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What's wrong with bumping?
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Mag's
Azn Empire
#61 - 2012-12-23 16:44:29 UTC
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
You still refuse to list a benefit.

You have changed absolutely nobody's mind.
You seem to have issues reading. My mind hasn't changed about you, that's for sure.

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.
Amarra Mandalin
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#62 - 2012-12-23 16:46:17 UTC
Ocih wrote:


2012: The Uedama Bump war

Bump wars and the saga of AFK Ice miners.


What a title! Does that come in paperback , too?
J3ssica Alba
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#63 - 2012-12-23 19:55:49 UTC
Nexus Day wrote:
Murk Paradox wrote:
Emu Meo wrote:
Why cant ships cause damage when they crash into one another.

I remember when I was new to the game there were two things which really annoyed me initially. One was warping through planets, and the other was the utterly stupid way that a ship can ram full speed into an object and simply bounce off it. I even stopped playing afterwards and then only took up the game again a few years later.



Next time you undock out of a trade hub... watch the ships. Now think of if damage was involved.

And think of what sort of traffic control a space hub would have if this wasn't a game.



I always imagine the traffic control scene from the Matrix when the Nebuchadnezzar enters Zion docks
This is my signature. There are many others like it, but this one is mine.  Without me, my signature is useless. Without my signature, I am useless
Stein Backstabber
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#64 - 2012-12-23 22:52:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Stein Backstabber
Bumping as a combat tactic is valid and I salute it.

Sissy invertebrates using it to bother other players with no repercussions, on the other hand, well...I respect what I scrape off my boot more than people doing that.


So how does one maintain the first point and neuter the second?


Perhaps have bumping do nothing without a lock on the bumpee, in doing so bumping a locked target it accrues a suspect (or potentially LE) flag. Problem solved. Bumping alive and well as a combat tactic (you're already shooting or about to, right?), it's still all good as any other irritation tactic. Only real change is now it has *some* risk attached.

Tell me me a good reason this wont work? IMO this is right up there with the old neutral RR wardecs in high sec.
Diremage
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#65 - 2012-12-24 04:10:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Diremage
Bump for damage: High slot 'Ram' weapon. Damage based on ram size. Range 1500, massive single target damage.The ram could be to the smartbomb what the new doomsday is to the old doomsday.

Gallente get a flaming torch of doom, Caldari get a kinetic-damage spear, Minmatar get an exploding club, and Amarr get a laser sword.

Admit it, you'd mount one just for the lightsaber.
James 315
Experimental Fun Times Corp RELOADED
CODE.
#66 - 2012-12-24 04:27:24 UTC
Diremage wrote:
Bump for damage: High slot 'Ram' weapon. Damage based on ram size. Range 1500, massive single target damage.The ram could be to the smartbomb what the new doomsday is to the old doomsday.

Gallente get a flaming torch of doom, Caldari get a kinetic-damage spear, Minmatar get an exploding club, and Amarr get a laser sword.

Admit it, you'd mount one just for the lightsaber.

I admit nothing, but I won't deny it either.

MinerBumping.com
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#67 - 2012-12-24 08:10:16 UTC
James 315 wrote:
Diremage wrote:
Bump for damage: High slot 'Ram' weapon. Damage based on ram size. Range 1500, massive single target damage.The ram could be to the smartbomb what the new doomsday is to the old doomsday.

Gallente get a flaming torch of doom, Caldari get a kinetic-damage spear, Minmatar get an exploding club, and Amarr get a laser sword.

Admit it, you'd mount one just for the lightsaber.

I admit nothing, but I won't deny it either.

There's a highslot to use on the drake...

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
admiral root
Red Galaxy
#68 - 2012-12-24 09:43:42 UTC
Diremage wrote:
Bump for damage: High slot 'Ram' weapon. Damage based on ram size. Range 1500, massive single target damage.The ram could be to the smartbomb what the new doomsday is to the old doomsday.

Gallente get a flaming torch of doom, Caldari get a kinetic-damage spear, Minmatar get an exploding club, and Amarr get a laser sword.

Admit it, you'd mount one just for the lightsaber.


It would be glorious!

No, your rights end in optimal+2*falloff
Murk Paradox
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#69 - 2012-12-24 15:32:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Murk Paradox
Emu Meo wrote:
The way ships undock right on top of each other is stupid anyway, if they undocked in a normal manner then you wouldn't have the problem of bumping outside stations anyway. Ships should undock leaving more of a gap, and if there are too many people trying to undock at once then they should be put in a que until it is safe to undock.

I think bumping another ship should just be made more realistic, if not causing damage then at least just cause the shield to reflect the blow in a more realistic manner, and sort out how smaller ships can cause larger ships to go flying without any damage to the smaller ship. If an orca hits into a slasher for instance then it should crush through it without any effect on the orca.



Except those larger ships that take a few seconds to warp off and then the small frigates who bear down on then in .8 seconds and bump...

With damage that frig would die and concord would be extremely busy since the orca "destroyed" the slasher.

Or are you insinuating entire game mechanics of all docks should be revamped to accomodate bumping damage?

Because if so, it would be far easier to just to remove hit collision, but that's not how this game is designed.

Let's come up with improvements, but not reinvent the wheel shall we?

This post has been signed by Murk Paradox and no other accounts, alternate or otherwise. Any other post claiming to be this holder's is subject to being banned at the discretion of the GM Team as it would violate the TOS in regards to impersonation. Signed, Murk Paradox. In triplicate.
March rabbit
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#70 - 2012-12-24 15:45:29 UTC
Stein Backstabber wrote:

Perhaps have bumping do nothing without a lock on the bumpee, in doing so bumping a locked target it accrues a suspect (or potentially LE) flag. Problem solved. Bumping alive and well as a combat tactic (you're already shooting or about to, right?), it's still all good as any other irritation tactic. Only real change is now it has *some* risk attached.

Tell me me a good reason this wont work? IMO this is right up there with the old neutral RR wardecs in high sec.

well. this is first real good post about bumping on these forums.

Only one thing i see here: bumpers. They don't want risk.

The Mittani: "the inappropriate drunked joke"
Murk Paradox
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#71 - 2012-12-24 16:44:26 UTC
March rabbit wrote:
Stein Backstabber wrote:

Perhaps have bumping do nothing without a lock on the bumpee, in doing so bumping a locked target it accrues a suspect (or potentially LE) flag. Problem solved. Bumping alive and well as a combat tactic (you're already shooting or about to, right?), it's still all good as any other irritation tactic. Only real change is now it has *some* risk attached.

Tell me me a good reason this wont work? IMO this is right up there with the old neutral RR wardecs in high sec.

well. this is first real good post about bumping on these forums.

Only one thing i see here: bumpers. They don't want risk.


That would be weird... only have bumps work if targetted? Freighters and miners get targetted and then bumped. Targetting giving a flag would be very VERY bad for everyone everywhere.

This post has been signed by Murk Paradox and no other accounts, alternate or otherwise. Any other post claiming to be this holder's is subject to being banned at the discretion of the GM Team as it would violate the TOS in regards to impersonation. Signed, Murk Paradox. In triplicate.
Mag's
Azn Empire
#72 - 2012-12-24 17:44:13 UTC
Stein Backstabber wrote:
Perhaps have bumping do nothing without a lock on the bumpee, in doing so bumping a locked target it accrues a suspect (or potentially LE) flag.
I'm sure logistics pilots would love this, as well as anyone giving assistance.

Stein Backstabber wrote:
Problem solved.
What problem?

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.
Stein Backstabber
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#73 - 2012-12-24 20:16:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Stein Backstabber
Murk Paradox wrote:
March rabbit wrote:
Stein Backstabber wrote:

Perhaps have bumping do nothing without a lock on the bumpee, in doing so bumping a locked target it accrues a suspect (or potentially LE) flag. Problem solved. Bumping alive and well as a combat tactic (you're already shooting or about to, right?), it's still all good as any other irritation tactic. Only real change is now it has *some* risk attached.

Tell me me a good reason this wont work? IMO this is right up there with the old neutral RR wardecs in high sec.

well. this is first real good post about bumping on these forums.

Only one thing i see here: bumpers. They don't want risk.


That would be weird... only have bumps work if targetted? Freighters and miners get targetted and then bumped. Targetting giving a flag would be very VERY bad for everyone everywhere.



Not on targetting, on colliding with a targetted ship. No undock dramas at Jita that way, still viable as a poor man's point in real combat, still as viable as any other action but now with the attached risk of repercussions.

@Mag's: I view being able to *directly* affect other peoples gameplay without meaningful or remotely interesting equivalent direct possibilities for repercussions a) problematic and b) cowardly. It's a hostile act against another vessel and there are NO real combat related solutions. If you do not see such actions a problem, that is your peroggative. I prefer a world where actions have consequence. Consequence is currently massively lacking from hostile bumping. As I said, it is like neutral RR in high sec in the past - it might be within the rules, but such actions are for the weak imph.
Mag's
Azn Empire
#74 - 2012-12-24 20:39:06 UTC
Stein Backstabber wrote:
@Mag's: I view being able to *directly* affect other peoples gameplay without meaningful or remotely interesting equivalent direct possibilities for repercussions a) problematic and b) cowardly. It's a hostile act against another vessel and there are NO real combat related solutions. If you do not see such actions a problem, that is your peroggative. I prefer a world where actions have consequence. Consequence is currently massively lacking from hostile bumping. As I said, it is like neutral RR in high sec in the past - it might be within the rules, but such actions are for the weak imph.
There are combat related solutions. You can shoot them.

You idea is bad, because of the many unwarranted side effects. But I guess that doesn't matter to you, as long as E-Honour is accounted for. Amirite?

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.
Stein Backstabber
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#75 - 2012-12-24 20:48:49 UTC
Mag's wrote:
Stein Backstabber wrote:
@Mag's: I view being able to *directly* affect other peoples gameplay without meaningful or remotely interesting equivalent direct possibilities for repercussions a) problematic and b) cowardly. It's a hostile act against another vessel and there are NO real combat related solutions. If you do not see such actions a problem, that is your peroggative. I prefer a world where actions have consequence. Consequence is currently massively lacking from hostile bumping. As I said, it is like neutral RR in high sec in the past - it might be within the rules, but such actions are for the weak imph.
There are combat related solutions. You can shoot them.

You idea is bad, because of the many unwarranted side effects. But I guess that doesn't matter to you, as long as E-Honour is accounted for. Amirite?


Thus they hide behind concord.

I asked a serious question - so what are the side effects I've not thought of? What's a demonstrable downside to this? That ECM breaks it? pfft.
Varius Xeral
Doomheim
#76 - 2012-12-24 20:52:59 UTC
Remove NPC corps. Problem solved.

That's kinda the point.

Official Representative of The Nullsec Zealot Cabal
Mag's
Azn Empire
#77 - 2012-12-24 20:55:58 UTC
Stein Backstabber wrote:
Thus they hide behind concord.
Welcome to high sec.

Stein Backstabber wrote:
I asked a serious question - so what are the side effects I've not thought of? What's a demonstrable downside to this? That ECM breaks it? pfft.
I already named them.

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.
Brewlar Kuvakei
Adeptio Gloriae
#78 - 2012-12-24 21:00:27 UTC
The PiMan Eatme wrote:
Bumping a freighter is a way of stopping it warping until extra alpha can arrive to gank it, the reason people say bump the Titan and you die is its quite easy for a spy alt to bump a Titan out of POS shield far enough for a ship in local to decloak, light a cyno and hotdrop it.



Hmmmmm, I'd say this is not the most likely reason for this although it is a worry if the Titan were to get bumped so far out of shield that it was in danger but it's highly unlikely. The main reason for ''bump the Titan and die'' is because it knocks the Titian back into the pos and prevents blues from being able to Titan bridge. So don't warp to 0m on the Titan.
Brewlar Kuvakei
Adeptio Gloriae
#79 - 2012-12-24 21:02:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Brewlar Kuvakei
Varius Xeral wrote:
Remove NPC corps. Problem solved.

That's kinda the point.



Well overdue, loose the eve baggage even if it costs some $'s in this month's quarter. CCP grow some balls in time for the release of Star Citizen or be castrated entirely by it.
Stein Backstabber
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#80 - 2012-12-24 21:04:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Stein Backstabber
Mag's wrote:
Stein Backstabber wrote:
Thus they hide behind concord.
Welcome to high sec.

Stein Backstabber wrote:
I asked a serious question - so what are the side effects I've not thought of? What's a demonstrable downside to this? That ECM breaks it? pfft.
I already named them.


What? logis?

Who would be assisting the bumper? If they are, I fail to see the issue. Assisting the bumpee, nothing has changed afaik.

Apologies if I'm being dim, I've had a few but I genuinely can't see how this hurts logis, please explain - I'm not a logi driver.