasn't a bug. I reopened the case and they decided that it was indeed a bug (and that they knew about it. How quaint...)

"I considered a career in griefing, but then realized that I would never achieve the level of tear generation that CCP manages to do each and every expansion."
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#8 - 2013-03-01 00:53:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Vincent Athena
Look at isogen in the BPC: 251 needed
Multiply by 5: 1255
Multiply by 1.25 (skill based multiplier) : 1569

Now add the two isogen values in the quote window: 1565

The 4 unit difference is round off errors. Conclusion: The number on the BPC is the sum of the two numbers listed in the quote window. The BPC is not hiding any extra material requirements, the one number it gives you is the true total.

The only bug I see is the statement

Isogen - [You: 251 - Perfect: 250]

It should be [You: 313 - Perfect: 250] to properly account for the skill level. As it is its only accounting for the quality of the BPC.

The work around is bring an extra 25%, reducing as you train up skill.

Know a Frozen fan? Check this out

Frozen fanfiction
Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
#9 - 2013-03-01 16:26:10 UTC
Ifly Uwalk wrote:
Again, the "Extra Materials" needed was zero. Not that I would actually use a spreadsheet for this, but if I were to use one, regardless which one, it would still return a zero.

I thought that was obvious from the screenshot and the OP but maybe not. Show Info - no Extra Materials needed; get quote - some Extra Materials needed.

Why - that's what I'm trying to figure out.

Edit: alt-poasting ftw. vOv

Obviously the extra materials are not zero, or they would not be on the build quote.

The issue is the extra materials that were added to the BP's of almost all the ships that have been "balanced" were not listed on the BP's as extra materials. The materials required in the build quote are corre3ct, it is just an issue of the BPO's and BPC's not being properly updated when the ship changes were made.

Since CCP considers manufacturing characters to be a minority in the game they are in no hurry to fix this issue that affects such a "small: number of players.

You can put this in a can along with the POS mechanics and label it as hopefully fixed within the next couple years.
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#10 - 2013-03-02 20:21:10 UTC
Ifly Uwalk wrote:
Again, the "Extra Materials" needed was zero. Not that I would actually use a spreadsheet for this, but if I were to use one, regardless which one, it would still return a zero.

I thought that was obvious from the screenshot and the OP but maybe not. Show Info - no Extra Materials needed; get quote - some Extra Materials needed.

Why - that's what I'm trying to figure out.

Edit: alt-poasting ftw. vOv


Extra materials aren't and haven't ever been listed separately on the BPO show info window. They only get separated out when you get your quote.

They probably should be, but they're not.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon