These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
12Next page
 

Getting more people through the first hour in EVE
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Akiyo Mayaki
Perkone
Caldari State
#1 - 2012-11-26 13:20:30 UTC
In my honest opinion, EVE Online is one of those games you first really play after giving it a try. I saw the game a long time ago but I thought '**** no' and never actually tried it. It really didn't look appealing. It was confusing and based on click to move, this sufficed for me to never actually try it. Years later I now tried it and of course I loved it.

One thing however I wish for CCP to add to the experience of a new player is to voice all and by all; every single of the starting tutorials. To understand how to even move an inch in the first hour of EVE you need to read every single of the tutorials and you need to read them carefully.

You play a game to escape every means of stress and work. Learning EVE feels in its first hours as the equivalent of learning a new language.

Voicing the tutorials would take much burden off the shoulders of the new players.

(I really hope that this feature is not available already and I just didn't know)

Cheers, Akiyo

No
Destination SkillQueue
Doomheim
#2 - 2012-11-26 13:25:25 UTC
It's not going to happen, since the game and the tutorials are being altered on a constant basis. Doing so would be expensive, time consuming and the work made obsolete very quickly. It would be nice to have, but not very practical to maintain in an ever changing game. At best some basic mechanics tutorials, that don't get altered could get that treatment, but it isn't going to happen with all of them.
Akiyo Mayaki
Perkone
Caldari State
#3 - 2012-11-26 13:31:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Akiyo Mayaki
Destination SkillQueue wrote:
It's not going to happen, since the game and the tutorials are being altered on a constant basis. Doing so would be expensive, time consuming and the work made obsolete very quickly. It would be nice to have, but not very practical to maintain in an ever changing game. At best some basic mechanics tutorials, that don't get altered could get that treatment, but it isn't going to happen with all of them.


Expensive maybe, but not worth it? I would call it profitable investment. The learning curve is no secret and CCP has said they would do some "new user friendly UI changes". Voicing the very first game introduction tutorial would be great for new players.

No
Schmata Bastanold
In Boobiez We Trust
#4 - 2012-11-26 13:41:53 UTC
Mandatory "Eve has sound?" response.

Invalid signature format
Destination SkillQueue
Doomheim
#5 - 2012-11-26 13:44:42 UTC
Akiyo Mayaki wrote:
Destination SkillQueue wrote:
It's not going to happen, since the game and the tutorials are being altered on a constant basis. Doing so would be expensive, time consuming and the work made obsolete very quickly. It would be nice to have, but not very practical to maintain in an ever changing game. At best some basic mechanics tutorials, that don't get altered could get that treatment, but it isn't going to happen with all of them.


Expensive maybe, but not worth it? I would call it profitable investment. (:


It's just not just expensive, it's hard to keep maintained for constantly changing tutorials. The whole process is also time consuming, since the text has to be ready in advance and the actual game changes ready even before that. With constant changes being done to the game and the tutorials it naturally causes constant scedule and production issues. All that for voiceovers, that will likely become obsolete shortly after isn't a good way to spend your resources. That doesn't mean it won't happen, but it's unlikely unless they come up with a new way to do them.
Alayna Le'line
#6 - 2012-11-26 14:55:30 UTC
Akiyo Mayaki wrote:
In my honest opinion, EVE Online is one of those games you first really play after giving it a try. I saw the game a long time ago but I thought '**** no' and never actually tried it. It really didn't look appealing. It was confusing and based on click to move, this sufficed for me to never actually try it. Years later I now tried it and of course I loved it.

One thing however I wish for CCP to add to the experience of a new player is to voice all and by all; every single of the starting tutorials. To understand how to even move an inch in the first hour of EVE you need to read every single of the tutorials and you need to read them carefully.

You play a game to escape every means of stress and work. Learning EVE feels in its first hours as the equivalent of learning a new language.

Voicing the tutorials would take much burden off the shoulders of the new players.

(I really hope that this feature is not available already and I just didn't know)

Cheers, Akiyo


I don't think this is useful at all. People generally read a lot faster than they speak, meaning that listening to a voiced tutorial would take like 3 times as long as just reading the text. Resulting in nobody listening to the voice in the best case or being annoyed since it's out of sync with what they're reading in the worst.

It's not because the likes of BioWare can get away with simplifying dialogue to fit their chosen presentation medium (spoken word) that it's necessarily a good idea or a good fit for other games, certainly not ones as complex as EVE.
Anslo
Scope Works
#7 - 2012-11-26 15:00:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Anslo
I agree with the above poster, people tend to read way faster than they speak, which in turn affects listening.

I remember in '07 when I started in Eve that Aura's voice was agonizingly slow when explaining things. At first I thought the AI voice was cool, but then she kept going..and going...and going. I ended up reading ahead of her and axing her voice. The tutorials aren't exactly dramatic reading.

As previously said, something like Mass Effect or Skyrim has a good place for voice acting throughout the game because it's story driven. You want to hear what the people have to say and see where the story leads and how all the strings finally come together in one big rope of a story.

Eve is not really story driven at all, it's a big sandbox where you make your story. The voice actors and characters are the other players, and they already have voices. So outside of that, more voice based tutorials are, unless they're sped up (which not everyone can follow), not really needed.

Maybe if Aura interacted with you more? Said something about armor or shields or commented on attacks or...something. MAYBE I could see it, but not more tutorials.

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
highonpop
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#8 - 2012-11-26 15:01:25 UTC
Schmata Bastanold wrote:
Mandatory "Eve has sound?" response.



I don't know how people play EVE without sound. Running multiple clients I like to be able to hear what is going on when i'm not 100% paying attention.

FC, what do?
Azrin Stella Oerndotte
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#9 - 2012-11-26 15:01:39 UTC
The tutorials atm are subject to change, they will get a new voice over once the devs working on them are happy.
Keen Fallsword
Skyway Patrol
#10 - 2012-11-26 15:05:45 UTC
Akiyo Mayaki wrote:
In my honest opinion, EVE Online is one of those games you first really play after giving it a try. I saw the game a long time ago but I thought '**** no' and never actually tried it. It really didn't look appealing. It was confusing and based on click to move, this sufficed for me to never actually try it. Years later I now tried it and of course I loved it.

One thing however I wish for CCP to add to the experience of a new player is to voice all and by all; every single of the starting tutorials. To understand how to even move an inch in the first hour of EVE you need to read every single of the tutorials and you need to read them carefully.

You play a game to escape every means of stress and work. Learning EVE feels in its first hours as the equivalent of learning a new language.

Voicing the tutorials would take much burden off the shoulders of the new players.

(I really hope that this feature is not available already and I just didn't know)

Cheers, Akiyo


I think that best option for CCP is to develop another game and eve should stay long enough to be a cash cow. You really cant change eve in this stadium. And adding voice is changing nothing to new player experience. Like someone said "Everybody have heard about eve online, and everybody tried it"
baltec1
Bat Country
The Initiative.
#11 - 2012-11-26 15:08:50 UTC
The only voice we would allow would be Aura's. The problem then is she would troll the nubs when they get blown up and podded.
Jame Jarl Retief
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#12 - 2012-11-26 15:13:34 UTC
Akiyo Mayaki wrote:
Voicing the tutorials would take much burden off the shoulders of the new players.

Cheers, Akiyo


Voicing the tutorial might help. BUT, my vote is still for WiS as the introduction to the game, not tutorial with windows. Follow me here.

You're a totally new player, coming from any other MMO. What are you used to? Log in->Create avatar->see avatar in the world->do the starter area. This has been true for every MMO to come in the past 10 years or so. What happens in EVE? Log in->Create avatar->Never see avatar again, get drowned in windows and tons of text. Any wonder people throw their hands up and quit?

Now, imagine the new player experience with WiS. You log in, create your char, enter game. You see your avatar in station. NOT IN CQ! STATION! With tons of other people running around! Ooooh, pretty. Walk around, nice animations. Look out the window, see ships undocking from station, and know those are actual players! Mind blown yet? Mine would be, but then again, it's a very small mind. Compact. Kinda like a Prius.

Now, this is where tutorial kicks in. It suggests you go visit your captain's quarters, your home at this station, and see about outfitting and flying your ship. THAT'S when you first see CQ! You should not, repeat, NOT start the game inside CQ! Then, you go through the basic tutorial. It should all be conducted from avatar perspective.

That, by itself, virtually guarantees that the player will stick around for an hour or two.
Akiyo Mayaki
Perkone
Caldari State
#13 - 2012-11-26 15:36:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Akiyo Mayaki
Jame Jarl Retief wrote:
Akiyo Mayaki wrote:
Voicing the tutorials would take much burden off the shoulders of the new players.

Cheers, Akiyo


Voicing the tutorial might help. BUT, my vote is still for WiS as the introduction to the game, not tutorial with windows. Follow me here.

You're a totally new player, coming from any other MMO. What are you used to? Log in->Create avatar->see avatar in the world->do the starter area. This has been true for every MMO to come in the past 10 years or so. What happens in EVE? Log in->Create avatar->Never see avatar again, get drowned in windows and tons of text. Any wonder people throw their hands up and quit?

Now, imagine the new player experience with WiS. You log in, create your char, enter game. You see your avatar in station. NOT IN CQ! STATION! With tons of other people running around! Ooooh, pretty. Walk around, nice animations. Look out the window, see ships undocking from station, and know those are actual players! Mind blown yet? Mine would be, but then again, it's a very small mind. Compact. Kinda like a Prius.

Now, this is where tutorial kicks in. It suggests you go visit your captain's quarters, your home at this station, and see about outfitting and flying your ship. THAT'S when you first see CQ! You should not, repeat, NOT start the game inside CQ! Then, you go through the basic tutorial. It should all be conducted from avatar perspective.

That, by itself, virtually guarantees that the player will stick around for an hour or two.


I like this idea.

Keen Fallsword wrote:
"Everybody have heard about eve online, and everybody tried it"


No. Only few people have actually bothered to try it. The game looks incredibly repulsive from the outside. When one checks a video of the game one will see an overview with some names on it and.... Yeah nothing else. I have talked to a lot of people about EVE and when asked if they have tried it this was the most common answer.

No
Schmata Bastanold
In Boobiez We Trust
#14 - 2012-11-26 15:39:15 UTC
highonpop wrote:
Schmata Bastanold wrote:
Mandatory "Eve has sound?" response.


I don't know how people play EVE without sound. Running multiple clients I like to be able to hear what is going on when i'm not 100% paying attention.


Those people probably don't run solo with falcon and linky alts.

Invalid signature format
Zoctrine
Doomheim
#15 - 2012-11-26 15:42:15 UTC
highonpop wrote:
I don't know how people play EVE without sound.


Can't imagine how people play it with sounds
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#16 - 2012-11-26 15:46:01 UTC
Keen Fallsword wrote:
Akiyo Mayaki wrote:
In my honest opinion, EVE Online is one of those games you first really play after giving it a try. I saw the game a long time ago but I thought '**** no' and never actually tried it. It really didn't look appealing. It was confusing and based on click to move, this sufficed for me to never actually try it. Years later I now tried it and of course I loved it.

One thing however I wish for CCP to add to the experience of a new player is to voice all and by all; every single of the starting tutorials. To understand how to even move an inch in the first hour of EVE you need to read every single of the tutorials and you need to read them carefully.

You play a game to escape every means of stress and work. Learning EVE feels in its first hours as the equivalent of learning a new language.

Voicing the tutorials would take much burden off the shoulders of the new players.

(I really hope that this feature is not available already and I just didn't know)

Cheers, Akiyo


I think that best option for CCP is to develop another game and eve should stay long enough to be a cash cow. You really cant change eve in this stadium. And adding voice is changing nothing to new player experience. Like someone said "Everybody have heard about eve online, and everybody tried it"


There are hundreds of millions of video gamers in the world, and millions of new ones every year. I'd be very surprised if more than 2% of them have downloaded the EVE client.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Ginger Barbarella
#17 - 2012-11-26 16:44:18 UTC
I wonder if doing something like granting new toons a pool of 2 million SPs that they can apply to their character AFTER completing the tutorial missions might help with the training time hill that everyone looks at and goes "WTF?"

Maybe hiding the fact that you have to train for a couple years to actually get efficient in something would help with retention... :)

"Blow it all on Quafe and strippers." --- Sorlac
Dragon Outlaw
Rogue Fleet
#18 - 2012-11-26 16:56:31 UTC
I think braw straps are the best things in Eve.

+1
Sentient Blade
Crisis Atmosphere
Coalition of the Unfortunate
#19 - 2012-11-26 17:22:46 UTC
Doesn't go far enough.

Video demos would be the killer feature for helping users through.
Ginger Barbarella
#20 - 2012-11-26 17:25:49 UTC
Sentient Blade wrote:
Doesn't go far enough.

Video demos would be the killer feature for helping users through.


As part of the tutorial description, I agree. In-line with the description.

"Blow it all on Quafe and strippers." --- Sorlac
12Next page