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Covert Ops Frigate bonus, revamp to follow the T1 frigate tiericide?
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Nujabe Nocturne
New Eden Exploration and Uprising Syndicate
#1 - 2012-12-21 05:41:53 UTC
With the recent changes and tiericide T1 frigate changes, now every race does have a new exploration frigate. The Magnate, Imicus, Heron and Probe now all have a +7,5%/lvl scan strength of probes, and 5%/lvl codebreaker, analyzer and salvager cycle time.

These frigates are good for their roles. This is the goal of a tiericide update, right?

But what about the covert ops frigates?



They just have some.. Random damage bonuses coming from nowhere, not even from their old T1 hull. Theses bonuses were pretty useless before already, fighting in a covert ops frigate isnt the best idea in the world. But now with their base hull being revamped to something specialized in exploration, things could make more sense if we would give to these ships their T1 hull bonuses.


The problem is, adding 37,5% more to the scan strength of probes (because you must have your racial frigate at 5 to fly a covops) to the already powerful max +50% seems too much to me. Probing is already fast if you have decent skills, and i'm not even talking when you have a full implant set. We dont want to overpower anything.


The ideal would be to keep the T1 hull bonuses fully, but tune down the covert ops bonus to 2,5%/lvl instead of 10. you would still get +50% at max skills, and will even have a better overall bonus if your racial frigate + covops skills arent maxed, while not changing the maximum bonus the ship would give.

Apart from the helios who does have 5m3 and 5Mbit/sec bandwith, none of them have a drone bay. This would mean they wouldnt be able to be used for solo exploration. The exploration frigates would still have this use: you can do some hi-sec solo exploration with them.

This way, they'd still have different roles, the covops still being more specialized than the T1 exploration frigates. Better at probing, but no combat possibilities.

This is just an idea i just had, i'd like to discuss about it. Imho, covert ops are great for exploration, or afk cloaking. We cant say we see a lot of covops (i'm not talking about the stealth bombers, remember.) on killboards, they're not used to fight.
Grezh
Hextrix Enterprise
#2 - 2012-12-21 06:09:39 UTC
T1 is supposed to be more generalized with T2 being more specialized. I agree that the damage bonus on the covops frigates is nigh useless and could be changed to something else, but you have to keep in mind that the covops frigates are already more specialized then the T1 variants in that they are specialized in clocking and scanning down things. T1 can do more but less effectively, so I do not see a change to covops to make them more generalized.
Nujabe Nocturne
New Eden Exploration and Uprising Syndicate
#3 - 2012-12-21 14:29:42 UTC
Problem is, currently, someone with covops skilled to 3 does have less scanning bonuses by using his covops than his T1 exploration frigate, and will only be better at 4. Ok, you still have the probe speed bonus, but thats all.

It's usually normal for a T2 to be better at its job right from the first level, thats the whole point of specialization. The ability to get cloaked itself is a great specialization by itself, already.
De'Veldrin
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#4 - 2012-12-21 14:52:51 UTC
CCP has acknowledged that in some cases the T1 ships will be better than the T2 ships, until the T2 ships are rebalanced.

That will happen after they are done with the T1 ships, according to the dev blogs.

De'Veldrin's Corollary (to Malcanis' Law): Any idea that seeks to limit the ability of a large nullsec bloc to do something in the name of allowing more small groups into sov null will inevitably make it that much harder for small groups to enter sov null.
Nujabe Nocturne
New Eden Exploration and Uprising Syndicate
#5 - 2012-12-21 15:14:50 UTC
Huh. Should have read them more carefully then.
Sry for the ****** post.
Michael Harari
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
#6 - 2012-12-21 16:08:15 UTC
The damage bonus on covops is fine, you can pvp in them, quite successfully.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#7 - 2012-12-21 21:43:08 UTC
Michael Harari wrote:
The damage bonus on covops is fine, you can pvp in them, quite successfully.


@ OP.... if you get my combat helios nerfed out of PvP... I'll be very, very unhappy....
---- Where's that add-bounty forum button!!!!

Helios vs Jaguar (solokill)
Helios vs Fed Navy Comet (Solokill)
Helios vs Autocannong Wolf (solokill)
Helios vs Arty Wolf (Solokill)
Helios vs Slicer (Solokill)
Helios vs Thrasher (Solokill)
Combat Helios vs Combat Buzzard


p.s. Have patience, CCP will rebalance t2 ships over the next two expansions to bring them inline...
Seranova Farreach
Biomass Negative
#8 - 2012-12-22 09:07:22 UTC
stop whineing. they are probably working hard to "rebalance" the t2 varients andhopfully the navy/pirate faction too.

[u]___________________ http://i.imgur.com/d9Ee2ik.jpg[/u]
Commander Ted
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#9 - 2012-12-22 09:12:42 UTC
Grezh wrote:
T1 is supposed to be more generalized with T2 being more specialized. I agree that the damage bonus on the covops frigates is nigh useless and could be changed to something else,

Battle helios and buzzard ***** havent you ever seen those?

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec.
killorbekilled TBE
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2012-12-22 18:23:29 UTC
I would be unhappy if the cov ops lost there damage bonus , in fact lets turn this around and petition for the helios to have a second turret slot so it can have 2 guns and a cloak

:)