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For those crying about the drone changes.

Author
Villaseni
Doomheim
#1 - 2012-12-07 15:42:29 UTC
I am here to wipe away your tears. Here is a step by step guide of how not to be a whining crybaby and adapt to the changes.
Step 1: Fit small remote armor rep to one of your many utility high slots
Step 2: Accept mission
Step 3: Go to mission site
Step 4: Drop sentries
Step 5: Put small armor rep on 1 sentry
Step 6: Kill everything

You may thank me later, isk donations for this fantastic guide are welcome.
Equinox Spider
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2012-12-07 15:56:22 UTC
Villaseni wrote:
I am here to wipe away your tears. Here is a step by step guide of how not to be a whining crybaby and adapt to the changes.
Step 1: Fit small remote armor rep to one of your many utility high slots
Step 2: Accept mission
Step 3: Go to mission site
Step 4: Drop sentries
Step 5: Put small armor rep on 1 sentry
Step 6: Kill everything

You may thank me later, isk donations for this fantastic guide are welcome.


Personally never though of this, i havent use sentries before, are they capable of shooting frigates?
Villaseni
Doomheim
#3 - 2012-12-07 16:06:08 UTC
Equinox Spider wrote:
Villaseni wrote:
I am here to wipe away your tears. Here is a step by step guide of how not to be a whining crybaby and adapt to the changes.
Step 1: Fit small remote armor rep to one of your many utility high slots
Step 2: Accept mission
Step 3: Go to mission site
Step 4: Drop sentries
Step 5: Put small armor rep on 1 sentry
Step 6: Kill everything

You may thank me later, isk donations for this fantastic guide are welcome.


Personally never though of this, i havent use sentries before, are they capable of shooting frigates?


From afar, yes. Shoot the frigates first
Jenn aSide
Worthless Carebears
The Initiative.
#4 - 2012-12-07 16:25:20 UTC
Villaseni wrote:
I am here to wipe away your tears. Here is a step by step guide of how not to be a whining crybaby and adapt to the changes.
Step 1: Fit small remote armor rep to one of your many utility high slots
Step 2: Accept mission
Step 3: Go to mission site
Step 4: Drop sentries
Step 5: Put small armor rep on 1 sentry
Step 6: Kill everything

You may thank me later, isk donations for this fantastic guide are welcome.


For those crying about those crying about "NPC AI changes" (drones weren't changed).

Step 1: read up on the changes
Step 2: Realize Sentries are not nearly as hated by npcs as other drones are
step 3: get scrammed by stuff that sentries can't hit while whole room has you aggro'd
step 4: put out light drones to kill scraming npcs while doing dps from main ship + other ewar + remote repping trying to generate enough threat to get aggro off light drones
step 5: watch your light drones vanish from frig npc alphas despite the fact that your ship is generating loads of threat
step 6: explode
Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
#5 - 2012-12-07 16:25:25 UTC
And the solution for non CNR/Domi pilots that do not have any utility high slots is?

I have only ran a couple missions since the patch. So far the impact seems much less than it was on the test server. I have not lost any drones. But the NPC's seem to be doing much more damage. Does the change to the A.I. allow the NPC's to apply damage better? Maybe it is just me but I had to warp out of a mission when my tank broke, which I have not had to do for a very long time.

FOXFOUR did say she adjusted the drone agro since I last tested it on the test server. It seems it may have been enough although you really do need to watch and properly manage your drones. Don't just let them attack on their own or they will get popped.



Villaseni
Doomheim
#6 - 2012-12-07 16:35:31 UTC
Domi pilot - take out 1 gun/DLA and put in said small remote armor rep. Aditionally take out 1 cap recharger and fit a target painter for addidional threat generation

CNR pilot - You arent a droneboat.
Liandri Jenquai
Doomheim
#7 - 2012-12-07 17:36:47 UTC
Villaseni wrote:
Domi pilot - take out 1 gun/DLA and put in said small remote armor rep. Aditionally take out 1 cap recharger and fit a target painter for addidional threat generation

CNR pilot - You arent a droneboat.



You realize a lot of people crying about drones aren't crying about drone boats right? The problem is light drones getting nuked by frigates the instant you deploy them to handle scramblers.

When a frigate is orbiting you at 7k and you deploy 5 hobgoblins and 2 of them die before they even reach their target, that is a broken mechanic.

Thanks for your useless advice though.
Sgt LoveDragon
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2012-12-07 17:42:30 UTC
Ewar doesnt work, neither does RR.
I speak from experience.
That is all.
Dacryphile
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#9 - 2012-12-07 18:12:36 UTC
Step 1) Try Hammerheads against frigs
Step 2) Realize NPC frigs don't shoot Hammerheads
Step 3) Stop bitching
Sgt LoveDragon
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2012-12-07 18:20:11 UTC
What part of eve do you hail from where npc frigates are the only ships with guns.
Rhaetic
Black Ice Consortium
#11 - 2012-12-07 19:46:27 UTC
The real problem I'm having is the whole room aggroing upon arrival.

If I could pull groups and primary the Frigs with a sniper-fit Maelstrom then I would probably be alright. However, since the whole room aggros and the Frigs move so fast, I only get to primary a few of them before they are all on top of me with various forms of EW and scramming.

I know I've newly-returned after nearly two years of being gone, but I actually found some of the missions to be pretty difficult before these changes. As a low-SP pilot running a T1 Maelstrom, the recent change makes running even modestly difficult missions nearly impossible.

If the only problem was Frigs I could deal with that; Battleships have plenty of ways to deal with Frigs if you are willing to do a warp-and-swap, but I can't deal with the entire room coming down on me, especially in rooms where you get A-gated directly into the fray.
starbelt stacy
State War Academy
Caldari State
#12 - 2012-12-07 21:24:07 UTC
the way i see it is that a few things need to be changed.

they should either up the rewards for level 4's since l4 runners have more risk of being popped now, also the ai is the same as the sleeper AI which gives better rewards.... a few of you love this term risk v reward l4 runners now have more risk of being popped so fairs fair cant have it both ways.

if the aim of the changes is to cut down on the amount of isk gained from running missions, a timer needs to be put in place to limit the amount of missions and get rid of the stupid ai changes.

if the aim is to stop AFK'ing missions (personally i believe this is a red herring) dont think its as common as people say, how do you know they are AFK'ing in the first place? .... if you knwo they are afk'ing / botting ... ban them = simples.

also if the isk is too high nerf the bounties for all npcs ingame for all and not just nerf mission runners like myself who are casual gamers and dont get massive amounts of isk form level 4's... im lucky if i do 8 missions a night.



Hae Sung
#13 - 2012-12-10 04:10:02 UTC
Dacryphile wrote:
Step 1) Try Hammerheads against frigs
Step 2) Realize NPC frigs don't shoot Hammerheads
Step 3) Stop bitching



This x100. I'm not sure if its because of the sig size of the medium drones, but i was more than able to use T2 Hammerheads to kill all of the frigs on 5 consecutive missions today with one 1 swap in agro (near the end of the room while mopping up 1-2 remaining frigs.

It takes a little while longer due to tracking issues, but they don't die and still kill warp scramblers.
Anneliese Pollard
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2012-12-10 04:39:01 UTC
Frigs in my experience have targeted lights, mediums, and heavies.

Also, BSes can target sentries. If they're optimal and 12 BSes alpha your sentry, its gone.

No repper can save the drones from that kind of alpha.

Ahn Tee Mahtur
#15 - 2012-12-10 07:47:51 UTC
Dacryphile wrote:
Step 1) Try Hammerheads against frigs
Step 2) Realize NPC frigs don't shoot Hammerheads
Step 3) Stop bitching

A wild Alt has appeared!
Morrigan LeSante
Perkone
Caldari State
#16 - 2012-12-10 07:51:28 UTC
Hae Sung wrote:
Dacryphile wrote:
Step 1) Try Hammerheads against frigs
Step 2) Realize NPC frigs don't shoot Hammerheads
Step 3) Stop bitching



This x100. I'm not sure if its because of the sig size of the medium drones, but i was more than able to use T2 Hammerheads to kill all of the frigs on 5 consecutive missions today with one 1 swap in agro (near the end of the room while mopping up 1-2 remaining frigs.

It takes a little while longer due to tracking issues, but they don't die and still kill warp scramblers.


That's funny, because they're shooting my salvage drones, never mind the hate a drone type that actually damages them picks up.


Personally I've all but disposed of drones as a weapon system and now nearly exclusively use salvagers, fortunately, I'm rocking a missile boat so I can get the little buggers with precision/equivalent weapons.

I feel for those gunboat folks though.
Liandri Jenquai
Doomheim
#17 - 2012-12-11 02:26:50 UTC
Dacryphile wrote:
Step 1) Try Hammerheads against frigs
Step 2) Realize NPC frigs don't shoot Hammerheads
Step 3) Stop bitching


Nice one!

Except if that were true we'd be right back here to square one getting told to adapt when they fix that.

And nevermind the fact that one of my hammerheads was blown up by an npc battleship that it was orbiting.
Rengerel en Distel
#18 - 2012-12-11 03:51:04 UTC
1) CCP has said it's a bug, so it's not really a drone change, it's a broken AI.
2) See #1.

With the increase in shiptoasting, the Report timer needs to be shortened.

Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#19 - 2012-12-11 04:51:50 UTC
Rengerel en Distel wrote:
1) CCP has said it's a bug, so it's not really a drone change, it's a broken AI.
2) See #1.

They are really quick at releasing hotfixes.
I wonder, can they still navigate their code these days? Big smile
Hae Sung
#20 - 2012-12-11 05:04:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Hae Sung
Rengerel en Distel wrote:
1) CCP has said it's a bug, so it's not really a drone change, it's a broken AI.
2) See #1.


CCP has identified the whole room agro to be a bug that they're working on. The deal with frigs targeting drones is WAI afaik? Once they change the agro management coding so that all of Vengeance doesn't agro on your ship when you warp in the room you will still need to figure out a way to deal with the frigs that are scramming and webbing you, but it should be MUCH more manageable.


Morgan LeSante wrote:
That's funny, because they're shooting my salvage drones, never mind the hate a drone type that actually damages them picks up.


I believe this to be a function of the difference in sig radius actually. Salvage drones maintain the same sig radius (25m) as light drones.

I might just be crazy for this assumption, but I pretty much think its about how far off the target is from the NPC's programmed sig radius targets, then modified by how "threatening" the target is. When I was in missions with my friend in his Assault Frigate, I could keep the frigates or the cruisers off of him in my CNR. My drones were pretty much able to do whatever they wanted for the duration of the mission.
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