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Dev blog: The great ship skill change of summer 2013

First post First post
Author
CCP RubberBAND
CCP Engineering Corp
#61 - 2013-02-07 14:26:32 UTC
Chi'Nane T'Kal wrote:
Could you guys please stop the panic regarding 'I can fly it now, but I don't have skill X' ?

Those additional skills are requirements for your current ship's SKILL, not for the SHIP.
Since you guys can already FLY the ship, you obviously already HAVE the skill that has now some other requirements.

So obviously you will still be able to fly that ship, you could just not learn it the same way with a new toon.


Correct!

Feel free to poke me on: Twitter

Rethyl
Nobody in Local
Deepwater Hooligans
#62 - 2013-02-07 14:29:24 UTC
Typo: the section on dreadnoughts suffers from some copypasta errors: "Capital Ships requirement on all Carriers increased from 1 to 3."
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#63 - 2013-02-07 14:30:50 UTC
Sentient Blade wrote:
*Chokes*..

All command links to 5 to use Command Ships? Even if they're completely irrelevant to the ship being flown?

Looks like it. Because the skill "command ships" is generic, not racial. But as other stuff has been removed, the total training time is about the same.

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Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#64 - 2013-02-07 14:33:25 UTC
CCP RubberBAND wrote:
Chi'Nane T'Kal wrote:
Could you guys please stop the panic regarding 'I can fly it now, but I don't have skill X' ?

Those additional skills are requirements for your current ship's SKILL, not for the SHIP.
Since you guys can already FLY the ship, you obviously already HAVE the skill that has now some other requirements.

So obviously you will still be able to fly that ship, you could just not learn it the same way with a new toon.


Correct!

There will be alot of freighter pilots in that state. Few got advanced spaceship command at V. But all will still be able to fly their freighters.

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pipin meh
NED-Clan
#65 - 2013-02-07 14:33:28 UTC
Now that we are getting loads of new sp could we please get cheaper clones.. i want to pvp in frigates without having to pay 20mil everytime i welp
Akrasjel Lanate
Immemorial Coalescence Administration
Immemorial Coalescence
#66 - 2013-02-07 14:36:18 UTC
Summer is Coming Big smile

CEO of Lanate Industries

Citizen of Solitude

Sentient Blade
Crisis Atmosphere
Coalition of the Unfortunate
#67 - 2013-02-07 14:36:18 UTC
Vincent Athena wrote:
Sentient Blade wrote:
*Chokes*..

All command links to 5 to use Command Ships? Even if they're completely irrelevant to the ship being flown?

Looks like it. Because the skill "command ships" is generic, not racial. But as other stuff has been removed, the total training time is about the same.


How many people have charisma maps? Not many would be my guess. Command ships will be severely penalised.
Chi'Nane T'Kal
Interminatus
#68 - 2013-02-07 14:36:41 UTC
Vincent Athena wrote:
CCP RubberBAND wrote:
Chi'Nane T'Kal wrote:
Could you guys please stop the panic regarding 'I can fly it now, but I don't have skill X' ?

Those additional skills are requirements for your current ship's SKILL, not for the SHIP.
Since you guys can already FLY the ship, you obviously already HAVE the skill that has now some other requirements.

So obviously you will still be able to fly that ship, you could just not learn it the same way with a new toon.


Correct!

There will be alot of freighter pilots in that state. Few got advanced spaceship command at V. But all will still be able to fly their freighters.


Well, as long as not half of them get heart attacks from sheer panic, all will be well in New Eden :)
FinalFlash84
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#69 - 2013-02-07 14:37:14 UTC
CCP Ytterbium wrote:
FinalFlash84 wrote:
According to your explanation, shouldn't the DD prereqs (like Science V, EPW V and AWU V) also be added to the titan?

edit:
Also Fighter V and EW V for supercarriers


Ideally, yes, but we wanted to keep close hard training times, so we had to take a pick between the Doomsday and the Jump Portal.

Fair enough, but isn't your argument kind of stupid? You want to break the norm for one or two shipclasses because it would take longer to train for (although for the ppl currently using them nothing would change) and for this you'd rather have an exception rather then to say that your explanation in the devblog accounts for EVERY ship in EVE ?
ChromeStriker
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#70 - 2013-02-07 14:39:41 UTC
IB4 irreversible tweaking to the skill cue that inadvertently turns all hamsters into gerbils...

No Worries

Rexitx
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#71 - 2013-02-07 14:39:48 UTC
Quote:
The ORE branch (Venture, Noctis, Orca, Rorqual plus all mining barge variations) has been tweaked to a consistent progression. For instance, the Rorqual will not need Mining Barges 5 to be flown anymore, but will instead require the Industrial Command Ship skill at 3, itself requiring ORE Industrial at 3.


Awesome change, any thoughts on allowing refunds for the now unneeded barge skills?
Xaero Petraeus
Balls Deep Inc.
Minmatar Fleet Alliance
#72 - 2013-02-07 14:41:42 UTC
Awesomesauce!

What a pleasant surprise. Keep 'em coming please.

Big smile
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#73 - 2013-02-07 14:42:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Vincent Athena
It just occurred to me that there is another step in preparation all us players should be doing, other than getting the skills Destroyer and Battlecrusier high:

The requirements for injecting some skills will be changing. Some you could inject before the change will not be inject-able after the change without additional training. So go thorough your sheet and inject every skill you can. Lock it in while its still possible.

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StarStryder
Zero-Hour
#74 - 2013-02-07 14:44:19 UTC
Hmm, so the low end indy ships now become entirely redundant.

Is Advanced Spaceship Command below level 5 used for anything?

Also, for the Command ships, why not remove the Warfare skills (except Warfare Link Specialist) from Command Ships and add two of them to each Ship and a tertiary requirement?
Irregessa
Obfuscation and Reflections
#75 - 2013-02-07 14:44:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Irregessa
CCP Ytterbium wrote:
Forlorn Wongraven wrote:
@Fozzie: Freighters 5 as prereq for JF is gonna be a pain in the arse, good that I am set. Smile

Good that the needed skills to fly a ship correctly are now in the ship requirements like DD for titans and Warp Dis Gen for HICs.


We aren't adding Freighters 5 as the Jump Freighter requirement, at least not for a good while. We considered it, but the prospect of giving 7 million skill points extra wasn't appealing.



That doesn't make any kind of sense.

The Jump Freighter skill is like any other t2 ship skill, like Heavy Assault Cruiser. There is no requirement for the hull in there. The hull comes in the determination of which jump freighter(s) can be flown by the character who has the Jump Freighter skill.

However, to be consistent, you should be making racial freighter 5 be the prereq to fly the racial jump freighter, just like racial frigate/destroyer/cruiser/battlecruiser/battleship/industrial/(mining barge) are required to fly the racial t2 variants of the same hull.
Ethan Revenant
Adhocracy Incorporated
Adhocracy
#76 - 2013-02-07 14:46:12 UTC
They laughed at me at the academy when I trained armored, siege, info, and skirmish to V! Laughed! But I have the last laugh now!
Sarmatiko
#77 - 2013-02-07 14:47:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Sarmatiko
CCP RubberBAND wrote:

Correct!

Can you please answer directly: do we have to train skill prerequisites to progress in that skill?
To level Freighters V without Advanced Spaceships Command V, or to maximize Command ships V without all those useless links?
I dont worry about "you will able to fly" thing. I want to know if I need to maximize skills now to skip useless skills that you introduced as prerequisites for command ships today.
Burseg Sardaukar
Free State Project
#78 - 2013-02-07 14:48:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Burseg Sardaukar
So, trying to consolidate everything so they all make sense, does the "Heavy" prefix with the HAC and HIC need to be there?

Assault Frigate, Assault Cruiser, Interdiction Cruiser is pretty straightforward. Unless you plan on making Light Assault Cruisers. Assault Frigates are Light or Heavy, and Interdictors are Light Interdictors... Just an OCD thing, maybe.

Can't wait to dual box my Dust toon and EVE toon on the same machine!

Irregessa
Obfuscation and Reflections
#79 - 2013-02-07 14:50:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Irregessa
If you are going to be flying a command ship in a fleet, you really already should have all those skills to V anyway, to provide those benefits to your fleet.

The problem is that what are called the field command ships (absolution, sleipnir, astarte and nighthawk) are often flown as combat ships, not as support ships. What I would like to see done (though this would add yet more sp to clones) would be to make the fleet command ships the only command ships, and make the field command ships a separate ship entirely, like a heavy assault battlecruiser - that is essentially how they are used now in everything but the alliance tournament. I'm sure someone will jump in and say how they use the nighthawk in place of the vulture for some kind of fleet, or something similar, but outlying cases don't disqualify the larger issue at hand.
Laurinius
Perkone
Caldari State
#80 - 2013-02-07 14:53:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Laurinius
Madlof Chev wrote:
Freighters are assbackwards (not that I particularly care):

The primary skill requirement after the change is already contained in the secondary skill requirement. You might want to just nuke the primary skill requirement altogether.

(if you had Racial Freighter as the primary skill and someone had already trained it then ASC V wouldn't be required amirite)


No, you can't just remove one of the direct requirements skills.
Imagine a ship before needs:
-Skill A at 1
-Skill B at 3

After Skill B requires Skill A at 4, so the requirement for the ship changes to:
-Skill A at 1
-Skill B at 3
---Skill A at 4

The direct requirements are still the same for making sure you can fly this ship if you could fly it before.

Now imagine you have already trained Skill B to 3, but haven't trained Skill A at all (as it was not required for Skill A). Now the Skill A requirement gets dropped from the ship. Then you can fly this ship without ever having trained Skill A.