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How to initiate a bounty hunting engagement?

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Gilbaron
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#21 - 2012-12-04 16:28:06 UTC
you don't need a reason, you need an incentive. an x bazillion bounty on alliance X is a pretty good one
Renier Gaden
Immortal Guides
#22 - 2012-12-04 16:50:54 UTC
Schmata Bastanold wrote:
Renier Gaden wrote:
CCP Soundwave wrote:
Concord will intervene (unless they have an open killright you can trigger of course)

What I want to know is how do you activate a Suspect flag on the target of a Kill Right? Does shooting someone you have a Kill Right to activate the Suspect flag, or does the Kill Right give you a menu option to activate the Suspect Flag so that you can kill them without being Concorded?


Look at pictures if you can't read


I was going off the patch notes, where it was not clear, and there were no pictures. I had not seen this Blog. So I guess I should thank you for the link.
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#23 - 2012-12-04 17:08:06 UTC
Vol Arm'OOO wrote:
Dark Long wrote:
why do people think the new bounty system is open killing rights its not.



Because thats the way it should have been - the way people expected it to be. The current change is nothing but a minor incremental little tweak that does nothing to really boost pvp -- after all in low/null people dont need a reason to shoot at folk while in empire you are still inhibited by concord and sec status. So basically bounty hunting boils down to a mechanism to promote suicide ganking. Its a shame since it could have been so much more, e.g. purchasable aggro rights akin to individual war decs between individual players similar to the war decs that exist between corporations. Kinda reminds me of incursions in how they just dont live up to their potential.

You really, really need to think about how exploitable what you think you want would really be.

Bounties are an incentive, as intended.
Sellable kill rights are a way to circumvent aggression rules, as intended.
It is much easier to become a suspect and be shot by everyone, as intended.

I think that's quite enough for the moment.

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Skippermonkey
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#24 - 2012-12-04 17:38:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Skippermonkey
Dark Long wrote:
why do people think the new bounty system is open killing rights its not.

Read the notes.

People mixing the ideas of Bounties and Killrights up as expected

Reminds me of the whole ridiculous mess of tech 3 and tier 3 ships

EDIT - people are acting like the idea of bounties is a new thing? You guys DID know we had bounties before this expansion right!?

COME AT ME BRO

I'LL JUST BE DOCKED IN THIS STATION
Vol Arm'OOO
Central Co-Prosperity Union
#25 - 2012-12-04 17:58:52 UTC
Ranger 1 wrote:
Vol Arm'OOO wrote:
Dark Long wrote:
why do people think the new bounty system is open killing rights its not.



Because thats the way it should have been - the way people expected it to be. The current change is nothing but a minor incremental little tweak that does nothing to really boost pvp -- after all in low/null people dont need a reason to shoot at folk while in empire you are still inhibited by concord and sec status. So basically bounty hunting boils down to a mechanism to promote suicide ganking. Its a shame since it could have been so much more, e.g. purchasable aggro rights akin to individual war decs between individual players similar to the war decs that exist between corporations. Kinda reminds me of incursions in how they just dont live up to their potential.

You really, really need to think about how exploitable what you think you want would really be.

Bounties are an incentive, as intended.
Sellable kill rights are a way to circumvent aggression rules, as intended.
It is much easier to become a suspect and be shot by everyone, as intended.

I think that's quite enough for the moment.


The suspect aggro mechanism are, and are intended to be, a disincentive to the engagement to pvp in highsec.
Sellable kill rights are also a disincentive to engagement in pvp.
Bounties do not promote "gud fights" but rather act as random rewards for gankers.

So if you like or want high sec pvp what should you be excited about in this expansion?

I don't play, I just fourm warrior.
Midnight Hope
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#26 - 2012-12-04 18:05:31 UTC
Dark Long wrote:
why do people think the new bounty system is open killing rights its not.

Read the notes.


Well... the name RETRIBUTION kinda hinted at that....
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#27 - 2012-12-04 18:20:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Vincent Athena
Warde Guildencrantz wrote:
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
And so far I have provided a wonderful ISK sink for 1,500,000,000 !

This is the best thing for the eVE Economy in ages Big smile


well, doesnt it just go to another person who kills the person you put bounty on? not really a sink

Until the bounty is collected, its out of circulation. There will now forever be a large pool if ISK that cannot be used by anyone to buy stuff.

Edit: To engage someone in high sec:
1) Target
2) Apply sufficient DPS to kill the target before CONCORD shows up
3) Kill target
4) Collect bounty
5) Explode to CONCORD

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Frozen fanfiction
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#28 - 2012-12-04 18:34:17 UTC
Vol Arm'OOO wrote:

So if you like or want high sec pvp what should you be excited about in this expansion?

Sit at a gate and wait for someone with both a buyable killright and a bounty to show up. Activate the killright, kill the target, profit.
Find a corp what has a big bounty on them, or many members with big bounties. War dec them.
Set a bait can. Wait for a greedy person to go for it.
Steal something. Wait for someone who thinks they are an elite PvPer to fire on you and kill them.

Or maybe if you really want PvP, you should try someplace other than High sec. It was never the intent that high sec be a hotbed of PvP.

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Therran Promitz
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#29 - 2012-12-04 18:34:50 UTC
So what's to stop someone with a high bounty going to hisec and stay there in CONCORD's loving arms? Can't exactly get retribution if you get oneshotted by the space police.
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#30 - 2012-12-04 18:39:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Vincent Athena
Therran Promitz wrote:
So what's to stop someone with a high bounty going to hisec and stay there in CONCORD's loving arms? Can't exactly get retribution if you get oneshotted by the space police.

If they are in a player corp, wardec the corp. If they are not, suicide gank.

Edit: But you got a point, placing a bounty on a high sec dweller is almost useless. It may slightly increase the chances they will get suicide ganked. I think the main use for bounties will be for those who dwell in low, null and W.

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Casirio
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#31 - 2012-12-04 18:41:05 UTC
Therran Promitz wrote:
So what's to stop someone with a high bounty going to hisec and stay there in CONCORD's loving arms? Can't exactly get retribution if you get oneshotted by the space police.


you obviously don't know how high sec ganking works.. if there is a high enough bounty to outweigh the cost of the suicide ships, a gang will do it.
Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
#32 - 2012-12-04 18:46:26 UTC
The only real changes I can see happening are:

1) More annoying suicide ganks in hi-sec. Sad

2) Eliminating the exploit of criminals nuking their own pods with alts just to collect on their own bounties. Smile

3) Everyone and their dog having a black icon for no real reason, and (almost) everyone in hi-sec learning to simply ignore them because that icon has become completely irrelevant. Straight

http://youtu.be/t0q2F8NsYQ0
Mag's
Azn Empire
#33 - 2012-12-04 19:22:30 UTC
Vincent Athena wrote:
Warde Guildencrantz wrote:
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
And so far I have provided a wonderful ISK sink for 1,500,000,000 !

This is the best thing for the eVE Economy in ages Big smile


well, doesnt it just go to another person who kills the person you put bounty on? not really a sink

Until the bounty is collected, its out of circulation. There will now forever be a large pool if ISK that cannot be used by anyone to buy stuff.
Which makes it an ISK pool, not a sink.

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.
Rroff
Antagonistic Tendencies
#34 - 2012-12-04 19:25:21 UTC
Vol Arm'OOO wrote:
Dark Long wrote:
why do people think the new bounty system is open killing rights its not.



Because thats the way it should have been - the way people expected it to be. The current change is nothing but a minor incremental little tweak that does nothing to really boost pvp -- after all in low/null people dont need a reason to shoot at folk while in empire you are still inhibited by concord and sec status. So basically bounty hunting boils down to a mechanism to promote suicide ganking. Its a shame since it could have been so much more, e.g. purchasable aggro rights akin to individual war decs between individual players similar to the war decs that exist between corporations. Kinda reminds me of incursions in how they just dont live up to their potential.


Problem is some people would just get griefed into quitting the game... infact pretty much all the carebears would and anyone that didn't have a big corp at their back.

Only way I can really see it working is if theres an incentive for someone to disable the concord response if someone engages them which would have to be a fairly big risk/reward ratio as a silly example you could trade the safety of being in highsec with 4x the rewards for killing NPCs in missions.
Vol Arm'OOO
Central Co-Prosperity Union
#35 - 2012-12-04 19:35:55 UTC
Vincent Athena wrote:
Vol Arm'OOO wrote:

So if you like or want high sec pvp what should you be excited about in this expansion?

Sit at a gate and wait for someone with both a buyable killright and a bounty to show up. Activate the killright, kill the target, profit.
Find a corp what has a big bounty on them, or many members with big bounties. War dec them.
Set a bait can. Wait for a greedy person to go for it.
Steal something. Wait for someone who thinks they are an elite PvPer to fire on you and kill them.

Or maybe if you really want PvP, you should try someplace other than High sec. It was never the intent that high sec be a hotbed of PvP.


Lol yea that will work - because by the time you see the person with the activatable kill rights - click on their name - and then activate their rights - they wont be gone?

And as for pvping in somewhere else other then highsec - well you rob a bank cause thats where the money is - so you pvp in highsec because thats where the players are. As soon as ccp gets folk in low and null in comparable then maybe there will be more pvp there. Also for the record - blob pvp in null imo is not real pvp.

I don't play, I just fourm warrior.
Vol Arm'OOO
Central Co-Prosperity Union
#36 - 2012-12-04 19:38:02 UTC
Rroff wrote:
Vol Arm'OOO wrote:
Dark Long wrote:
why do people think the new bounty system is open killing rights its not.



Because thats the way it should have been - the way people expected it to be. The current change is nothing but a minor incremental little tweak that does nothing to really boost pvp -- after all in low/null people dont need a reason to shoot at folk while in empire you are still inhibited by concord and sec status. So basically bounty hunting boils down to a mechanism to promote suicide ganking. Its a shame since it could have been so much more, e.g. purchasable aggro rights akin to individual war decs between individual players similar to the war decs that exist between corporations. Kinda reminds me of incursions in how they just dont live up to their potential.


Problem is some people would just get griefed into quitting the game... infact pretty much all the carebears would and anyone that didn't have a big corp at their back.

Only way I can really see it working is if theres an incentive for someone to disable the concord response if someone engages them which would have to be a fairly big risk/reward ratio as a silly example you could trade the safety of being in highsec with 4x the rewards for killing NPCs in missions.



We already have grifing in this game - and the population seems relatively steady despite its prevalence. Sure, I agree that purchaseable aggro has the potential for grief play, but no more then what we already got.

I don't play, I just fourm warrior.
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#37 - 2012-12-04 19:55:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Ranger 1
Vol Arm'OOO wrote:
Vincent Athena wrote:
Vol Arm'OOO wrote:

So if you like or want high sec pvp what should you be excited about in this expansion?

Sit at a gate and wait for someone with both a buyable killright and a bounty to show up. Activate the killright, kill the target, profit.
Find a corp what has a big bounty on them, or many members with big bounties. War dec them.
Set a bait can. Wait for a greedy person to go for it.
Steal something. Wait for someone who thinks they are an elite PvPer to fire on you and kill them.

Or maybe if you really want PvP, you should try someplace other than High sec. It was never the intent that high sec be a hotbed of PvP.


Lol yea that will work - because by the time you see the person with the activatable kill rights - click on their name - and then activate their rights - they wont be gone?

And as for pvping in somewhere else other then highsec - well you rob a bank cause thats where the money is - so you pvp in highsec because thats where the players are. As soon as ccp gets folk in low and null in comparable then maybe there will be more pvp there. Also for the record - blob pvp in null imo is not real pvp.

There are a dozen different ways to accomplish all of the things he listed, the only problem here is you haven't put any thought into what those might be.

I'm not going to spell things out for you (you'll discover them soon enough on your own) but lets take the most simplistic method to get around the example you gave. You see someone with a bounty and kill rights, activate, and shoot them.
While it is true that many will travel in fast warping frigates, eventually they'll fly something else (not that it's remotely impossible to point even a frigate if you are prepared to do so).

You are assuming that the pilot that activates the kill right needs to be the one trying to get a point, which is completely unneccessary. Your scout on the other side of the gate could do it as he is jumping in to you, or your DPS pilot that is going to lock slower anyway, or your remote sensor boosting pilot can do it when his name appears in local just prior to his uncloaking and getting blapped by your boosted Tornado, or any number of variations on the above.

You sir are guilty of a couple of the most basic errors a newer player can make in EvE.

You believe there is only one way to accomplish an objective... and you vastly under estimate the cleverness of your average EvE player.

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