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Give Cloaking the ASB / AAR treatment
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Astroniomix
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#141 - 2013-02-05 05:51:01 UTC
Iminent Penance wrote:
All of you pro cloak nerfs quit using logic. That kind of thing is NOT ALLOWED , because it all logic can be beaten with "qqmore" "carebear go hisec" and "it r fair because it r meant to be unbeatable"

So sh and learn your place due to the infallible arguments of everyone against you I've summed up above this.

You missed "it's the only counter to local" and the bit where cloaked ships being unprobable being an integral part of wormholes.
jamesoverlord
Black Layer Syndicate
Pan-Intergalatic Business Community
#142 - 2013-02-05 08:17:37 UTC
its a **** idea and poor little carebears want to be safe
TheGunslinger42
All Web Investigations
#143 - 2013-02-05 11:58:11 UTC
Iminent Penance wrote:
All of you pro cloak nerfs quit using logic. That kind of thing is NOT ALLOWED , because it all logic can be beaten with "qqmore" "carebear go hisec" and "it r fair because it r meant to be unbeatable"

So sh and learn your place due to the infallible arguments of everyone against you I've summed up above this.


Except there are clear, logical explanations as to why nerfing cloaks is detrimental to several aspects of the game, and why it is a symptom of the real problem. All you've done is sarcastically said we don't have actual arguments despite the fact that we obviously do, while also failing to provide any of your own.
Mag's
Azn Empire
#144 - 2013-02-05 12:19:17 UTC
Iminent Penance wrote:
All of you pro cloak nerfs quit using logic. That kind of thing is NOT ALLOWED , because it all logic can be beaten with "qqmore" "carebear go hisec" and "it r fair because it r meant to be unbeatable"

So sh and learn your place due to the infallible arguments of everyone against you I've summed up above this.
What logic would that be?

Is it the one about AFK cloakers shutting down systems?
Is it the one about them being AFK and a threat, with no mention of local as the mechanic that's actually being used?
Or maybe it's the one where they try to say AFK cloakers are totally safe? But of course don't mention, that that applies to both sides.

No really, please explain the logic these nerf AFK cloakers are using. I'm sure we would all love to know.

You could present your own logical argument of course. But why bother, when you can post irrelevant claptrap? Amirite?

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.
XxRTEKxX
256th Shadow Wing
#145 - 2013-02-05 15:18:19 UTC
The cloaks arent the problem, local chat is. Cloaks are fine how they are.
Nikk Narrel
Moonlit Bonsai
#146 - 2013-02-05 17:16:19 UTC
Mag's wrote:
Iminent Penance wrote:
All of you pro cloak nerfs quit using logic. That kind of thing is NOT ALLOWED , because it all logic can be beaten with "qqmore" "carebear go hisec" and "it r fair because it r meant to be unbeatable"

So sh and learn your place due to the infallible arguments of everyone against you I've summed up above this.
What logic would that be?

Is it the one about AFK cloakers shutting down systems?
Is it the one about them being AFK and a threat, with no mention of local as the mechanic that's actually being used?
Or maybe it's the one where they try to say AFK cloakers are totally safe? But of course don't mention, that that applies to both sides.

No really, please explain the logic these nerf AFK cloakers are using. I'm sure we would all love to know.

You could present your own logical argument of course. But why bother, when you can post irrelevant claptrap? Amirite?

I think his first sentence about logic was not a claim that logic was missing.

I believe it was an appeal for "pro cloak" to cease using logic.
Since logic is unbalanced in favor of cloaking here, he is asking for it to be nerfed.

Pro Tip: You are free to use logic too. It is not our responsibility that logic cannot be bent into a pretzel to suit your argument. Might we suggest using a different argument, in that case?

Upgrading Local to Eliminate All AFK Influence What if Local Chat changed, Hunting the Cloaked...
Avion Saberis
Singularity Tech Syndycate
#147 - 2013-02-05 20:48:23 UTC
Wow, it's been a fews years since I've even got on the forums, but just for looking, it seems nothing has changed. Cloaks aren't the problem here, it's local giving away just easy intel. And besides this idea is just bad, for everyone.
Optimo Sebiestor
The New Eden School of trade
Organization of Skill Extracting Corporations
#148 - 2013-02-05 21:34:05 UTC
It isnt the cloak that is the problem...
GeneralDisturbed
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#149 - 2013-02-06 03:20:55 UTC
When eve removes your cloaking/nullified tengu that aligns and warps in -3 seconds, I'll vote to remove AFK cloaking.

TL;DR: Remove Local instead. From any standpoint at all ingame it's pointless and makes no sense. Who is keeping track of all these people to report it to you? Does Concord magically do it? You should stop being so mad about AFK cloaking and learn to play an eve where you might be required to actually fight somebody at some point.
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#150 - 2013-02-06 03:23:54 UTC
GeneralDisturbed wrote:
TL;DR: Remove Local instead. From any standpoint at all ingame it's pointless and makes no sense. Who is keeping track of all these people to report it to you? Does Concord magically do it? You should stop being so mad about AFK cloaking and learn to play an eve where you might be required to actually fight somebody at some point.

No, removing local is a stupid idea.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
Ranger Ted
My Little Glue Factory
#151 - 2013-02-06 03:27:42 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
GeneralDisturbed wrote:
TL;DR: Remove Local instead. From any standpoint at all ingame it's pointless and makes no sense. Who is keeping track of all these people to report it to you? Does Concord magically do it? You should stop being so mad about AFK cloaking and learn to play an eve where you might be required to actually fight somebody at some point.

No, removing local is a stupid idea.


No remove local.
Szcwczuc
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#152 - 2013-02-06 03:29:32 UTC
Ranger Ted wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
GeneralDisturbed wrote:
TL;DR: Remove Local instead. From any standpoint at all ingame it's pointless and makes no sense. Who is keeping track of all these people to report it to you? Does Concord magically do it? You should stop being so mad about AFK cloaking and learn to play an eve where you might be required to actually fight somebody at some point.

No, removing local is a stupid idea.


No remove local.



Keep local make it so nullifed T3's have an 8/10 chance to blow up when they cloak, requires cloaking 5 and cyno 5 and takes 5 navy 800's to work each time.
ButterNut
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#153 - 2013-02-06 03:30:51 UTC
Szcwczuc wrote:
Ranger Ted wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
GeneralDisturbed wrote:
TL;DR: Remove Local instead. From any standpoint at all ingame it's pointless and makes no sense. Who is keeping track of all these people to report it to you? Does Concord magically do it? You should stop being so mad about AFK cloaking and learn to play an eve where you might be required to actually fight somebody at some point.

No, removing local is a stupid idea.


No remove local.



Keep local make it so nullifed T3's have an 8/10 chance to blow up when they cloak, requires cloaking 5 and cyno 5 and takes 5 navy 800's to work each time.



Agreed.
Asuka Solo
I N E X T R E M I S
Tactical Narcotics Team
#154 - 2013-02-06 05:54:10 UTC
No.

Just no.

Eve is about Capital ships, WiS, Boobs, PI and Isk!
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#155 - 2013-02-06 06:21:13 UTC
Ranger Ted wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
GeneralDisturbed wrote:
TL;DR: Remove Local instead. From any standpoint at all ingame it's pointless and makes no sense. Who is keeping track of all these people to report it to you? Does Concord magically do it? You should stop being so mad about AFK cloaking and learn to play an eve where you might be required to actually fight somebody at some point.

No, removing local is a stupid idea.


No remove local.

It's a stupid idea regardless of who says it.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
TheGunslinger42
All Web Investigations
#156 - 2013-02-06 08:10:38 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Ranger Ted wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
GeneralDisturbed wrote:
TL;DR: Remove Local instead. From any standpoint at all ingame it's pointless and makes no sense. Who is keeping track of all these people to report it to you? Does Concord magically do it? You should stop being so mad about AFK cloaking and learn to play an eve where you might be required to actually fight somebody at some point.

No, removing local is a stupid idea.


No remove local.

It's a stupid idea regardless of who says it.


It's no more stupid than ideas such as probes to find cloaked ships, or requiring fuel/cap for cloaks, etc. At least it's related to the actual issue though, even if it the solution is too simplistic, or overkill
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#157 - 2013-02-06 11:01:55 UTC  |  Edited by: James Amril-Kesh
No, it's not more stupid. It's not less stupid either.
As others have said in other threads, this is a solution looking for a problem. Local does not need to be fixed, and neither does cloaking. Neither of those are problems. AFK cloaking is a legitimate tactic to deny people the use of their space, and local is the only means by which someone can have any sort of safety when doing PVE in null for any extended period of time.

You think null is deserted now? Take local away and I guarantee you the population will drop drastically.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
Azrael Dinn
Imperial Mechanics
#158 - 2013-02-06 11:08:41 UTC
I vote for any system that allows me to start finding cloaked ships from systems even if it means that the cloaked ships would be a buff in the update.

After centuries of debating and justifying... Break Cloaks tm
Anthar Thebess
#159 - 2013-02-06 11:25:15 UTC
This is a game ,
If i have cloak, im in an enemy territory i can use my cloak to go AFK.
And if im standing in enemy system to catch some juicy target, or drop by covert ops cyno some friends on a carrier - then this is important part of a game.

Stop discrimination, help in a fight against terrorists

Show your support to The Cause!
Buzzy Warstl
Quantum Flux Foundry
#160 - 2013-02-06 13:53:22 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
No, it's not more stupid. It's not less stupid either.
As others have said in other threads, this is a solution looking for a problem. Local does not need to be fixed, and neither does cloaking. Neither of those are problems. AFK cloaking is a legitimate tactic to deny people the use of their space, and local is the only means by which someone can have any sort of safety when doing PVE in null for any extended period of time.

You think null is deserted now? Take local away and I guarantee you the population will drop drastically.

Quite a few people play in WH space despite the lack of local and the player skill necessary to play there at all.

Frankly, the local chat member display is an impediment to people playing in nullsec in general.

Nobody likes trying to look like they are sneaking around when they have a great big spotlight on them.

http://www.mud.co.uk/richard/hcds.htm Richard Bartle: Players who suit MUDs