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[Updated][Winter] Missile Rebalance 2.0 + Hurricane tweak

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Little Dragon Khamez
Guardians of the Underworld
#6241 - 2012-11-25 18:20:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Little Dragon Khamez
No I am not. I am saying that lasers should be the longest ranged weapons but are not. Think about it, Lasers are coherent light and in real life only suffer from attenuation of the beam over distance due to things like atmospheric particles getting in the way. In space this is greatly reduced so beam attenuation should be effectively meaningless in a fighting grid of 250km. Lasers should therefore hit for full damage at long ranges, longer than missiles or artilarly are capable of delivering.

Dumbing down of Eve Online will result in it's destruction...
Cage Man
Fusion Enterprises Ltd
Pandemic Horde
#6242 - 2012-11-25 18:46:16 UTC
Had some time to play on Buckingham this weekend and I noticed with the missile changes and CCP not releasing the changes to the range mods to affect missiles, my torps on my navy raven's range have dropped from 39km to 32 km Sad take into account acceleration standard torps don't even get to 30km anymore Cry
Zyella Stormborn
Green Seekers
#6243 - 2012-11-25 21:07:29 UTC
Little Dragon Khamez wrote:
No I am not. I am saying that lasers should be the longest ranged weapons but are not. Think about it, Lasers are coherent light and in real life only suffer from attenuation of the beam over distance due to things like atmospheric particles getting in the way. In space this is greatly reduced so beam attenuation should be effectively meaningless in a fighting grid of 250km. Lasers should therefore hit for full damage at long ranges, longer than missiles or artilarly are capable of delivering.



Erm... going by that argument, they would all do full damage at long ranges, since gravity in space is so small as to be almost inconsequential unless you are fighting in orbit around a planet, and there is no atmosphere or other friction of any measurable means to slow things down.

Also... its a sci-fi video game, not a real-physics science adventure.

There is a special Hell for people like that, Right next to child molestors, and people that talk in the theater. ~Firefly
Ocih
Space Mermaids
#6244 - 2012-11-25 21:36:05 UTC
Damnation No mods, only Guns and Navy Ammo. I used this ship because it had no bonus and enough of both missile and turret to compare. (and I can fly it)

5 x T2 HML + Navy Missiles: dps 95.4
5 x Meta 4 HAM + Navy Missiles: dps 119.8 (I don't have HAM spec)
4 x T2 720 Howi + -50% optimal, dps based republic ammo 105.6
4 x T2 Heavy Beam Laser with Navy multi: dps 132.5

I don't have Warhead upgrades but I do have Surgical strike to 4 so that gave the Howi and Beam numbers more dps. If I had a 5th turret the 2 guns would have shut HML down either way. HAM would have held up against the 2 range based turret weapons. Due to the ammo choices, HAM reflect range on the 2 ranged based turret choices. They all come in around 15 km.

My conclusion, the weapons systems are not balanced. Missiles are under powered and that under powered nature was lost to a benefit lost when the whole velocity, explosion radius thing was introduced.

I'm going to say it again, this wasn't done to us. It was done to balance Line of Site Dust missiles but they needed both combat systems to be compatible. Either hard wired Missile boats need role bonus or they are getting shafted.
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#6245 - 2012-11-25 22:54:12 UTC
Ocih wrote:
Damnation No mods, only Guns and Navy Ammo. I used this ship because it had no bonus and enough of both missile and turret to compare. (and I can fly it)

5 x T2 HML + Navy Missiles: dps 95.4
5 x Meta 4 HAM + Navy Missiles: dps 119.8 (I don't have HAM spec)
4 x T2 720 Howi + -50% optimal, dps based republic ammo 105.6
4 x T2 Heavy Beam Laser with Navy multi: dps 132.5

I don't have Warhead upgrades but I do have Surgical strike to 4 so that gave the Howi and Beam numbers more dps. If I had a 5th turret the 2 guns would have shut HML down either way. HAM would have held up against the 2 range based turret weapons. Due to the ammo choices, HAM reflect range on the 2 ranged based turret choices. They all come in around 15 km.

My conclusion, the weapons systems are not balanced. Missiles are under powered and that under powered nature was lost to a benefit lost when the whole velocity, explosion radius thing was introduced.

I'm going to say it again, this wasn't done to us. It was done to balance Line of Site Dust missiles but they needed both combat systems to be compatible. Either hard wired Missile boats need role bonus or they are getting shafted.


lol

So bad...

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

Ocih
Space Mermaids
#6246 - 2012-11-25 22:57:33 UTC
Garviel Tarrant wrote:
Ocih wrote:
Damnation No mods, only Guns and Navy Ammo. I used this ship because it had no bonus and enough of both missile and turret to compare. (and I can fly it)

5 x T2 HML + Navy Missiles: dps 95.4
5 x Meta 4 HAM + Navy Missiles: dps 119.8 (I don't have HAM spec)
4 x T2 720 Howi + -50% optimal, dps based republic ammo 105.6
4 x T2 Heavy Beam Laser with Navy multi: dps 132.5

I don't have Warhead upgrades but I do have Surgical strike to 4 so that gave the Howi and Beam numbers more dps. If I had a 5th turret the 2 guns would have shut HML down either way. HAM would have held up against the 2 range based turret weapons. Due to the ammo choices, HAM reflect range on the 2 ranged based turret choices. They all come in around 15 km.

My conclusion, the weapons systems are not balanced. Missiles are under powered and that under powered nature was lost to a benefit lost when the whole velocity, explosion radius thing was introduced.

I'm going to say it again, this wasn't done to us. It was done to balance Line of Site Dust missiles but they needed both combat systems to be compatible. Either hard wired Missile boats need role bonus or they are getting shafted.


lol

So bad...


Thanks for the troll. Next time I will full blue fit, run stats with T2 Super cap fleet bonus for the epeen value. I think you missed the point.
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#6247 - 2012-11-25 23:16:02 UTC
Ocih wrote:
Garviel Tarrant wrote:
Ocih wrote:
Damnation No mods, only Guns and Navy Ammo. I used this ship because it had no bonus and enough of both missile and turret to compare. (and I can fly it)

5 x T2 HML + Navy Missiles: dps 95.4
5 x Meta 4 HAM + Navy Missiles: dps 119.8 (I don't have HAM spec)
4 x T2 720 Howi + -50% optimal, dps based republic ammo 105.6
4 x T2 Heavy Beam Laser with Navy multi: dps 132.5

I don't have Warhead upgrades but I do have Surgical strike to 4 so that gave the Howi and Beam numbers more dps. If I had a 5th turret the 2 guns would have shut HML down either way. HAM would have held up against the 2 range based turret weapons. Due to the ammo choices, HAM reflect range on the 2 ranged based turret choices. They all come in around 15 km.

My conclusion, the weapons systems are not balanced. Missiles are under powered and that under powered nature was lost to a benefit lost when the whole velocity, explosion radius thing was introduced.

I'm going to say it again, this wasn't done to us. It was done to balance Line of Site Dust missiles but they needed both combat systems to be compatible. Either hard wired Missile boats need role bonus or they are getting shafted.


lol

So bad...


Thanks for the troll. Next time I will full blue fit, run stats with T2 Super cap fleet bonus for the epeen value. I think you missed the point.


You missed the point.

I meant that your logic/reasoning is bad, not your skills/isk use

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

Little Dragon Khamez
Guardians of the Underworld
#6248 - 2012-11-25 23:35:29 UTC
Zyella Stormborn wrote:
Little Dragon Khamez wrote:
No I am not. I am saying that lasers should be the longest ranged weapons but are not. Think about it, Lasers are coherent light and in real life only suffer from attenuation of the beam over distance due to things like atmospheric particles getting in the way. In space this is greatly reduced so beam attenuation should be effectively meaningless in a fighting grid of 250km. Lasers should therefore hit for full damage at long ranges, longer than missiles or artilarly are capable of delivering.



Erm... going by that argument, they would all do full damage at long ranges, since gravity in space is so small as to be almost inconsequential unless you are fighting in orbit around a planet, and there is no atmosphere or other friction of any measurable means to slow things down.

Also... its a sci-fi video game, not a real-physics science adventure.


Eve is a sci fi adventure as opposed to a real physics adventure, but nevertheless I like some science in my sci-fi otherwise why bother with the highly technical nature of Eve as it currently stands. We might as well all a join a buck rogers mmo where we all fire generic energy beams at each other with no explanation of the science behind them. Anyhow my earlier post was a response to someone else's question and you may have read it out of context.

To return to the subject at hand, missile nerfs, my point was that we shouldn't expect eve weapon systems to behave the same as another because if we do so we lose all of the diversity in the game. This is uniformity not balance. And as such too much balance makes choosing a weapon system unimportant. It wont matter what you choose to train or use if say for instance heavy missiles hit the same dps at the same ranges as lasers/projectiles/hybrids etc. We wont actually be using a different weapon all we will be getting is a different graphical effect and animation.

Dumbing down of Eve Online will result in it's destruction...
Ocih
Space Mermaids
#6249 - 2012-11-25 23:40:43 UTC
Garviel Tarrant wrote:


You missed the point.

I meant that your logic/reasoning is bad, not your skills/isk use


I will give you the benefit of the doubt.

All weapons can be compared at base. Everything above base is opened to everyone in the game. It can be nullified.

You can't nullify the effect a base change has when you have a Drake or a Raven because they are a fixed purpose ship. The only alternative you have is to get rid of it. As a long range weapons platform, the Drake is not in line with the other ships of its type. It is crippled by HML dps or lack of dps. No matter how you 'trick it out' it will not 'trick out' as well as other ships at the same level. You only have one option open with the Drake. Bring more of them.
Bouh Revetoile
In Wreck we thrust
#6250 - 2012-11-25 23:47:27 UTC
Ocih wrote:
Damnation No mods, only Guns and Navy Ammo. I used this ship because it had no bonus and enough of both missile and turret to compare. (and I can fly it)

5 x T2 HML + Navy Missiles: dps 95.4
5 x Meta 4 HAM + Navy Missiles: dps 119.8 (I don't have HAM spec)
4 x T2 720 Howi + -50% optimal, dps based republic ammo 105.6
4 x T2 Heavy Beam Laser with Navy multi: dps 132.5

I don't have Warhead upgrades but I do have Surgical strike to 4 so that gave the Howi and Beam numbers more dps. If I had a 5th turret the 2 guns would have shut HML down either way. HAM would have held up against the 2 range based turret weapons. Due to the ammo choices, HAM reflect range on the 2 ranged based turret choices. They all come in around 15 km.

My conclusion, the weapons systems are not balanced. Missiles are under powered and that under powered nature was lost to a benefit lost when the whole velocity, explosion radius thing was introduced.

I'm going to say it again, this wasn't done to us. It was done to balance Line of Site Dust missiles but they needed both combat systems to be compatible. Either hard wired Missile boats need role bonus or they are getting shafted.


Your analysis is uncomplete, and your conclusion is bad and dishonnest.

First, Surgical strike 4 give your T2 turret 12% more dps than HML even before considering any weapon difference. Remove this skill, and oh, magic : T2 720mm ==> 94,3 !

As for HAML, I don't know about your HAM skills, but if no T2, that mean 5% damage (assuming skill at 4) + at least 6% rof from specialization = 13% dps.
HAML dps = 135,4.

The numbers, which are low expectations based on your skills, prove that HML have a better dps than T2 arties with short range ammo and that HAM have more dps than even beams with short range ammo.

So, what we should conclude is that your missiles skills are bad and that you are dishonnest if you try to prove something with such a bad comparison.

But enough numbers, they are pointless anyway, because your analyzis is very incomplete : you completely obsured the fact that turret damage decrease with range ! And you also obscured the turret tracking.

For your analyzis to be complete, you need a study of dps along range for these turrets. You would have seen that HML outdps turrets for a good part of its effective range. To be comprehensive, your analyzis should also have compared short range weapons (yes, because you use HAM, a short range weapon, so you need these other SR turret for point of comparison).

My advice : either stop being dishonnest, or learn how to make a comparison.

To balance EVE, we need all things to have a niche where they can shine. That is balanced OPness. medium size LR weapons are not balance at the moment, because, as Ocith didn't show, HML outclass medLR turrets at most ranges (between 25 and 70km, and we could also say between 0 and 70km, because you really don't want to shoot at something closer than 25km with a medLR turret).

For the real science EVE : range is not only the potential damage of your weapon, but also the accuracy of your weapon. Calculate a trajectory between moving objects when the target have unpredictable movements is not that easy. You also need to consider the fact that your laser beam is not a perfect cylinder but a cone ; the farther away, the more spreaded the energy of the beam will be.

PS : acceleration of missiles have been modifyed for Retribution so missile range will be a lot closer from expected range than before.
Ocih
Space Mermaids
#6251 - 2012-11-26 00:12:01 UTC
Bouh Revetoile wrote:
Ocih wrote:
Damnation No mods, only Guns and Navy Ammo. I used this ship because it had no bonus and enough of both missile and turret to compare. (and I can fly it)

5 x T2 HML + Navy Missiles: dps 95.4
5 x Meta 4 HAM + Navy Missiles: dps 119.8 (I don't have HAM spec)
4 x T2 720 Howi + -50% optimal, dps based republic ammo 105.6
4 x T2 Heavy Beam Laser with Navy multi: dps 132.5

I don't have Warhead upgrades but I do have Surgical strike to 4 so that gave the Howi and Beam numbers more dps. If I had a 5th turret the 2 guns would have shut HML down either way. HAM would have held up against the 2 range based turret weapons. Due to the ammo choices, HAM reflect range on the 2 ranged based turret choices. They all come in around 15 km.

My conclusion, the weapons systems are not balanced. Missiles are under powered and that under powered nature was lost to a benefit lost when the whole velocity, explosion radius thing was introduced.

I'm going to say it again, this wasn't done to us. It was done to balance Line of Site Dust missiles but they needed both combat systems to be compatible. Either hard wired Missile boats need role bonus or they are getting shafted.


Your analysis is uncomplete, and your conclusion is bad and dishonnest.

First, Surgical strike 4 give your T2 turret 12% more dps than HML even before considering any weapon difference. Remove this skill, and oh, magic : T2 720mm ==> 94,3 !

As for HAML, I don't know about your HAM skills, but if no T2, that mean 5% damage (assuming skill at 4) + at least 6% rof from specialization = 13% dps.
HAML dps = 135,4.

The numbers, which are low expectations based on your skills, prove that HML have a better dps than T2 arties with short range ammo and that HAM have more dps than even beams with short range ammo.

So, what we should conclude is that your missiles skills are bad and that you are dishonnest if you try to prove something with such a bad comparison.

But enough numbers, they are pointless anyway, because your analyzis is very incomplete : you completely obsured the fact that turret damage decrease with range ! And you also obscured the turret tracking.

For your analyzis to be complete, you need a study of dps along range for these turrets. You would have seen that HML outdps turrets for a good part of its effective range. To be comprehensive, your analyzis should also have compared short range weapons (yes, because you use HAM, a short range weapon, so you need these other SR turret for point of comparison).

My advice : either stop being dishonnest, or learn how to make a comparison.

To balance EVE, we need all things to have a niche where they can shine. That is balanced OPness. medium size LR weapons are not balance at the moment, because, as Ocith didn't show, HML outclass medLR turrets at most ranges (between 25 and 70km, and we could also say between 0 and 70km, because you really don't want to shoot at something closer than 25km with a medLR turret).

For the real science EVE : range is not only the potential damage of your weapon, but also the accuracy of your weapon. Calculate a trajectory between moving objects when the target have unpredictable movements is not that easy. You also need to consider the fact that your laser beam is not a perfect cylinder but a cone ; the farther away, the more spreaded the energy of the beam will be.

PS : acceleration of missiles have been modifyed for Retribution so missile range will be a lot closer from expected range than before.


I made it a point of mentioning I didn't have warhead. You failed to mention that when Missile balance was added, they were added under a different formula that didn't account for velocity, tracking disruption or any of the things missiles suffer under now. Missiles are too restricted and HML will become extinct with this patch. It's a nerfed now as Black Ops with such a limited game value it will be worth more in its reproc.

As you can see, my skills don't depend on Missiles. I didn't buy a Damnation for the OP dps. I knew what I was getting. I'd say my view point is as neutral as it can be. I have in fact drawn from this that Amarr is still the best option I had and have available. I still think missiles got shorted for Dust because in a Line of Sight game, a missile would be over powered.
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy
Caldari State
#6252 - 2012-11-26 04:40:25 UTC
Ocih wrote:
Damnation No mods, only Guns and Navy Ammo. I used this ship because it had no bonus and enough of both missile and turret to compare. (and I can fly it)

5 x T2 HML + Navy Missiles: dps 95.4
5 x Meta 4 HAM + Navy Missiles: dps 119.8 (I don't have HAM spec)
4 x T2 720 Howi + -50% optimal, dps based republic ammo 105.6
4 x T2 Heavy Beam Laser with Navy multi: dps 132.5

I don't have Warhead upgrades but I do have Surgical strike to 4 so that gave the Howi and Beam numbers more dps. If I had a 5th turret the 2 guns would have shut HML down either way. HAM would have held up against the 2 range based turret weapons. Due to the ammo choices, HAM reflect range on the 2 ranged based turret choices. They all come in around 15 km.

My conclusion, the weapons systems are not balanced. Missiles are under powered and that under powered nature was lost to a benefit lost when the whole velocity, explosion radius thing was introduced.

I'm going to say it again, this wasn't done to us. It was done to balance Line of Site Dust missiles but they needed both combat systems to be compatible. Either hard wired Missile boats need role bonus or they are getting shafted.


All level 5s:
5x T2 HAML with CN Mjolnir Heavy Assault Missile: 179 @ 27,8 km
5x T2 HML with CN Mjolnir Heavy Missile: 143 @ 122 km
4x 720mm with RF EMP: 116 @ 15 + 21,9 km
4x Heavy Beam Laser with IN Multifrequency: 145 @ 15 + 10 km
4x 250mm with CN Antimatter: 138 @ 18 + 15 km
Ocih
Space Mermaids
#6253 - 2012-11-26 10:47:14 UTC
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
Ocih wrote:
Damnation No mods, only Guns and Navy Ammo. I used this ship because it had no bonus and enough of both missile and turret to compare. (and I can fly it)

5 x T2 HML + Navy Missiles: dps 95.4
5 x Meta 4 HAM + Navy Missiles: dps 119.8 (I don't have HAM spec)
4 x T2 720 Howi + -50% optimal, dps based republic ammo 105.6
4 x T2 Heavy Beam Laser with Navy multi: dps 132.5

I don't have Warhead upgrades but I do have Surgical strike to 4 so that gave the Howi and Beam numbers more dps. If I had a 5th turret the 2 guns would have shut HML down either way. HAM would have held up against the 2 range based turret weapons. Due to the ammo choices, HAM reflect range on the 2 ranged based turret choices. They all come in around 15 km.

My conclusion, the weapons systems are not balanced. Missiles are under powered and that under powered nature was lost to a benefit lost when the whole velocity, explosion radius thing was introduced.

I'm going to say it again, this wasn't done to us. It was done to balance Line of Site Dust missiles but they needed both combat systems to be compatible. Either hard wired Missile boats need role bonus or they are getting shafted.


All level 5s:
5x T2 HAML with CN Mjolnir Heavy Assault Missile: 179 @ 27,8 km
5x T2 HML with CN Mjolnir Heavy Missile: 143 @ 122 km
4x 720mm with RF EMP: 116 @ 15 + 21,9 km
4x Heavy Beam Laser with IN Multifrequency: 145 @ 15 + 10 km
4x 250mm with CN Antimatter: 138 @ 18 + 15 km


These look like EFT figures, meaning they are based on the Tranquility now systems, not the Buckingham now systems, correct me if I am wrong.

As I tried to stress in the original test, the variations aren't game breaking by them selves. The ships that are pigeon holed to missiles simply need their bonuses looked at. If the changes as is go through, those ships are in need of attention. Even the tracking disruptor hitting a missile, I got an image of Iron Man in one kicking out flares when the raptors were on him. He he wasn't hit by the missile but he was impacted by their explosion. If you look at tracking disruption of missile in the that perspective it makes more sense. I just feel bad for the poor old Raven and Drake. Abaddon took a lot of thunder from the Apoc but Rokh intro didn't create a beefed up Raven, it wiped out the entire missile doctrine. I don't even want to think about dreads and the Caldari plight.
Bouh Revetoile
In Wreck we thrust
#6254 - 2012-11-26 11:57:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Bouh Revetoile
Ocih wrote:
I'd say my view point is as neutral as it can be.

Your view point is that missiles are bad and you did whatever you needed for your numbers to support your thesis or you didn't realize how bad your argumentation was. I would say this is a lie, but I'm not sure if you are concious about it.

As I said, your analysis is completely flawed an worth absolutely nothing.

And considering how used missiles are, the addition of explosion radius and velocity did not kill them, obviously. Do you really play the game ?

And finaly, HML will still, after the patch, be the best medium LR option between 30-35km and their max range.

PS : missiles are not affected by tracking disruption.
Ocih
Space Mermaids
#6255 - 2012-11-26 13:01:01 UTC
Bouh Revetoile wrote:
Ocih wrote:
I'd say my view point is as neutral as it can be.

Your view point is that missiles are bad and you did whatever you needed for your numbers to support your thesis or you didn't realize how bad your argumentation was. I would say this is a lie, but I'm not sure if you are concious about it.

As I said, your analysis is completely flawed an worth absolutely nothing.

And considering how used missiles are, the addition of explosion radius and velocity did not kill them, obviously. Do you really play the game ?

And finaly, HML will still, after the patch, be the best medium LR option between 30-35km and their max range.

PS : missiles are not affected by tracking disruption.


Missiles are used because you kind of need to use more to do the same thing? Nerf Missiles, more missiles get used. Um, yea?
It isn't important anymore. You are more concerned with attacking me than what I have to say because you don't like what I have to say.

club em in to the ground. Any alliance(s) that had a missile doctrine already changed it. We will see how "used" they are in a week.
Bouh Revetoile
In Wreck we thrust
#6256 - 2012-11-26 14:08:40 UTC
I'm not concerned by attacking you but your argumentation, which was *very bad* and partial. You made numbers lying, and I don't like this, but I have nothing against you personnaly. :-)
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy
Caldari State
#6257 - 2012-11-26 15:02:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Jorma Morkkis
Ocih wrote:
As I tried to stress in the original test, the variations aren't game breaking by them selves. The ships that are pigeon holed to missiles simply need their bonuses looked at. If the changes as is go through, those ships are in need of attention. Even the tracking disruptor hitting a missile, I got an image of Iron Man in one kicking out flares when the raptors were on him. He he wasn't hit by the missile but he was impacted by their explosion. If you look at tracking disruption of missile in the that perspective it makes more sense. I just feel bad for the poor old Raven and Drake. Abaddon took a lot of thunder from the Apoc but Rokh intro didn't create a beefed up Raven, it wiped out the entire missile doctrine. I don't even want to think about dreads and the Caldari plight.


First of all: where on earth you got the idea that TDs will affect missiles after 4th?

Do you mean by any chance that 1000 dps HAM Tengu? Yeah, I agree with you there that some ships need a nerf after this change.

Yes, heavy missiles aren't the only missile type in game.
"But those HAMs have very bad range!"
Ocih
Space Mermaids
#6258 - 2012-11-26 15:25:56 UTC
Bouh Revetoile wrote:
I'm not concerned by attacking you but your argumentation, which was *very bad* and partial. You made numbers lying, and I don't like this, but I have nothing against you personnaly. :-)


You get that little bug in the back of your head? You know something stinks in Denmark, you just can't put a finger on it. Watching for 7 years, seeing Missiles get targeted for 'rebalance' over and over. Not willing or inclined to believe they were that unbalanced at launch. Asking why they keep going back to them to take another chunk out of them. I might not have all the pieces but I ain't buying it. Something isn't right. By the time I figure it out it will be too late of course.

As for the 1K HAM Tengu, I'm sure if a person wanted to pony up a few billion to pimp any of the T3 they could get numeric dps of that level. The same thing would stop it. Poor range and bubble bath EHP.
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy
Caldari State
#6259 - 2012-11-26 15:31:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Jorma Morkkis
Ocih wrote:
As for the 1K HAM Tengu, I'm sure if a person wanted to pony up a few billion to pimp any of the T3 they could get numeric dps of that level. The same thing would stop it. Poor range and bubble bath EHP.


That's possible after the change. After. After.

T2 launchers, CN BCSs, implants, good skills.
NextDarkKnight
Storm Chasers.
Pandemic Horde
#6260 - 2012-11-26 15:52:35 UTC
Faora Zod wrote:
Lili Lu wrote:
Ubat Batuk wrote:
Of course, so let's further reduce the DPS... so it will take me 2 hours for a Level 4 mission! This is r etard...

No it's called train a ******* BS and large weapons like every other race to do a level 4, and stop whining.Roll


You should start thinking like a NEW player who has only been playing a couple of months, do you really think with the way the market is now that a newbie is going to be able to afford the couple of hundred million it takes to buy and fit a BS to do level 4s? Best day of my eve life was when i soloed my first level 4 in a Drake, i knew i was here to stay. If they are wanting to keep this game fun and interesting like CCP Fozzie claims it needs to stay fun and interesting for NEW players too. You slow down how fast it takes them to feel like the accomplished something on their own and they are going t o lose interest.


Man, it took forever to kill anything but man that was a sweet day for myself as well. PVE will take a major hit with this next expansion. I wonder if CCP will move some of the NPC spawns closer now that the range is being nerfed so hard. Are we still goign to see NPCs spawn at 110km or will they get a 5~10% spawn range decress as well? Damn you Drake for being so damn slow at everything.