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Warfare & Tactics

 
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Our Christmas present to FW

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Mutnin
SQUIDS.
#61 - 2012-12-22 22:59:30 UTC
GenesisMike wrote:


Instead of continuing to build and grow in order to meet the challenge you gave up? Therefore you are giving an excuse and running away.

If there were 30 man Gal groups out chasing you how is that boring? Why don't you adapt your fleet comp to be more of kite group and pick off some of those guys while they chase you. Get creative and make it fun. Or just use the map and set a destination somewhere else and look for fights. Complaining that by Gal militia being active with 30ppl is boring you does not add up. If you honestly have that much of an issue with fighting outnumbered you have 2 choices imo, join RvB or find a new game.

Mike


The bulk of our corp was low skill point players that were new to the game, which means changing fleet comps was a time consuming thing to do. We pretty much set up a basic skill plan to best utilize the lack of skill points and had guys get into a quick 3-5 days Thrasher skill plan then had them push directly into HML Nano Drakes.

We pretty much had no cruisers to choose from because at the time the T1 cruisers hadn't been reworked and the only missile spamming cruiser was the Caracal. Which was a waste of time for the most part outside of killing frigs.

With 50 to 70 guys on average you end up with a 8-12 man fleet unless it's pre-planned. Now keep in mind we were trying to get fights at the height of Gal Militia prime time and they have multiple corps with well over 100 players. It was not uncommon at all to jump into Nennamaila and have 40 to 50 Gals sitting docked in their station.

A few jumps away was Villi which could easily have another 10 to 15 Gals at that time and several jumps the other way Gals held Rakapas at the time and Nis a jump or two away that could easily account for another 20+/- . Added to this is they would never leave this area that we called the blob lands that went from pretty much Vili to Raka.

Meaning if we tried to go through the area we would attract a ******** number of people chasing us around but if we tried to find small groups away from that area there was nothing at all to fight. Added to this not only knowing they out number us 2 or 3 to one they would always over ship to boot.

If we took out a frig & dessie gang we were met with easily equal numbers of frigs & dessies but also cruiser & BC's. If we took out our BC's they would bring BC fleets with full logistics or T3 gangs. If we tried to use plexes to equalize the fighting terms they would just ignore us.

This is why I say they bored me to the point I just stopping trying. I was there to fight, I tried to build a corp to build competent gangs to fight what we were facing, but you can only run so many fleets where the biggest objective is avoiding getting ganked by superior numbers so many times, before you just get bored of never actually getting a fight.

It was simply easier and more fun just to take a small gang and head out to null sec to find a random fight. Sure we might get blobbed or we might get a fight but at least there was a chance of a fun fight and some randomness to it. With Gals it has always been either the whole blob or nothing.
GenesisMike
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#62 - 2012-12-22 23:03:50 UTC  |  Edited by: GenesisMike
Mutnin wrote:
GenesisMike wrote:


Instead of continuing to build and grow in order to meet the challenge you gave up? Therefore you are giving an excuse and running away.

If there were 30 man Gal groups out chasing you how is that boring? Why don't you adapt your fleet comp to be more of kite group and pick off some of those guys while they chase you. Get creative and make it fun. Or just use the map and set a destination somewhere else and look for fights. Complaining that by Gal militia being active with 30ppl is boring you does not add up. If you honestly have that much of an issue with fighting outnumbered you have 2 choices imo, join RvB or find a new game.

Mike


The bulk of our corp was low skill point players that were new to the game, which means changing fleet comps was a time consuming thing to do. We pretty much set up a basic skill plan to best utilize the lack of skill points and had guys get into a quick 3-5 days Thrasher skill plan then had them push directly into HML Nano Drakes.

We pretty much had no cruisers to choose from because at the time the T1 cruisers hadn't been reworked and the only missile spamming cruiser was the Caracal. Which was a waste of time for the most part outside of killing frigs.

With 50 to 70 guys on average you end up with a 8-12 man fleet unless it's pre-planned. Now keep in mind we were trying to get fights at the height of Gal Militia prime time and they have multiple corps with well over 100 players. It was not uncommon at all to jump into Nennamaila and have 40 to 50 Gals sitting docked in their station.

A few jumps away was Villi which could easily have another 10 to 15 Gals at that time and several jumps the other way Gals held Rakapas at the time and Nis a jump or two away that could easily account for another 20+/- . Added to this is they would never leave this area that we called the blob lands that went from pretty much Vili to Raka.

Meaning if we tried to go through the area we would attract a ******** number of people chasing us around but if we tried to find small groups away from that area there was nothing at all to fight. Added to this not only knowing they out number us 2 or 3 to one they would always over ship to boot.

If we took out a frig & dessie gang we were met with easily equal numbers of frigs & dessies but also cruiser & BC's. If we took out our BC's they would bring BC fleets with full logistics or T3 gangs. If we tried to use plexes to equalize the fighting terms they would just ignore us.

This is why I say they bored me to the point I just stopping trying. I was there to fight, I tried to build a corp to build competent gangs to fight what we were facing, but you can only run so many fleets where the biggest objective is avoiding getting ganked by superior numbers so many times, before you just get bored of never actually getting a fight.

It was simply easier and more fun just to take a small gang and head out to null sec to find a random fight. Sure we might get blobbed or we might get a fight but at least there was a chance of a fun fight and some randomness to it. With Gals it has always been either the whole blob or nothing.








30 has now increased to 50 70 +, and training into kiting thrashers is impossible? You can't even put a good amount of effort into making stuff up that sounds remotely plausible.

I really think you need to go with the 2nd option in my previous post.

Mike
Mutnin
SQUIDS.
#63 - 2012-12-23 00:34:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Mutnin
GenesisMike wrote:


30 has now increased to 50 70 +, and training into kiting thrashers is impossible? You can't even put a good amount of effort into making stuff up that sounds remotely plausible.

I really think you need to go with the 2nd option in my previous post.

Mike



Anyone that has lived in or around Black Rise and been involved with FW for more than 6 months knows the numbers that I said are very true. As far as Thrashers if you bothered to read you would have seen that was the 1st ship we had guys train into. We used Thrashers very effectively and even sometimes not so effectively, but after a while one gets bored of just running frig & thrasher gangs.

Thrashers were the bread & butter of our corp, but my focus as a corp was to run competent BC gangs with proper support. We eventually had decent BC gangs but we rarely got to use them because it would have been suicide to do so, with the number imbalance that we faced. We pretty much just used BC's to play with local pirates or when we went on null sec roams.
GenesisMike
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#64 - 2012-12-23 00:48:07 UTC
Mutnin wrote:
GenesisMike wrote:


30 has now increased to 50 70 +, and training into kiting thrashers is impossible? You can't even put a good amount of effort into making stuff up that sounds remotely plausible.

I really think you need to go with the 2nd option in my previous post.

Mike



Anyone that has lived in or around Black Rise and been involved with FW for more than 6 months knows the numbers that I said are very true. As far as Thrashers if you bothered to read you would have seen that was the 1st ship we had guys train into. We used Thrashers very effectively and even sometimes not so effectively, but after a while one gets bored of just running frig & thrasher gangs.

Thrashers were the bread & butter of our corp, but my focus as a corp was to run competent BC gangs with proper support. We eventually had decent BC gangs but we rarely got to use them because it would have been suicide to do so, with the number imbalance that we faced. We pretty much just used BC's to play with local pirates or when we went on null sec roams.


I lived in BR for awhile and 50-70 man fleets were around but not for 5-10 Cal militia roamers. More for fleets of Snuff , SC and the like.

I'll admit, I only scanned a few of your posts since they were rather heavy on the whining side so the thrasher use I must have missed. Back to my point though, learn to adapt. You are complaining to people that had to overcome the very same issue you are facing.... and they have. Less complaining and more trying.

mike
Cat Casidy
Percussive Diplomacy
Intergalactic Space Hobos
#65 - 2012-12-23 02:03:11 UTC
Shout out to the Templis and Happy Endings guys, the other night in raka was fun as hell, thanks for bringing it over and over. Think that was pretty much 6-8 hours of nonstop pew pew. Buck caught a bit of it on fraps and thought I'd share.

Raka plex fights

.
Mutnin
SQUIDS.
#66 - 2012-12-23 02:18:49 UTC
GenesisMike wrote:
Mutnin wrote:
GenesisMike wrote:


30 has now increased to 50 70 +, and training into kiting thrashers is impossible? You can't even put a good amount of effort into making stuff up that sounds remotely plausible.

I really think you need to go with the 2nd option in my previous post.

Mike



Anyone that has lived in or around Black Rise and been involved with FW for more than 6 months knows the numbers that I said are very true. As far as Thrashers if you bothered to read you would have seen that was the 1st ship we had guys train into. We used Thrashers very effectively and even sometimes not so effectively, but after a while one gets bored of just running frig & thrasher gangs.

Thrashers were the bread & butter of our corp, but my focus as a corp was to run competent BC gangs with proper support. We eventually had decent BC gangs but we rarely got to use them because it would have been suicide to do so, with the number imbalance that we faced. We pretty much just used BC's to play with local pirates or when we went on null sec roams.


I lived in BR for awhile and 50-70 man fleets were around but not for 5-10 Cal militia roamers. More for fleets of Snuff , SC and the like.

I'll admit, I only scanned a few of your posts since they were rather heavy on the whining side so the thrasher use I must have missed. Back to my point though, learn to adapt. You are complaining to people that had to overcome the very same issue you are facing.... and they have. Less complaining and more trying.

mike


You keep repeating 50-70 man gangs when I said average of 30. I have no idea where you keep pulling these numbers from.

I said our corp was around 70 members when I was active, taking out gangs and recruiting. I also said it wasn't uncommon to jump into Nenn & see 40 to 50 Gals in local. This was back before Qcats left for Minmatar and and they lived in Nenn, along with various other Gal corps. As I said it was not uncommon to see 40 or 50 of them in there.

I have adapted.. I refuse to play blob games, because it will always end with a bigger blob. I just do solo & small gang when I still play. Sadly CCP has killed the FW that I enjoyed with their misguided ideal of taking systems must mean something other than the PVP it provided.
SAJUK NIGARRA
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#67 - 2012-12-23 12:15:30 UTC
And then there were nine
GenesisMike
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#68 - 2012-12-23 15:10:07 UTC
"With 50 to 70 guys on average you end up with a 8-12 man fleet unless it's pre-planned. Now keep in mind we were trying to get fights at the height of Gal Militia prime time and they have multiple corps with well over 100 players. It was not uncommon at all to jump into Nennamaila and have 40 to 50 Gals sitting docked in their station. "

Ahh, yea with all the number's you were tossing around I mixed some of them up. Like I said the whining in your thread put me into a semi comatose state.

I guess you did adapt in a way... you gave up and started whining on the forums. Nice.

Mike
ALUCARD 1208
Digital Ghosts
#69 - 2012-12-23 15:11:22 UTC
+ 1 here we totally support our sotf brosefs ;)

BEBOPS ODE TO PERUNGA
ALUCARD 1208
Digital Ghosts
#70 - 2012-12-23 15:12:28 UTC
SAJUK NIGARRA wrote:
And then there were nine







\o/ the countdown begins

BEBOPS ODE TO PERUNGA
Antares 04
Doomheim
#71 - 2012-12-23 20:28:07 UTC
Hidden Snake wrote:
Ok ... I was asked by friend to post on his behalf ... so in this case I am the messenger ;) He is quite truth in his message. Pirate


What OP tries to do is basicly snag a PR victory for DnD (and probably get even bigger blob to roll around with new recruits) because the farmers do 95% of the work and probably take most systems over christmas holidays (since farmers wont be away while rest of us will). DnD will simply try to wave that it was "only because of them" it could have happened. This of course is just another gallente bullcrap on top of everything else since previous farmville incarnation saw exactly the same happen that systems were vulnerable for weeks and farmed to hearts content.

After all, on this list DnD does not even feature as a plexing force but the heavy lifting is done by two other alliances and of course the locust swarm of FDU alts: http://evewho.com/faction#tak

As for Caellach comments, it would seem this person suffers from serious case of hubris. That it is only now that broken mechanics of FW have been revealed (and not years or months ago by everyone participating in it) by the gallente wisdom that descended from the sky in a fiery chariot or that allowing CCP's pet militia to take everything would cause CCP to change mechanics.

Are you on crack? In case you didnt notice devs are playing and/or waving flag for gallente militia (Including CCP Soundwave) and they most likely want every Amarr/Caldari player out of the game because some marketing department guy has probably calculated more money is made by the company if there are only two farmer militias and everyone and their dog gets another account to farm isk in them.

Even more deluded is Tiffy's comments. He demands that people fight him because showing to CCP that ships explode on an spreasheet would cause mechanics to be worked out and that massive farming will get highlighted by the fact. Newsflash! The farmville already happened once and only thing CCP did to adjust it was to hand most systems to gallente with ninjapatch.

Ibanez is quite right on his comment. Giving fights to gallentes where they already have multiple times the numbers of opposition, higher payout and parent company working on their behalf would be a worst thing people could do. "Good fights", dont make me laugh. Nobody in eve is after good fights. Everybody is only concerned about how much isk he can make, how safely it can be done and how quickly.

You dont believe me? Just look on how many turncoats jumped the fence to easier ISK (Like Gunnyt31) or how many "Lol, FW is for nooblets" like Percussive Pizza people returned to FW and yes, to the side which makes more money out of it.


Either your friend is a coward who can't post with his/her name to give credit to this opinion, or you are a coward for lying about who made it.

Either way, this is a load of tears and general Caldari whining that deserves absolutely no honest consideration or reply, beyond redicule.

Post with you main and own you irrelevant opinion or have it ignored out of hand.
Dread Operative
Main Corporation
Prisoners With Jobs
#72 - 2012-12-23 20:45:34 UTC
These threads with the Gal Mil/Titan hating make me happy.

http://i.imgur.com/oU3Pw.gif

Delicious. Give me more.
Mutnin
SQUIDS.
#73 - 2012-12-23 21:01:24 UTC
Antares 04 wrote:

Either your friend is a coward who can't post with his/her name to give credit to this opinion, or you are a coward for lying about who made it.

Either way, this is a load of tears and general Caldari whining that deserves absolutely no honest consideration or reply, beyond redicule.

Post with you main and own you irrelevant opinion or have it ignored out of hand.


Much the same as the constant flow of tears we still get from Gals about down time plexing advantage.. Roll
chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate
#74 - 2012-12-23 22:53:59 UTC
Antares 04 wrote:
Hidden Snake wrote:
Ok ... I was asked by friend to post on his behalf ... so in this case I am the messenger ;) He is quite truth in his message. Pirate


What OP tries to do is basicly snag a PR victory for DnD (and probably get even bigger blob to roll around with new recruits) because the farmers do 95% of the work and probably take most systems over christmas holidays (since farmers wont be away while rest of us will). DnD will simply try to wave that it was "only because of them" it could have happened. This of course is just another gallente bullcrap on top of everything else since previous farmville incarnation saw exactly the same happen that systems were vulnerable for weeks and farmed to hearts content.

After all, on this list DnD does not even feature as a plexing force but the heavy lifting is done by two other alliances and of course the locust swarm of FDU alts: http://evewho.com/faction#tak

As for Caellach comments, it would seem this person suffers from serious case of hubris. That it is only now that broken mechanics of FW have been revealed (and not years or months ago by everyone participating in it) by the gallente wisdom that descended from the sky in a fiery chariot or that allowing CCP's pet militia to take everything would cause CCP to change mechanics.

Are you on crack? In case you didnt notice devs are playing and/or waving flag for gallente militia (Including CCP Soundwave) and they most likely want every Amarr/Caldari player out of the game because some marketing department guy has probably calculated more money is made by the company if there are only two farmer militias and everyone and their dog gets another account to farm isk in them.

Even more deluded is Tiffy's comments. He demands that people fight him because showing to CCP that ships explode on an spreasheet would cause mechanics to be worked out and that massive farming will get highlighted by the fact. Newsflash! The farmville already happened once and only thing CCP did to adjust it was to hand most systems to gallente with ninjapatch.

Ibanez is quite right on his comment. Giving fights to gallentes where they already have multiple times the numbers of opposition, higher payout and parent company working on their behalf would be a worst thing people could do. "Good fights", dont make me laugh. Nobody in eve is after good fights. Everybody is only concerned about how much isk he can make, how safely it can be done and how quickly.

You dont believe me? Just look on how many turncoats jumped the fence to easier ISK (Like Gunnyt31) or how many "Lol, FW is for nooblets" like Percussive Pizza people returned to FW and yes, to the side which makes more money out of it.


Either your friend is a coward who can't post with his/her name to give credit to this opinion, or you are a coward for lying about who made it.

Either way, this is a load of tears and general Caldari whining that deserves absolutely no honest consideration or reply, beyond redicule.

Post with you main and own you irrelevant opinion or have it ignored out of hand.


Or option C - his friends main and alts are all banned from the forums :)
Bad Messenger
Rehabilitation Clinic
#75 - 2012-12-23 23:44:05 UTC
SAJUK NIGARRA wrote:
Seems there is a general consensus on these forums that FW is broken again. The factions that are on a downward spiral can’t recover, the farming is going rampant and generally everything is broken, imbalanced or biased.

With that in mind, we decided to put everyone out of their misery and accelerate the ongoing process of collapse that Faction Warfare is experiencing. Over the next months we intend to take all caldari systems, followed by helping minmatar to take all amarr systems. Most of the doctrines we will deploy will be tech 1, giving everyone a fair chance to counter us.

And when there are no more Caldari or Amarr systems left, maybe a new FW can be built, one more in tone with the rest of Eve, without emphasis on PVE and instanced PVP.


Typical gallente plan, fight when war is over and everyone has left, kicking ball to empty goal after match.
Caellach Marellus
Stormcrows
#76 - 2012-12-24 00:19:38 UTC
Bad Messenger wrote:
SAJUK NIGARRA wrote:
Seems there is a general consensus on these forums that FW is broken again. The factions that are on a downward spiral can’t recover, the farming is going rampant and generally everything is broken, imbalanced or biased.

With that in mind, we decided to put everyone out of their misery and accelerate the ongoing process of collapse that Faction Warfare is experiencing. Over the next months we intend to take all caldari systems, followed by helping minmatar to take all amarr systems. Most of the doctrines we will deploy will be tech 1, giving everyone a fair chance to counter us.

And when there are no more Caldari or Amarr systems left, maybe a new FW can be built, one more in tone with the rest of Eve, without emphasis on PVE and instanced PVP.


Typical gallente plan, fight when war is over and everyone has left, kicking ball to empty goal after match.



Reminds me of the time the Squids took everything by logging in when there were no Gallente around post downtime. Didn't stop them doing it though.

When your gut instincts tell you something is wrong, trust them. When your heart tells you something is right, ignore it, check with your brain first. Accept nothing, challenge everything.
Capitol One
Blue Canary
Watch This
#77 - 2012-12-24 00:25:14 UTC
Ho ho ho Big smile
Mutnin
SQUIDS.
#78 - 2012-12-24 01:16:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Mutnin
Caellach Marellus wrote:
Bad Messenger wrote:
SAJUK NIGARRA wrote:
Seems there is a general consensus on these forums that FW is broken again. The factions that are on a downward spiral can’t recover, the farming is going rampant and generally everything is broken, imbalanced or biased.

With that in mind, we decided to put everyone out of their misery and accelerate the ongoing process of collapse that Faction Warfare is experiencing. Over the next months we intend to take all caldari systems, followed by helping minmatar to take all amarr systems. Most of the doctrines we will deploy will be tech 1, giving everyone a fair chance to counter us.

And when there are no more Caldari or Amarr systems left, maybe a new FW can be built, one more in tone with the rest of Eve, without emphasis on PVE and instanced PVP.


Typical gallente plan, fight when war is over and everyone has left, kicking ball to empty goal after match.



Reminds me of the time the Squids took everything by logging in when there were no Gallente around post downtime. Didn't stop them doing it though.



I still am amazed that CCP restricted Gals ability to log in and undock after downtime. This truly is astonishing for CCP to grant this obvious favoritism to Caldari.
chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate
#79 - 2012-12-24 01:35:55 UTC
Bad Messenger wrote:
SAJUK NIGARRA wrote:
Seems there is a general consensus on these forums that FW is broken again. The factions that are on a downward spiral can’t recover, the farming is going rampant and generally everything is broken, imbalanced or biased.

With that in mind, we decided to put everyone out of their misery and accelerate the ongoing process of collapse that Faction Warfare is experiencing. Over the next months we intend to take all caldari systems, followed by helping minmatar to take all amarr systems. Most of the doctrines we will deploy will be tech 1, giving everyone a fair chance to counter us.

And when there are no more Caldari or Amarr systems left, maybe a new FW can be built, one more in tone with the rest of Eve, without emphasis on PVE and instanced PVP.


Typical gallente plan, fight when war is over and everyone has left, kicking ball to empty goal after match.


Except

a) The caldari still have more pilots.
b) The caldari right now have a few pvp gangs out that are larger than anything I can put together atm based on comms numbers.
c) The difference in VP yesterday between Gallente and Caldari is - 1.1%. We're *barely* winning the occupancy war.

Seriously, if the Caldari had a little less "the sky is falling" and a little more "lets spread out and use our superior numbers to take plexes" well, there'd be 0 chance of the gallente taking all the systems.
Cat Casidy
Percussive Diplomacy
Intergalactic Space Hobos
#80 - 2012-12-24 07:13:15 UTC
And then there were eight. Thanks for Tama. P

.