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Carebears with bounties, welcome back to EVE

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raskonalkov
Tie Fighters Inc
#141 - 2012-12-08 03:47:25 UTC
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Xavier Hasberin wrote:
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
I didn't argue about taking on personalities, I argued about starting on even ground, and as such, always having the same means to defend yourself that all other players have. A nerdy kid can get beat up in school because he doesn't have the body mass of a bumbling football jock, but in EVE, everyone can equip the same guns, the same armor plates, and the same tackling modules. Being defenseless in EVE is a choice.


Doesn't that ignore several things, such as most mining ships aren't heavily armed?

No, but they can be heavily tanked, to deter attacks.



Nice all nerds should get fat then to deter the bullying of bullies. Smart.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#142 - 2012-12-08 03:47:58 UTC
Galaxy Pig wrote:
Ok, so you're assuming that if a miner has a bounty he must deserve it huh?

It's funny because everyone has a bounty now <3

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Frying Doom
#143 - 2012-12-08 03:48:15 UTC
Galaxy Pig wrote:
Frying Doom wrote:
Galaxy Pig wrote:
Frying Doom wrote:
Galaxy Pig wrote:
So, you decline to answer my questions?

Market forces will kill carebears, as you seem unable to grasp simple concepts.

People with balls will kill them, not craven cowards that have to bully.



No, these questions silly:
Do you mind explaining why you feel carebears with bounties deserve to die while those without a bounty don't? Also, why should carebears without bounties be effectively safe?

Market forces.

If they have annoyed someone to the point that they have made it economically profitable, well welcome to capitalism. If not picking on the defenseless to improve your own self esteem is just bullying.


Ok, so you're assuming that if a miner has a bounty he must deserve it huh?

No I am assuming that if a miner has a bounty on them then their death is something other than inflating someones self esteem. So it becomes a case of capitalism rather than bullying.

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!
Frying Doom
#144 - 2012-12-08 03:51:59 UTC
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Have you ever actually been in a situation where your choices are either giving up your possessions, or most likely getting stabbed in the neck? Because I have. Don't compare a video game to real life. You'll simply make a fool of yourself.

Sorry was this directed at me?

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!
Galaxy Pig
New Order Logistics
CODE.
#145 - 2012-12-08 03:52:44 UTC
Ok, so it's not who I kill, it's why huh? And why is it again that certain players should be effectively immune to attack?

Highsec is owned by players now. Systems 0.5-1.0 are New Order Territory. All miners and other residents of Highsec must obey The Code. Mining without a permit is dangerous and harmful to the EVE community. See www.MinerBumping.com
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#146 - 2012-12-08 03:56:51 UTC
raskonalkov wrote:
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Xavier Hasberin wrote:
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
I didn't argue about taking on personalities, I argued about starting on even ground, and as such, always having the same means to defend yourself that all other players have. A nerdy kid can get beat up in school because he doesn't have the body mass of a bumbling football jock, but in EVE, everyone can equip the same guns, the same armor plates, and the same tackling modules. Being defenseless in EVE is a choice.


Doesn't that ignore several things, such as most mining ships aren't heavily armed?

No, but they can be heavily tanked, to deter attacks.



Nice all nerds should get fat then to deter the bullying of bullies. Smart.

A fallacy. People can have physical limitations that are different than just not eating enough cheeseburgers. Some will be predestined to have low bone or muscle mass, some will be predestined to be shorter than average, and some will have genetic diseases that prevent them from doing anything at all.

Meanwhile, in EVE, everyone starts out with the same 50,000 skillpoints, 5,000 ISK, and a rookie ship.

I'm sorry, this is simply an argument you guys can't win. This is a video game, and as such, every deontological model normally applied to contemporary morality falls flat on its face.

This is an MMORPG, and an open-ended one at that, remember? People can pretend to be anyone they want, including bloodthirsty, mindless killers. And because this is a game, and not real life, punishing such people by removing them from it makes no sense. However, you're free to use the tools universally provided to every player to deal with people you don't like. You don't want mean griefers attacking innocent miners? Then defend the miners with your own guns. Or you can hire other people to defend them for you. Or you can teach them avoidance tactics.

Or you can whine about morality, and beg CCP to automate punishment for undesirable behavior.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted
Frying Doom
#147 - 2012-12-08 04:02:00 UTC
Galaxy Pig wrote:
Ok, so it's not who I kill, it's why huh? And why is it again that certain players should be effectively immune to attack?

No one should be, but by the same token no one should pretend that their actions of ganking Hi-sec miners for no reason other than to make them selves feel better is anything other than cowardly.

You are not doing this game any kind of service, you are just making yourself feel better by making others feel worse.

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!
Frying Doom
#148 - 2012-12-08 04:10:37 UTC
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
raskonalkov wrote:
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Xavier Hasberin wrote:
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
I didn't argue about taking on personalities, I argued about starting on even ground, and as such, always having the same means to defend yourself that all other players have. A nerdy kid can get beat up in school because he doesn't have the body mass of a bumbling football jock, but in EVE, everyone can equip the same guns, the same armor plates, and the same tackling modules. Being defenseless in EVE is a choice.


Doesn't that ignore several things, such as most mining ships aren't heavily armed?

No, but they can be heavily tanked, to deter attacks.



Nice all nerds should get fat then to deter the bullying of bullies. Smart.

A fallacy. People can have physical limitations that are different than just not eating enough cheeseburgers. Some will be predestined to have low bone or muscle mass, some will be predestined to be shorter than average, and some will have genetic diseases that prevent them from doing anything at all.

Meanwhile, in EVE, everyone starts out with the same 50,000 skillpoints, 5,000 ISK, and a rookie ship.

I'm sorry, this is simply an argument you guys can't win. This is a video game, and as such, every deontological model normally applied to contemporary morality falls flat on its face.

This is an MMORPG, and an open-ended one at that, remember? People can pretend to be anyone they want, including bloodthirsty, mindless killers. And because this is a game, and not real life, punishing such people by removing them from it makes no sense. However, you're free to use the tools universally provided to every player to deal with people you don't like. You don't want mean griefers attacking innocent miners? Then defend the miners with your own guns. Or you can hire other people to defend them for you. Or you can teach them avoidance tactics.

Or you can whine about morality, and beg CCP to automate punishment for undesirable behavior.

Actually I was unaware anyone here had asked CCP to remove this form of cowardly attack.

Yes we all start out in this game the same and develop differently. Some use the game to create, some to destroy and others use the game a medium to make them selves feel better by making others feel worse.

Yes we have the ability in game of trying to prevent this behaviour but what is to prevent said person from just closing the old account and starting a new one when they are below -5. It is more efficient to attempt to alter the social aspects of the games than it is to force CCP to limit accounts per person (To get them to stop allowing a person to close an account and open another).

So that being said making people aware that these sad gankers are doing it only to inflate their badly punctured egos and that it is more healthy for us to force them into another path is more beneficial for the game and them selves.

As it goes if we give them a fish we feed them for a day, if we teach them to fish we feed them for life.

So if we let them gank they feel better for a short time, if we teach them the benefits of Null or lo-sec piracy or so many areas of the game we make them fill their own selfs for life.

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#149 - 2012-12-08 04:16:52 UTC
It's a myth; no one actually recycles gank alts. Okay, well, not no one, but the proportion of people who do to those who don't is so tiny, it's inconsequential.

And I have nothing against people wanting to "teach" pirates to "pirate" in other areas of space, as long as they do so by their own initiative, and not through hard-coded gameplay mechanics won via whining concessions from CCP.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted
Xavier Hasberin
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#150 - 2012-12-08 04:18:45 UTC
Destiny Corrupted wrote:


This is an MMORPG, and an open-ended one at that, remember? People can pretend to be anyone they want, including bloodthirsty, mindless killers. And because this is a game, and not real life, punishing such people by removing them from it makes no sense. However, you're free to use the tools universally provided to every player to deal with people you don't like. You don't want mean griefers attacking innocent miners? Then defend the miners with your own guns. Or you can hire other people to defend them for you. Or you can teach them avoidance tactics.

Or you can whine about morality, and beg CCP to automate punishment for undesirable behavior.


The other tool I can use is ridicule, and it seems to work rather well, in that PvPers get all bent out of shape when they're not being treated as 'celebrities', but rather as parasites on the body of EVE. Blink
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#151 - 2012-12-08 04:20:59 UTC
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Or you can whine about morality, and beg CCP to automate punishment for undesirable behavior.

Buff CONCORD.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#152 - 2012-12-08 04:21:55 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Or you can whine about morality, and beg CCP to automate punishment for undesirable behavior.

Buff CONCORD.

So how long are you going to beat around the bush with our marriage? I'm running out of things to tell my mother here.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted
Frying Doom
#153 - 2012-12-08 04:25:47 UTC
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
It's a myth; no one actually recycles gank alts. Okay, well, not no one, but the proportion of people who do to those who don't is so tiny, it's inconsequential.

And I have nothing against people wanting to "teach" pirates to "pirate" in other areas of space, as long as they do so by their own initiative, and not through hard-coded gameplay mechanics won via whining concessions from CCP.

Much like I am against government regulations in RL, I am against CCP putting in things that actively block such conduct.

I think they have the balance right now, you can gank profitably if the person is stupid and hauls billions put massively expensive equitment on or has a nice bounty.

I personally would hate not being able to gank some jerk who really deserved it but on the other side of that I do not condone attacking unarmed ships for no reason at all other than to make the ganker feel better. That is the path to cowardice.

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!
Galaxy Pig
New Order Logistics
CODE.
#154 - 2012-12-08 04:29:50 UTC
Frying Doom wrote:
Galaxy Pig wrote:
Ok, so it's not who I kill, it's why huh? And why is it again that certain players should be effectively immune to attack?

No one should be, but by the same token no one should pretend that their actions of ganking Hi-sec miners for no reason other than to make them selves feel better is anything other than cowardly.

You are not doing this game any kind of service, you are just making yourself feel better by making others feel worse.


Okay! We're getting somewhere! So, we've established that no one should be safe, so if nowhere should be safe then it falls on someone to make it that way, does it not? And if so, what does it matter why they really do it? You've assumed a lot about me and why I kill carebears, but in the end, what the hell does it matter? It has to be done. This is EVE.

Highsec is owned by players now. Systems 0.5-1.0 are New Order Territory. All miners and other residents of Highsec must obey The Code. Mining without a permit is dangerous and harmful to the EVE community. See www.MinerBumping.com
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#155 - 2012-12-08 04:31:33 UTC
Frying Doom wrote:
I personally would hate not being able to gank some jerk who really deserved it but on the other side of that I do not condone attacking unarmed ships for no reason at all other than to make the ganker feel better. That is the path to cowardice.

Ganking for the lulz is also more or less a myth. Most ganking is done for profit, direct (haulers, pre-buff barges) or indirect (ice interdiction, also pre-buff barges). Then some ganking is done as a statement, either of ability, or intent. Some is done for revenge, or as part of a contract. Despite what you read on the forums, I don't think there's a whole lot of people out there who gank purely for the joy of seeing someone suffer.

Now, are there tears? Yes, there are. Are those tears very enjoyable? Certainly so. But tears is just an added, anecdotal bonus.

Ganking is motive-driven. It's expensive, and time-consuming to pull off, and not something you do just for kicks. There are much better, more efficient ways to grief players just to get a reaction out of them.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted
Frying Doom
#156 - 2012-12-08 04:41:21 UTC
Galaxy Pig wrote:
Frying Doom wrote:
Galaxy Pig wrote:
Ok, so it's not who I kill, it's why huh? And why is it again that certain players should be effectively immune to attack?

No one should be, but by the same token no one should pretend that their actions of ganking Hi-sec miners for no reason other than to make them selves feel better is anything other than cowardly.

You are not doing this game any kind of service, you are just making yourself feel better by making others feel worse.


Okay! We're getting somewhere! So, we've established that no one should be safe, so if nowhere should be safe then it falls on someone to make it that way, does it not? And if so, what does it matter why they really do it? You've assumed a lot about me and why I kill carebears, but in the end, what the hell does it matter? It has to be done. This is EVE.

Now what has to be done is the ridicule of cowards who can not fight against anything but defenseless targets.

You are not doing anyone a favour not even your self.

Your kind of bottom feeding scum will only cause the ability to gank those who are deserving to be removed in its entirety as the carebears will eventually have had enough.

Your kind of parasite has caused so many changes to this game, bugger all of them good. Yes the goons did ice interdictions and before that there was hulkagedon, year after year, all good all for a purpose. Bugger all was changed till the interdiction plus people like you jumping on the band wagon via the goons lo bounties

Subsequently miners have better barges and there are more and more restrictions on ganking, you pathetic bottom feeding brethren will be the cause of making Hi-sec totally safe.

So your need to feel better by making others feel worse will only end with the destruction of Hi-sec revenge for us all.

No you are not doing anyone a favour, become a real member of society, go to Null. Grow a pair.

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!
Frying Doom
#157 - 2012-12-08 04:42:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Frying Doom
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Frying Doom wrote:
I personally would hate not being able to gank some jerk who really deserved it but on the other side of that I do not condone attacking unarmed ships for no reason at all other than to make the ganker feel better. That is the path to cowardice.

Ganking for the lulz is also more or less a myth. Most ganking is done for profit, direct (haulers, pre-buff barges) or indirect (ice interdiction, also pre-buff barges). Then some ganking is done as a statement, either of ability, or intent. Some is done for revenge, or as part of a contract. Despite what you read on the forums, I don't think there's a whole lot of people out there who gank purely for the joy of seeing someone suffer.

Now, are there tears? Yes, there are. Are those tears very enjoyable? Certainly so. But tears is just an added, anecdotal bonus.

Ganking is motive-driven. It's expensive, and time-consuming to pull off, and not something you do just for kicks. There are much better, more efficient ways to grief players just to get a reaction out of them.

Yes most of it is done for profit, thats why I said gank miners with good bounties not just anyone.

Not really that hard to pull of unless you mean freighter ganking.

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#158 - 2012-12-08 04:47:08 UTC
Miners don't really get ganked much anymore.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted
Frying Doom
#159 - 2012-12-08 04:49:22 UTC
Galaxy Pig wrote:
Now that killing you is profitable again, I would like to cordially welcome you back to EVE Online. Unlike that game you were playing in November, EVE is a mulitplayer game in which you are a target. It requires some amount of cunning, situational awareness, and general paranoia. On some level you will feel a bit uneasy when you undock, this is working as intended, and we welcome you back into our ranks as typical, slightly nervous EVE players. Have fun, see you in the belts. ;)

See above statement.

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!
Galaxy Pig
New Order Logistics
CODE.
#160 - 2012-12-08 04:50:47 UTC
Frying Doom wrote:
Galaxy Pig wrote:
Frying Doom wrote:
Galaxy Pig wrote:
Ok, so it's not who I kill, it's why huh? And why is it again that certain players should be effectively immune to attack?

No one should be, but by the same token no one should pretend that their actions of ganking Hi-sec miners for no reason other than to make them selves feel better is anything other than cowardly.

You are not doing this game any kind of service, you are just making yourself feel better by making others feel worse.


Okay! We're getting somewhere! So, we've established that no one should be safe, so if nowhere should be safe then it falls on someone to make it that way, does it not? And if so, what does it matter why they really do it? You've assumed a lot about me and why I kill carebears, but in the end, what the hell does it matter? It has to be done. This is EVE.

Now what has to be done is the ridicule of cowards who can not fight against anything but defenseless targets.

You are not doing anyone a favour not even your self.

Your kind of bottom feeding scum will only cause the ability to gank those who are deserving to be removed in its entirety as the carebears will eventually have had enough.

Your kind of parasite has caused so many changes to this game, bugger all of them good. Yes the goons did ice interdictions and before that there was hulkagedon, year after year, all good all for a purpose. Bugger all was changed till the interdiction plus people like you jumping on the band wagon via the goons lo bounties

Subsequently miners have better barges and there are more and more restrictions on ganking, you pathetic bottom feeding brethren will be the cause of making Hi-sec totally safe.

So your need to feel better by making others feel worse will only end with the destruction of Hi-sec revenge for us all.

No you are not doing anyone a favour, become a real member of society, go to Null. Grow a pair.


Ok, so no one should be safe, but the people who make it that way are bottom-feeding griefer scum who are responsible for carebearizing the game. Lol, I knew if I gave you enough rope you'd hang yourself. ^_^

Highsec is owned by players now. Systems 0.5-1.0 are New Order Territory. All miners and other residents of Highsec must obey The Code. Mining without a permit is dangerous and harmful to the EVE community. See www.MinerBumping.com