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Newbs who keep playing.

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State War Academy
Caldari State
#21 - 2013-01-06 11:48:32 UTC
Zack Korth wrote:
Being as the games about 10 years old now, how long will it be before more trials than not end in uninstalls?

If anything, the ratio is probably much improved now than it was a few years ago with the much more useful new player experience.

Quote:
I wonder about it alot, what kind of system could be implemented to "close the gap" for new players without alienating the existing player base?

As others have said, the recent T1 frigate and cruiser improvements have gone a long way to doing this already.

Every time you post a WiS thread, Hilmar strangles a kitten.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#22 - 2013-01-06 11:51:52 UTC
Zack Korth wrote:
DPS, tank... you've played eve right?
Oh, you mean those things that are trivial — in fact inevitable — to catch up with?

Yeah… that kind of means that there is no gap that needs to be closed or compensated for, because it's already in the game.
Zack Korth
Livid CO.
#23 - 2013-01-06 11:53:18 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Zack Korth wrote:
DPS, tank... you've played eve right?


because it's already in the game.


you don't say?
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#24 - 2013-01-06 11:53:41 UTC
Zack Korth wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Zack Korth wrote:
Jacob Straven wrote:
Indeed, one of the beauties of EVE is that a 3 day old player can make a difference, there are no 'gaps'.

Because of SANDBOX

no

Incorrect.

There is no gap that the game needs to compensate for. Not knowing what you're doing is either soething that newbies get over after playing a little while, or it is something that no-one ever fully gets over because of the dynamics of the game. Either way, it's not a gap.

So really, what gap?


DPS, tank... you've played eve right?


My Little Rifter

High - empty

Mid - MWD and warp disruptor

Low - empty

30 min into the game and this nub can tackle a dreadnought.
Rico Minali
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#25 - 2013-01-06 11:53:53 UTC
Vaju Enki wrote:
EvE Online is the only MMO that as growth every single year.


It is also pretty much the only MMO that you can PVP from day one and be a very real help in fleets. Anyone who doesnt believe this is true simply has no idea what they are talking about.

Trust me, I almost know what I'm doing.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#26 - 2013-01-06 11:56:02 UTC
Zack Korth wrote:
you don't say?
I do indeed say that there is no gap in the game that needs to be compensated for because the game already does that, courtesy of its magnificent skill system.

Your poor editing won't change this fact. Now, you do know that it's a fact, right? You have actually played EVE, I hope?

So, once again: what gap?
Zack Korth
Livid CO.
#27 - 2013-01-06 11:58:55 UTC
oh i get it, GD is trollin
Name Family Name
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#28 - 2013-01-06 12:01:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Name Family Name
Zack Korth wrote:
...I often wonder when the tipping point will come, where people realize "yano, I'm so far behind every other player in this game, and i'll have to sub this account for (however long newbs believe they will have to sub account to easily make a plex worth of isk a month) that its not even worth it", which is a realization they could easily come to near the end of the 14 day trial period..


That 'realization' is flat out wrong. There is next to no gap and even when broadly skilled for subcaps, people wont fly them better after ~60 mill SP, far less to fly BCs and T3s perfectly.
My one year old alt @20 mill SP can fly his BC at the exact same level as my 100 mill SP character.

Moreover, if being able to plex ones account determines whether someone keeps playing or not, he probably shouldn't keep playing any computer games at all and get some basic education or some McJob to be able to afford 15 bucks a month. Eve wasn't around back then, but I'd been able to afford that from my pocket money when I was 6 years old.

Quote:

and most importantly, is that the time eve will start dying? I wonder about it alot, what kind of system could be implemented to "close the gap" for new players without alienating the existing player base? don't know why i waste my brain power trying to solve a problem that won't make ME any money.. but I guess its cause I like the game, and would like it to be around and still populated in 5 or 6 years (should I still be playing) and the players that are starting out today or next week or next year would be the ones around at that time. its hard to enjoy a cutthroat business when your competitor has a chainsaw and all you've got is a plastic spork, is CCP ever gonna hand these lads at least a butterknife?



As you said eve is 10 years old, so people have faced this situation for the last ten years (it was worse before neural remaps and removal of learning skills), so it always was a question if a player draws a wrong conclusion or not.

I for one came to the conclusion that it's best to sell my higher SP characters because at this very moment, all the Skills those characters have over my low SP alt (perfect T2 and BS skills) are pointless due to the rebalancing that's going on.
Currently, most T2 ships are generally worthless for the price and BS have been CCPs red-haired stepchild for years now.
By the time CCP get around to rebalance them, my alt will be able to fly them too...
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#29 - 2013-01-06 12:03:41 UTC
Zack Korth wrote:
oh i get it, GD is trollin
Not really, no. Well, you might, so maybe you meant to say “OP” rather than “GD”.
Zack Korth
Livid CO.
#30 - 2013-01-06 12:04:52 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Zack Korth wrote:
oh i get it, GD is trollin
Not really, no. Well, you might, so maybe you meant to say “OP” rather than “GD”.


no
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#31 - 2013-01-06 12:06:34 UTC
Zack Korth wrote:
no
Then you're just plain old wrong. Again.
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#32 - 2013-01-06 12:06:58 UTC
Zack Korth wrote:
We all started EVE at some point, naively believing we were decent when we trained battleships and big guns, bought a plex to fund a battleship, and promptly got said battleships ass kicked into future lolmail status


Not "we", you.
I and a whole generation started from MUD text games where you knew in advance it'd take years before you could even call youself "average experienced".
Then the early MMOs, they were not a joke either. I also play another 2003 game ATM where people plan their things in months or years like in EvE.

Of course some guy who would roll from some cheesy welfare game of these days will find it hard to adapt to EvE.

Actually, the proper mindset to tackle EvE is to WANT to create your own content, your own long term path, your own long term challenges to win. Getting in late just puts you somewhere in the sandbox, you have just to find how that "somewhere" can be used right now. Can't produce Titans at day 1? Well, make a good income with ammo.
Can't fly a Titan yet? Fly a Rifter and go tackle big stuff.


Rico Minali wrote:
Vaju Enki wrote:
EvE Online is the only MMO that as growth every single year.


It is also pretty much the only MMO that you can PVP from day one and be a very real help in fleets. Anyone who doesnt believe this is true simply has no idea what they are talking about.


No, there are others that do. PvE born / based MMOs usually don't, but some PvP games do make people have an enjoyable and fulfilling PvP experience since day 1. I even put some of my early days on other MMOs up on Youtube.

EvE Online portal | EvE markets tutorials
Zack Korth
Livid CO.
#33 - 2013-01-06 12:07:19 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Zack Korth wrote:
no
Then you're just plain old wrong. Again.


actually you are
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#34 - 2013-01-06 12:10:50 UTC
Zack Korth wrote:
actually you are

Nothing you've said so far has been even remotely close to true, nor offered anything that would support any of the uninformed and incorrect claims you've made.
So we can conclude with ease, then, that I was right about that too: it's not GD that is trolling, it is you.

Good to know.
Zack Korth
Livid CO.
#35 - 2013-01-06 12:12:19 UTC
some guy already said it, his year old alt can do the meaningful stuff, you're not looking at it through a new players eyes, which is why everything you've said is wrong, furthermore you're a moron. good to know.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#36 - 2013-01-06 12:14:19 UTC
Zack Korth wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Zack Korth wrote:
no
Then you're just plain old wrong. Again.


actually you are


This seems relivant
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#37 - 2013-01-06 12:15:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Zack Korth wrote:
some guy already said it, his year old alt can do the meaningful stuff, you're not looking at it through a new players eyes, which is why everything you've said is wrong
…except that everyone here has looked at it through a new player's eyes and everyone here (except you) has seen that I'm right. The simple fact of the matter is that there is no gap that needs to be compensated for because it's built into the game and because in the vast majority of the cases, there is no gap to be bridged to begin with.

Quote:
furthermore you're a moron
Unfortunately, personal attacks don't make your incorrect and ignorant assumptions any more right or informed.

Anyway, now that you've shown what you're actually here for… IBTL.
Zack Korth
Livid CO.
#38 - 2013-01-06 12:17:04 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Unfortunately, personal attacks don't make your incorrect and ignorant assumptions any more right or informed.


sure they do, this is the internet
JamesCLK
#39 - 2013-01-06 12:49:25 UTC
*ding ding* And the heavyweight forum warrior Tippia wins again!
Now, where's THE L0CK when you need him?

-- -.-- / -.-. .-.. --- -. . / .. ... / - --- --- / . -..- .--. . -. ... .. ...- . / - --- / ..- -. -.. --- -.-. -.- / ... - --- .--. / .--. .-.. . .- ... . / ... . -. -.. / .... . .-.. .--. / ... - --- .--.
Andrea Roche
State War Academy
Caldari State
#40 - 2013-01-06 12:56:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Andrea Roche
Zack Korth wrote:
We all started EVE at some point, naively believing we were decent when we trained battleships and big guns, bought a plex to fund a battleship, and promptly got said battleships ass kicked into future lolmail status, but I often wonder when the tipping point will come, where people realize "yano, I'm so far behind every other player in this game, and i'll have to sub this account for (however long newbs believe they will have to sub account to easily make a plex worth of isk a month) that its not even worth it", which is a realization they could easily come to near the end of the 14 day trial period.. Being as the games about 10 years old now, how long will it be before more trials than not end in uninstalls?

and most importantly, is that the time eve will start dying? I wonder about it alot, what kind of system could be implemented to "close the gap" for new players without alienating the existing player base? don't know why i waste my brain power trying to solve a problem that won't make ME any money.. but I guess its cause I like the game, and would like it to be around and still populated in 5 or 6 years (should I still be playing) and the players that are starting out today or next week or next year would be the ones around at that time. its hard to enjoy a cutthroat business when your competitor has a chainsaw and all you've got is a plastic spork, is CCP ever gonna hand these lads at least a butterknife?



first you got to concider what are the things that need to "close the gap" on...
isk per hour?
skill points?
game general and mechanic knowledge?

The sad thing about this game is that in "most" cases this has to do with getting to 0.0 where there is no rental agreement and there is a decent stability. The problem is that to get that you need to be part of some major coalition where there are things like ship replacement programs. Otherise your progress will always be very slow compared to the progress of someone in a major coalition or other parts of space.
Another place to progress fast it will be in a wormhole but not any wormhole entity will do. It probably will have to be the top end ones.

The other way around this ofcource is to do like the Honey Botting Coalition and run bots like crazy. CCP says its ilegal to do boting, yet they give you a 3 strike ban policy which is no more than a slap in the hand or they wont do nothing unless they catch you "hands on"
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