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Need help with my solo Omen
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Denuo Secus
#1 - 2013-02-14 10:34:09 UTC
Hi all,

I really want to use the Omen for solo PvP. But my current experience is rather mixed. Primary reason: frigs. As soon as a somewhat tanky but speedy frig manages it under my guns the Omen is toast. Non-bonused drones don't help much here.

Since most frigs are twice as fast as my Omen it's very risky to stay on the field as soon as a frig appears. The time frame from locking the frig to getting caught is very small.

Avoiding frigs isn't a cool solution imho. I'd prefer a way to deal with them instead. When solo I'm outnumbered most of the time. No problem as long as I'm able to kite. But beeing outnumbered means I'm facing mixed gangs most of the time. So frigs are part of the party almost every time.

My goal is a semi-kiting tactics depending on the target. Keeping range if possible, when not switch to brawling mode. I think this is a great benefit of the armor Omen: it can kite and brawl at the same time. I tried the shield Omen as well. It is nice for pure kiting but I don't like the lack of tank. The shield-nano Omen is that fragile...as soon as something with a good dmg projection enters the field I need to warp very soon.

Any hint? Is it doable or are Amarr drone boats the only way to fly this faction solo?
ITTigerClawIK
Galactic Rangers
#2 - 2013-02-14 10:54:55 UTC
useualy find fitting a web solves the problem.
Denuo Secus
#3 - 2013-02-14 11:12:59 UTC
ITTigerClawIK wrote:
useualy find fitting a web solves the problem.


No, does not. Did you actually try it? If so pls tell me how you got it working.

My experience with web on the Omen: pulse lasers have bad tracking in general. One web doesn't help much here. For comparison: a Thorax which uses the best tracking turrets + has a tracking bonus on top needs two webs to hit frigs orbiting close range. And here we have the second issue with the Omen: not enough med slots to fit dual web.

Also: fitting a web would limit the Omen's viability against equally sized targets. The Omen really needs a cap booster - at least if I want to use it as (semi-)kiter.
Danny John-Peter
Blue Canary
Watch This
#4 - 2013-02-14 11:14:01 UTC
The nano Omen is a pretty effective slayer of frigates, however its cap is really, really bad, you could fit a web I guess but its not ideal do to the limited slots.

Have you looked at the nomen, good buffer, goes 1.5/2.2M/s, does 380 DPS out to the edge of point range with scorch and has a neut.

[Omen Navy Issue, Nerds Be Hazin]
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
True Sansha Adaptive Nano Plating
Damage Control II

Experimental 10MN Microwarpdrive I
Warp Disruptor II
Small Capacitor Booster II, Navy Cap Booster 400

Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I

Medium Ancillary Current Router I
Medium Ancillary Current Router I
Medium Energy Locus Coordinator II


Warrior II x5
Cal Stantson
17eme Chasseurs a Cheval
#5 - 2013-02-14 11:39:37 UTC
ECM Drones are the only real way to deal with a fast, tanky frigate when you're flying a kite Omen. It at least allows you to get off field. Now, I know you said you're looking to deal with them without running away, but running away from things you can't take it the biggest part of small scale PvP. If you want to be able to engage bigger things and not have to run away from frigates, you're not looking for an Omen fit, you're looking for magic.
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#6 - 2013-02-14 11:42:37 UTC
ECM drones and mwd.



But even with that the omen really is a do or die ship.

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

W0lf Crendraven
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2013-02-14 11:46:32 UTC
Fly a shield omen, learn to win in under 1 minute.
Denuo Secus
#8 - 2013-02-14 12:56:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Denuo Secus
Cal Stantson wrote:
ECM Drones are the only real way to deal with a fast, tanky frigate when you're flying a kite Omen. It at least allows you to get off field. Now, I know you said you're looking to deal with them without running away, but running away from things you can't take it the biggest part of small scale PvP. If you want to be able to engage bigger things and not have to run away from frigates, you're not looking for an Omen fit, you're looking for magic.


I just don't like ECM drones. They are unreliable. Maybe I'm just bad with dices ^^ It's so sad when I have a really cool fight and lose because of a random number generator. On the other hand: it would be very cool if web, neut or TP drones would be useable.

W0lf Crendraven wrote:
Fly a shield omen, learn to win in under 1 minute.


That's what I assumed: RL skills. Fitting wise the Omen is like it is. So the solution might be the way how to fly it. I saw an 'EVE is easy' video where Garmon flies an armor tanked solo Zealot with quite some success. I was hoping the new, boosted Omen can mimic this for cheap.

So I'll just try it again. And again afterwards... Big smile
Joran Dravius
Doomheim
#9 - 2013-02-14 13:12:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Joran Dravius
Denuo Secus wrote:
Hi all,

I really want to use the Omen for solo PvP. But my current experience is rather mixed. Primary reason: frigs. As soon as a somewhat tanky but speedy frig manages it under my guns the Omen is toast. Non-bonused drones don't help much here.

Since most frigs are twice as fast as my Omen it's very risky to stay on the field as soon as a frig appears. The time frame from locking the frig to getting caught is very small.

Avoiding frigs isn't a cool solution imho. I'd prefer a way to deal with them instead. When solo I'm outnumbered most of the time. No problem as long as I'm able to kite. But beeing outnumbered means I'm facing mixed gangs most of the time. So frigs are part of the party almost every time.

My goal is a semi-kiting tactics depending on the target. Keeping range if possible, when not switch to brawling mode. I think this is a great benefit of the armor Omen: it can kite and brawl at the same time. I tried the shield Omen as well. It is nice for pure kiting but I don't like the lack of tank. The shield-nano Omen is that fragile...as soon as something with a good dmg projection enters the field I need to warp very soon.

Any hint? Is it doable or are Amarr drone boats the only way to fly this faction solo?

Dunno how to help you. I usually fly cruisers with drones if I'm not in a gang. Try fitting a web and/or tracking enhancer. Energy neutralizers also work especially well on smaller ships.
W0lf Crendraven
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2013-02-14 13:16:42 UTC
[Omen, cheap armorzealot]
Medium Armor Repairer II
800mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Internal Force Field Array I

Experimental 10MN Microwarpdrive I
Medium Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Navy Cap Booster 800
Warp Disruptor II

Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M

Medium Ancillary Current Router I
Medium Polycarbon Engine Housing I
Medium Energy Locus Coordinator I


Warrior II x5
Warrior II x3

Something like this? Damage and range is worse then the shield version, ehp are a little higher and it is now capstable and tanks 80dps.

Or if you want the dualrep version:

[Omen, cheap armorzealot]
Medium Armor Repairer II
Medium Armor Repairer II
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
Prototype Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane I
Internal Force Field Array I

Experimental 10MN Microwarpdrive I
Medium Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Navy Cap Booster 800
Warp Disruptor II

Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M

Medium Ancillary Current Router I
Medium Polycarbon Engine Housing I
Medium Energy Locus Coordinator I


Warrior II x5
Warrior II x3


Or for pure anti frig stuff

[Omen, antirfrig]
Damage Control II
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
Tracking Enhancer II
Tracking Enhancer II
Nanofiber Internal Structure II

Medium Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Navy Cap Booster 800
Experimental 10MN Microwarpdrive I
Warp Disruptor II

Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I

Medium Ancillary Current Router I
Medium Energy Locus Coordinator I
Medium Polycarbon Engine Housing I


Warrior II x5
Warrior II x3

The med neut loses you 65 dps, but if you preheat it and cicle it stops enemy frigates as soon as they enter range, combined with nearly two flights of small drones you have a good chance. The lack of tank mean thats frigates are the only thing you can engage tho!. And its capstable even with the neut running.


But for all purposes the general shield omen still rules surpreme:

[Omen, Shieldomen]
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
Tracking Enhancer II
Tracking Enhancer II
Damage Control II
Nanofiber Internal Structure II

Experimental 10MN Microwarpdrive I
Warp Disruptor II
Large Shield Extender II

Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M

Medium Semiconductor Memory Cell I
Medium Semiconductor Memory Cell I
Medium Ancillary Current Router I


Valkyrie II x3
Warrior II x2
Denuo Secus
#11 - 2013-02-14 14:08:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Denuo Secus
W0lf Crendraven wrote:
...cool stuff...


Thanks! I tried the 4 laser Omen already. But I used a small neut because I wanted some tank. Giving up some damage in exchange for anti frig capability seemed like a good idea to me (a RML Caracal does the same for instance). Will try the medium neut version. My success rate with a small neut was rather limited.

@Armor version: I think the new armor rep could be interesting here, maybe.

Edit: clarification
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#12 - 2013-02-14 15:06:43 UTC
800/single AAR kiter might be decent after armor changes.



Also i found the "learn to kill stuff in less then a minute" comment highly amusing.. such a good description of the Omen and its wonderful cap.

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

Goldensaver
Maraque Enterprises
Just let it happen
#13 - 2013-02-14 15:25:27 UTC
Garviel Tarrant wrote:
800/single AAR kiter might be decent after armor changes.



Also i found the "learn to kill stuff in less then a minute" comment highly amusing.. such a good description of the Omen and its wonderful cap.

Indeed. That hull "bonus" sure does it a lot of good, doesn't it?
ITTigerClawIK
Galactic Rangers
#14 - 2013-02-14 15:28:07 UTC
Denuo Secus wrote:
ITTigerClawIK wrote:
useualy find fitting a web solves the problem.


No, does not. Did you actually try it? If so pls tell me how you got it working.

My experience with web on the Omen: pulse lasers have bad tracking in general. One web doesn't help much here. For comparison: a Thorax which uses the best tracking turrets + has a tracking bonus on top needs two webs to hit frigs orbiting close range. And here we have the second issue with the Omen: not enough med slots to fit dual web.

Also: fitting a web would limit the Omen's viability against equally sized targets. The Omen really needs a cap booster - at least if I want to use it as (semi-)kiter.


odd , my pulses useally track fine , i use focused med pulse on mine plus a T2 web and it seems to eat frigs pretty quickly , also make sure when you have the web try and fly either directly toward or away from the frigate, ill see if i can dig out my fit but atm im in null sec and far away from my solo PvP Omen back in empire.
Goldensaver
Maraque Enterprises
Just let it happen
#15 - 2013-02-14 15:41:57 UTC
ITTigerClawIK wrote:
Denuo Secus wrote:
ITTigerClawIK wrote:
useualy find fitting a web solves the problem.


No, does not. Did you actually try it? If so pls tell me how you got it working.

My experience with web on the Omen: pulse lasers have bad tracking in general. One web doesn't help much here. For comparison: a Thorax which uses the best tracking turrets + has a tracking bonus on top needs two webs to hit frigs orbiting close range. And here we have the second issue with the Omen: not enough med slots to fit dual web.

Also: fitting a web would limit the Omen's viability against equally sized targets. The Omen really needs a cap booster - at least if I want to use it as (semi-)kiter.


odd , my pulses useally track fine , i use focused med pulse on mine plus a T2 web and it seems to eat frigs pretty quickly , also make sure when you have the web try and fly either directly toward or away from the frigate, ill see if i can dig out my fit but atm im in null sec and far away from my solo PvP Omen back in empire.

Last time I fought a frig in an Omen (web, scram, FMPL's) I didn't hit it at all after it got into orbit. And I couldn't stop it either. Too much faster than me. No maneuvering I did managed to get him to a point I could hit him. Of course, I'm pretty sure he was Loki boosted (the guy rarely goes anywhere without his boosts.) And immediately after he had me pointed he got a couple of his SFI buddies to come and help mess me up... But yeah, I couldn't track the frigate at all. And the character I used has great turret skills.

Relevant parts of the fit were TE, FMPL's, web and scram.
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#16 - 2013-02-14 15:54:09 UTC
Goldensaver wrote:
ITTigerClawIK wrote:
Denuo Secus wrote:
ITTigerClawIK wrote:
useualy find fitting a web solves the problem.


No, does not. Did you actually try it? If so pls tell me how you got it working.

My experience with web on the Omen: pulse lasers have bad tracking in general. One web doesn't help much here. For comparison: a Thorax which uses the best tracking turrets + has a tracking bonus on top needs two webs to hit frigs orbiting close range. And here we have the second issue with the Omen: not enough med slots to fit dual web.

Also: fitting a web would limit the Omen's viability against equally sized targets. The Omen really needs a cap booster - at least if I want to use it as (semi-)kiter.


odd , my pulses useally track fine , i use focused med pulse on mine plus a T2 web and it seems to eat frigs pretty quickly , also make sure when you have the web try and fly either directly toward or away from the frigate, ill see if i can dig out my fit but atm im in null sec and far away from my solo PvP Omen back in empire.

Last time I fought a frig in an Omen (web, scram, FMPL's) I didn't hit it at all after it got into orbit. And I couldn't stop it either. Too much faster than me. No maneuvering I did managed to get him to a point I could hit him. Of course, I'm pretty sure he was Loki boosted (the guy rarely goes anywhere without his boosts.) And immediately after he had me pointed he got a couple of his SFI buddies to come and help mess me up... But yeah, I couldn't track the frigate at all. And the character I used has great turret skills.

Relevant parts of the fit were TE, FMPL's, web and scram.


a AB frig eats the omen once it gets an orbit.

The omen cannot track an AB throax.. Its not even close to tracking a AB frig.

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

Doctorkaba
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#17 - 2013-02-14 18:02:19 UTC
Garviel Tarrant wrote:

a AB frig eats the omen once it gets an orbit.

The omen cannot track an AB throax.. Its not even close to tracking a AB frig.


TBH few laser boats (at least the maller and omen, not including the t2 variants) can track anything under... 2km was it? For brawling you either need friends or webs and for kiting you really need to be able to keep things at range. I wouls suggest using the old classic of starting your fights farther away to insta pop the noobs in frigs burning for you. If they are good they wont die but you should have enough time to warp. Pick your fights wisely.

Want some pvp help? Like to fly small and fast frigates? Then join the in game channel Tenori_Tigers!