Ships & Modules

Hi can anyone tell me why damage control is not for pve ships? I read this somewhere and i cant figure out why. The dc gives your ship a ton of ehp does it not count in pve?

but if it works pve then surely this module is too good to pass up. The increase in ehp is too significant

EHP is calculated by taking all of your resistances into account. Usually when running missions you don't need to tank more than 2 types of damage (exceptions are rogue drones for example). Since you can simply fit specific hardeners or more damage mods instead of the DC, it is just not as good to have it with you.
There are some exceptions, for example missile ships, which sometimes use a DC instead of a 4th BCU due to stacking penalties and the added resists to shield from the DC.
Anyway, if you don't like min/maxing and rather want some more emergency buffer, go ahead and fit a DC.

The reason the Damage Control is not generally recommended in PvE is down to the way PvE works.

The DPS from PvE is generally quite low (compared to PvP) but sustained and therefore EHP is not a significant stat - far more important is the damage reduction (in the form of resists and speed) and amount you can repair. The Damage Control does offer additional resists of course but on a single tanking layer they aren't all that significant compared to the value of other modules available for the fittings.

In PvP the non-stacking penalised resists of the damage control and its vast increase on structure HP makes a difference to how many volleys you can get off before your ship explodes, and provides a reasonable alternative to a third, stacking penalised, universal resist module (EANM or Invulnerability Field) but in PvE your resists can be more tailored and you can rely more heavily on an ongoing, repair-based tank which will keep you alive effectively indefinitely.

EHP do not matter for a mission ship unless you get ganked. if you get ganked, your modules are probably too expensive which in turn means you could instead fit cheaper modules and skip the DCU.

Most mission ships are shield fit.

Even those intended to be armor fit.

A good missions runner will very rarely get into armor let alone hull so all that extra ehp from armor/hull resists is wasted.

Generally it is believed to be better to fit a damage mod than a damage controller. More DPS beats ehp that is not used.

That being said however, I have several missions ships that use a damage controller. It only adds 15% shield resists but does not have the stacking penalties when paired with shield hardeners. With two of each mission specific resists plus a damage controller you can get those primary resists well over 80%, One of my fits gives me 84% Thermal / 86% Kinetic with a DC II but only 76%/78% without. I does make a big difference when pulsing an XL-SB or more so with a XL-ASB since you only have 7 charges.

I would recommend a Damage controller over a 4th damage mod, but only if you would benefit from the extra tank. A DC II can also help offset the loss of a hardener when dropping one to fit a TP or TC.

DC's have there use but not in all fits.

The main bonus the DC gives is hull resists. In PvE you DON'T hull tank. However, from time to time I use this module when I have totally new ship and fitting and I don't know how much can it stand. When I see that I can finish my job wihout taking hits on structure I replace it with something more useful, be it hardener, passive resist or dmg. upgrade.

Because:
- If you shield tank, you can get far better resists from an invuln or a mission-specific hardener without using up a low slot you could have a damage mod in.
- PvE tends to rely on active tank, so you could fit another rep in that slot, for an armour tank.

It's used for pvp because:
- One slot, resists for shield AND armour AND structure, which usually has none.
- BUFFER. Especially for an industrial ship, you need ALL the buffer you can get.
- Active tanks and logistic ships mean alpha fleets are the way to go. No amount of active reps will stop you being popped instantly by being alphaed; you just don't get enough time to rep betwen cycles.

Generally, it's good for pve until you're SURE you don't need that low slot for something else. Even for a shield tank, it's good for if you screw up and end up taking armour or even hull damage before you can warp out.
(On a similar note, ALWAYS have an armour rep and a hull rep for your ship size on hand. Not fitted, just in station or in your hold, in case you should need to rep after a brown-underwear moment. It'll save millions in repair bills.)

Except that you don't stick around to fight in hull in PvE, and that's where most of the EHP increase is.

It's good for people just starting PvE that don't really know how to fly yet, as it gives them some extra time with the alarm going "WOOT WOOT WOOT" to realize they're failing and warp out. For anyone with any clue what they're doing, though, they'll bail before armor (or shield, whichever their primary is) goes down.

This. EHP is a relatively useless stat in PvE, but damage controls can still be useful under the right circumstances. Usually those circumstances involve choosing between fitting a DC or a fourth damage mod. This amounts to a choice between the aforementioned 12.5% increase to a shield tank versus a 5.6% increase in damage.

To be honest, I usually choose the (fairly small) increase in damage because that's what's going to complete a mission faster and actually make you money. But there are times (usually not in missions, but still PvE) where I know a DC is a much better choice. This includes instances where I know I can't tank the incoming damage but just need to live long enough to finish a blitz (hull resists have saved me more than once here) and times when I know I'm going to be neuted to hell and back (in which case a DC can usually stay on long after everything else has shut down).

For normal, everyday use DCs can be nice for new setups when you don't know what a ship is capable of doing but otherwise tend to take a slot away from increased damage (or targeting range/scan resolution in the case of a Raven).