Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Highsec is already overpopulated and reducing highsec space as some have suggested would just concentrate all the high sec players into a smaller area. Since most belts are already mined out now, those wishing to skill up on industry to make ships and modules that you love to blow up so much would find that getting ore is too much of a challenge and decide that the game is not for them. CCP would lose too much revenue from the subsequent loss of these highsec players and be forced to turn off the servers for the last time, never to come back online. Unless some radical changes are made, reducing highsec space is not a viable option.

The biggest problem is that PVP is not a good source of income and for a new player, it incurs too many losses due to skill shortages, newer players can't recover those losses easily. Additionally, to make enough isk to enable players to write off those losses means skilling up on mining and industry but those skills are useless for PVP. By the time you have a respectable amount of isk for PVP, you still have a very long way to go to train your PVP skills, the isk you made to replace losses only lasts for a while.

I know Eve was always meant to be hardcore but spending hours mining or mission running to buy a ship and mods for a couple of minutes of PVP fun each time you get blown up is not hardcore, IT'S JUST DAMNED BORING FOR PVP PLAYERS. The net result is you have a lot of miners and industrialists staying in the game and all the new PVPers leave. Ergo: The overpopulated highsec that you hate so much. Reduce highsec space further so that those miners and industrialists get crammed into an even smaller space and they will leave as well because there isn't enough ore to sustain them all. Remember that they are not PVP players so they won't magically move to lowsec or nullsec. You frightened off all the PVP players by making it TOO hardcore to begin with.

OK, here's my proposal:

Lowsec:
100% insurance payout for replacement T1 ship and mods. The insurance should cover the cost of ALL T1 ship losses, including T1 mods and such so new PVP players are not discouraged. Implants if you are podded are not included as it's your choice to go PVPing with a head full of expensive implants. Clones under a certain grade are also reimbursed by insurance to reduce the losses for new players.

Highsec and nullsec have no changes.

The Story:
The powers that be for each faction have forced insurance payout for all T1 ship losses, as well as the modules on it in lowsec in the hope that pilots will attempt to make it as safe as highsec. This has been limited to T1 replacements ONLY and current standard insurance rates will apply for T2 ships and no payout for T2 modules. Similarly, clone replacement for clones up to a given grade will also be reimbursed by insurance. Concord cannot patrol the lowsec region due to limited personnel but it is the hope that pilots will do the policing in the lowsec regions themselves. Sadly, nullsec cannot be included in this as the insurance cannot support the losses on the scale seen there. No change has been made to current highsec insurance as Concord are currently doing their job to keep illegal killings at bay in that area.

Conclusion:
This would encourage more PVP players into the game. Losses for new players would be minimal to none in lowsec and everyone can enjoy some PVP fun without it being way too hardcore as it is at present. For those who want more hardcore action, nullsec would be their destination. It allows new players to ease into PVP from the start and not have to spend hours recovering their losses every time. You would see more players getting into a ship and diving into lowsec just for the fun of it. As their skills get better and their death/kill ratio starts to lean in the other direction, they will be more inclined to move lower down until they get to nullsec where the hardcore fun starts. By this time, they will have amassed a reasonable amount of skills to survive there and enough isk to replace their losses.


It can be done one of two ways.
1. The ship you lost fitted with the mods you had is cloned in your bay when you dock. This is not really reasonable as it means the pilot is not inconvenienced by the loss and would be more inclined to take silly risks.

2. You have a sheet listing your losses with a link to click on each item which brings up that item in the market so you can buy it from the market yourself. The insurance will meet the cost of the LEAST EXPENSIVE market entry in the region. It's your choice to make up the difference if you want it with less jumps to pick it up. The market window will show the insurance contribution to the cost and yours, if any, separately. This would be easier since we already have kill mails, it just needs a version with a link to the market on each item for the victim.

I would prefer option 2 as this causes the inconvenience of running around for bits to rebuild your ship. If the mod you need is not currently on sale in the region, you may even have to go to another region to find it. Alternatively, get a lower rated one at no cost or pay the difference for a better one. If you get a lower rated one, you get no money in your wallet from the insurance even though it was cheaper than the insured item, (insurance companies aren't stupid ).

This is a rough idea and may be refined more but it would encourage more PVP players in the game.

I don't think I agree with the solution, but I think the statements the proposal is based on need some serious discussion:

1. PVE is always ISK-positive and thus sustains itself. (definitely true)
2. PVP is always a ISK-negative, and thus unsustainable activity. (some doubts about that after the new bounties and FW changes, but for the most part, yes.)
3. PVP-oriented players can't sustain their activity and leave, PVE-oriented players stick, which causes highsec overpopulation.

I have doubts that 2 causes 3, but it obviously might. How would we (or, for that matter, CCP) go about clearly confirming or denying it, when we can't ask the players who have already left?

Ridiculous proposal

I think that would break the market, the Economist Dev team is weeping...I can hear them from here.

The trick is getting into a corp with an SRP, a corp successful enough to throw PvP ships at their players...a corp like...


:3

Really? It seems to work just fine to me. When I need ISK, I earn ISK. When I need to buy something, I buy it. What exactly does "broken" mean? Please answer that in 1 sentence not 4 pages...

Your views seem to come from a perspective that has nothing to do with REAL PVP. It doesn't sound like you have much experience. You do not have to grind missions for hours just for a few minutes fun; if you do, then you're doing it wrong. If you can do level 4 missions for an hour then you can fly T1 cruisers and destroyers for a good few hours PVP. If you can only do level 2's then you can fly T1 frigs in PVP for hours. If you're only getting a few minutes PVP then you need to stop soloing, or find some new wingmen.

Join FW, earn LP and pew at the same time. Run one minor plex (10 minutes and can get a fight too) and be able to afford 20 T1 fit frigates. Have at it guys.

Bad idea because
Making more isk available to players (new or not) or making losses less of a penalty will just encourage a faster rate of inflation, leaving noobs in exactly the same position they are now.

Ur doing it wrong because
newer players that want to get into pvp should not be trying to buy expensive blingy ships and expecting to be able to take on the pro solo pvp'ers in low sec. U have along way to go in skill points, piloting skill AND isk to get to that point. Instead newer players should focus on flying simple, cheap and expendable ships until they learn the ropes. Fly these ships in groups with other noobs (u should definitely try tagging along on at least one of RvB's sunday roams) and u wont need to grind for hours whilst still being somewhat formidable.


it is difficult to make money in PVP because
it is so competitive. U cannot just be a general pvp'er and expect to profit from the activity when only half of the loot drops. u'd need to kill 4-5 ships for each one lost to break even, but this is of course highly dependent on the drops. so u have to be an exceptional pvp'er to make money from it and/or u need to be a very well known corp/alliance to be sought after as mercs.
there is also the way of the ganker, where u can make billions with a tiny 2mil isk ship, but u wont be popular amongst other carebears.

The way it is
PVP in eve is an art that most of us do as a hobby and pay for it with our day jobs (missioning, mining). However, there are those with the skill and resources to make a living from it.

U need to understand
If losses become meaningless, then carelessness is not penalized. and if carelessness is not penalized, then carefulness and diligence is not rewarded. Suddenly an influx of idiots and WoW players that don't belong. This would be a more likely cause for the game to close down as the core subscribers and the people who stick with this game and keep coming back, would leave for good.

read number one and i see that the losing players will not be spending isk to replace the said items. This gives a greater supply of isk (as they havent been spending as much, everyone has more) and therefore reduces its value...whoops inflation.

go learn how to pvp properly by finding other ppl to play with, having the more experienced ones teach u and flying along side the other noobs in non-expensive ships.

maybe while in the militia you should be given a "basic Faction war frigate" for the faction you join when you dock up in your pod or w/e a bit like how the "noobships" are the gateway back to pve there should be a pvp one too which is good enough to fend off or atleast live a bit longer against t1 fit t1 frigates and possably also to allow them to beable to be good enough to do like L1 and/or L2 fw sites so they can get the LP needed for a Navy frig?

dnt venture out alone. find friends and learn from each other. RvB are really great for this.