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Dev Blog: Bounties, Kill Rights, New Modules and War in Retribution

First post First post
Author
Alekseyev Karrde
Noir.
Templis CALSF
#121 - 2012-11-21 23:28:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Alekseyev Karrde
Bloodpetal wrote:
CCP Punkturis, an important question was raised above.


If they shoot back in self-defense, currently you don't get a killright for opting to defend yourself, regardless of death or not.


As of this change, will defending yourself forfeit your kill right on initial engagement?

If you're shot in highsec and not instantly killed, CONCORD should relieve your attacker of their ship pretty swiftly. Not sure about if you shoot back at them (it doesn't usually come up)...

Alek the Kidnapper, Hero of the CSM

Marlona Sky
State War Academy
Caldari State
#122 - 2012-11-21 23:37:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Il Feytid
Alekseyev Karrde wrote:
Bloodpetal wrote:
CCP Punkturis, an important question was raised above.


If they shoot back in self-defense, currently you don't get a killright for opting to defend yourself, regardless of death or not.


As of this change, will defending yourself forfeit your kill right on initial engagement?

If you're shot in highsec and not instantly killed, CONCORD should relieve your attacker of their pretty swiftly. Not sure about if you shoot back at them (it doesn't usually come up)...

God forbid the players being ganked be allowed to defend themselves right? Ugh

Also it applies more to low sec where concord is not there to bail you out. Did you guys test to see??
Trebor Daehdoow
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#123 - 2012-11-21 23:42:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Trebor Daehdoow
CCP Punkturis wrote:
I was just pointing out in a fun way that I like his idea and I hope that people will have fun with bounties and kill rights as that is pretty much the goal of our feature Big smile

I would like to give you the opportunity to deny the horrible rumor that is going around that bounty payouts on members of the CSM that you don't like are automatically doubled. Thanks in advance!

Your bestest friend on the council,
Trebor

Private Citizen • CSM in recovery

Hans Jagerblitzen
Ice Fire Warriors
#124 - 2012-11-21 23:51:13 UTC
You know what's missing from this Dev blog??

"New Forum Functionality: [Place Bounty]"

(Yes, I'm still completely serious.)

Thumbs up everyone if you want to turn badposts into emergent gameplay and content generation!

CPM0 Chairman / CSM7 Vice Secretary

CCP Punkturis
C C P
C C P Alliance
#125 - 2012-11-21 23:54:47 UTC
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:
CCP Punkturis wrote:
I was just pointing out in a fun way that I like his idea and I hope that people will have fun with bounties and kill rights as that is pretty much the goal of our feature Big smile

I would like to give you the opportunity to deny the horrible rumor that is going around that bounty payouts on members of the CSM that you don't like are automatically doubled. Thanks in advance!

Your bestest friend on the council,
Trebor



haha!!

♥ EVE Brogrammer ♥ Team Five 0 ♥ @CCP_Punkturis

Camios
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#126 - 2012-11-21 23:56:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Camios
Hi there!

Can any dev confirm that the "20% of the loss value" takes platinum insurance (or the actual level the ship was insured at) into consideration? I hope/think so, otherwise it can be easily exploited.

I ask this because most people tend to think that If, for example, they kill a battlecruiser worth 100 mil they get 20mil maximum in reward. If platinum insurance is taken into consideration, the loss is not 100 millions, but much less, so the maximum payous shoud be much less than 20 millions.
Riikard Thexder
ThexCorp Pty-Ltd
Cup Of ConKrete.
#127 - 2012-11-22 01:24:48 UTC
So what is the point of the new bounty system if we still cant kill people with bounty on thier heads. The new bounty system is not going to make bounty hunting a career possibility, People with bounty are still safe to stay in NPC corps and never venture into low/null cant be war dec'd, so the bounty is unclaimable and therefore a waste of isk and time just like in the old system. We should be able to buy kill rights from the bounty office, OR sign up to the bounty off like FW that gives players/corps/allience kill rights over anyone who has a bounty on thier head.
Alekseyev Karrde
Noir.
Templis CALSF
#128 - 2012-11-22 01:29:48 UTC
Harbingour wrote:
Alekseyev Karrde a Space rich CSM'er wrote:

Base cost for wars remain the same, the per character just scales earlier, faster, and hits the same cap sooner. Why scaling didn't happen at 50 before there really wasnt a good reason for, same thing with a character price cap that only 2 or 3 mega alliances hit. CCP's pretty much using the numbers I suggested, so if you got a problem with it blame me.


The possibility of this scaling IMHO stifles war decc's by making them too high a barrier is my issue with it. Now it appears that the Goons & other large NULL SEC alliances are rarely being decc'd because of it. Any stats on if the # of war decc's has increased; also also seperately has the ISK sink decreased because possibly people can't afford wardecc's?

Looks to me as if this scaling will most help many of those Alliances whom sit on the CSM

The cap for wars is the same, dec'ing 2k-4k alliances will a little bit more expensive but not overly much. 4k-7k will essentially be the same. If you can afford a 450m war dec, you can afford 500m. I think the scaling combined with the multiplier removal will makes life easier for war decers.. Which I guess DOES benefit the alliances of people on the CSM. Mostly mine imo, just not in the way you think. Space rich has nothing to do with it.

I am though. Hope it keeps you up at night Pirate

Alek the Kidnapper, Hero of the CSM

Alekseyev Karrde
Noir.
Templis CALSF
#129 - 2012-11-22 01:31:42 UTC
Marlona Sky wrote:
The war dec fee should only be based on characters actively training a skill. Corps and alliances use alts to bloat the war dec fee to evade a possible war dec. Now this tactic will become more effective.

Really would like CCP to address this. How about it CCP? CSM??

I still think this is needed, been asking for it since Inferno. It's almost certainly wont make it for Retribution. No word from Team Super Friends as to whether it will make it in the point releases.

Alek the Kidnapper, Hero of the CSM

Alekseyev Karrde
Noir.
Templis CALSF
#130 - 2012-11-22 01:37:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Alekseyev Karrde
Marlona Sky wrote:
Also it applies more to low sec where concord is not there to bail you out. Did you guys test to see??

pods cant shoot back anyway.

You should really read dev blogs in order before you post in anger

#alektookcareofit

Alek the Kidnapper, Hero of the CSM

Mars Theran
Foreign Interloper
#131 - 2012-11-22 02:01:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Mars Theran
Sweeet! Smile

..except for that ASB mod. Should have gone with the cap use and left the duration alone. Basically, with the capacity nerf and the duration extension, you just made it useless for anything but gang PvP, and by that, I mean gatecamping and ganking poor solo sods. Should have adjusted it so it would be useful for more than that, but that's just my opinion. What?

Maybe it's for the best though. It'll be interesting to see the burst tanks that will evolve from this anyway. Smile
zubzubzubzubzubzubzubzub
Marlona Sky
State War Academy
Caldari State
#132 - 2012-11-22 02:11:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Il Feytid
Alekseyev Karrde wrote:
Marlona Sky wrote:
Also it applies more to low sec where concord is not there to bail you out. Did you guys test to see??

pods cant shoot back anyway.

You should really read dev blogs in order before you post in anger

#alektookcareofit

So asking a question is considered posting in anger? I have read that dev blog a few times before and my question I asked above was very specific. I thought the entire point of threads like these is so us, the players, can ask questions and provide feed back.

If it was tested and confirmed to still grant the kill right then all you had to say was, "Yes, we tested it and made sure the kill right would not be voided by defending yourself." Christ...
Andre Coeurl
Embers Children
#133 - 2012-11-22 02:11:54 UTC
Hans Jagerblitzen and Alekseyev Karrde together with other have already noted how excessive is the nerf in capacity to ASB, it hits the small and medium sized ships terribly... at the end the the question is, why would someone use an ASB if the total hitpoints he can get are the same as the equivalent sized shield extender?

True, it can be overheated, but it will create damage, and true it can be reloaded, but for practical purposes once it starts reloading you're either out of the fight or you'll die.
The shield extender increases the HPs but also increases the shield recharge /s, it's easier to fit, and protects from alpha much better than an ASB does.

ASBs are a problem when used in pairs or when they can be oversized, but on most ships they are fine as they are as just a decent alternative to shield buffer after all.
Surely there's still time to review this nerf before the expansion.
Mars Theran
Foreign Interloper
#134 - 2012-11-22 02:21:03 UTC
Andre Coeurl wrote:
Hans Jagerblitzen and Alekseyev Karrde together with other have already noted how excessive is the nerf in capacity to ASB, it hits the small and medium sized ships terribly... at the end the the question is, why would someone use an ASB if the total hitpoints he can get are the same as the equivalent sized shield extender?

True, it can be overheated, but it will create damage, and true it can be reloaded, but for practical purposes once it starts reloading you're either out of the fight or you'll die.
The shield extender increases the HPs but also increases the shield recharge /s, it's easier to fit, and protects from alpha much better than an ASB does.

ASBs are a problem when used in pairs or when they can be oversized, but on most ships they are fine as they are as just a decent alternative to shield buffer after all.
Surely there's still time to review this nerf before the expansion.


I think it will move to being a secondary module now. Sort of like having an extra Armor Rep and not having the capacitorto power it, but having a Cap Booster in the mids, and cycling it and the booster to recover from a hard hit faster.

Difference will be that you'll run a shield booster and probably have an Amp. and Burst tank with the ASB. Might be good for Tech II set up that way, where the current ASB could never be a Tech 2 module as it would be extremely overpowered even in Meta levels.

I'd like to take a run at setting up a Raven for this an see how it looks, and maybe put a Rokh together and fit it with a Micro Jump if it'll do it. At least to see if it's viable, if for no other reason. Don't think the Raven will fit a Microjump, Shield Booster, and an ASB, but the Rokh probably can. Might actually make it a worthwhile ship to fly. Lol
zubzubzubzubzubzubzubzub
Scrapyard Bob
EVE University
Ivy League
#135 - 2012-11-22 02:32:30 UTC
Off the top of my head I can think of a few issues that still have not been addressed.

- Bounty contracts need to expire, just like normal contracts. This also solves the issue of "person quits playing for 5 months, what happens to my money?". If the bounty expires under that case, there's not much reason why it couldn't be limited to 30/60/90 days in the normal case. Personally, I think a 30-day limit would strike a nice balance between longevity and being able to grief someone out of the game for 5 months.

- The overview / local indicator for who has a bounty will be mostly useless in places like Jita where bored pilots will just place 100k bounties on anyone in local. There needs to be an overview setting where you can set limits on the minimum bounty amount.

- There needs to be a limit on how many bounties you can place at once, just like public contracts. Maybe it initially uses up the contract slots until a specific skill could be added later. This would also help fight the "bored pilots placing bounties on everyone" issue.

- As much as CCP cries about inflation, you're still passing up the opportunity to add at least some sort of ISK sink into the public bounties. Such as setup fees, taxes on the total amount (1-5%) and only returning some (80-90%) of the remaining bounty if it expires.
Zor'katar
Matari Recreation
#136 - 2012-11-22 02:39:12 UTC
Any chance of making the Salvage Drones spread out among wrecks, rather than ganging up and potentially wasting a bunch of effort?
Michael Harari
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
#137 - 2012-11-22 02:51:22 UTC
Riikard Thexder wrote:
So what is the point of the new bounty system if we still cant kill people with bounty on thier heads. The new bounty system is not going to make bounty hunting a career possibility, People with bounty are still safe to stay in NPC corps and never venture into low/null cant be war dec'd, so the bounty is unclaimable and therefore a waste of isk and time just like in the old system. We should be able to buy kill rights from the bounty office, OR sign up to the bounty off like FW that gives players/corps/allience kill rights over anyone who has a bounty on thier head.


Im sure you can think of a way to kill people in highsec. (Hint: tornados)


Still no response about the micro jump drive, eh?
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#138 - 2012-11-22 02:53:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Ranger 1
Marlona Sky wrote:
Alekseyev Karrde wrote:
Marlona Sky wrote:
Also it applies more to low sec where concord is not there to bail you out. Did you guys test to see??

pods cant shoot back anyway.

You should really read dev blogs in order before you post in anger

#alektookcareofit

So asking a question is considered posting in anger? I have read that dev blog a few times before and my question I asked above was very specific. I thought the entire point of threads like these is so us, the players, can ask questions and provide feed back.

If it was tested and confirmed to still grant the kill right then all you had to say was, "Yes, we tested it and made sure the kill right would not be voided by defending yourself." Christ...


Marlona, I think what he is getting at is this:

Quote:
Performing an action against another player that gets you a Criminal flag will also award a kill-right to that person. This will happen regardless of whether or not the target ship was destroyed.


Combined with the fact that in low sec you only get criminal flags for messing with peoples pods, not their ships.

So he is saying that in Low Sec, since pods can't shoot back anyway, it's a moot point.

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.

Harbingour
EVE Corporation 690846961
#139 - 2012-11-22 03:28:33 UTC
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:
CCP Punkturis wrote:
I was just pointing out in a fun way that I like his idea and I hope that people will have fun with bounties and kill rights as that is pretty much the goal of our feature Big smile

I would like to give you the opportunity to deny the horrible rumor that is going around that bounty payouts on members of the CSM that you don't like are automatically doubled. Thanks in advance!

Your bestest friend on the council,
Trebor



SadCry they should be tripled AttentionBlinkLol
An' then Chicken@little.com, he come scramblin outta the    Terminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system's    crashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children'
Niko Lorenzio
United Eve Directorate
#140 - 2012-11-22 05:10:53 UTC
CCP Punkturis wrote:
Salpad wrote:
Also, why do you make it known to the target who placed the bounty? People are just going to use disposable or secrets alts to place bounties anyway. It's a silly mechanic.


from our initial feedback we got that some people wanted the name there and others not, for those who want to make it known like "yo I don't like you, I'm placing a bounty on you" can just do it with their own dude... others can use alts or a corporation specializing in placing bounties for others Blink


I was about to say the same thing, that you're taking away the luxury and pleasure of checking in on your bounties by forcing us to use unknown alts, but if people really wanted their names visible on bounties this works I guess. It's just an inconvenience.
Maybe... you could have the option to select whether to inform the target or not, like you can when adding contacts.... hmmm.....

The CSM XI Election are now open until March 25th, 2016. Consider Niko Lorenzio for CSM XI.

CSM matters, your voice matters, your vote matters!