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About the destroyers and BC skill changes
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MystLynx
Lulzsec Space
#1 - 2012-11-20 23:48:38 UTC  |  Edited by: MystLynx
Hey folks,
On a recent dev blog, CCP Ytterium wrote this :
Quote:

Let us repeat again: if you could fly it before, you will be able to do so after the change. Technically it means if you are able to fly an Oracle by having Amarr Cruisers 3 and Battlecruisers 3, we will remove the Battlecruisers skill from your character and give you Amarr Battlecruisers at 3. If you had Battlecruisers at 3 and Caldari Cruisers 3 instead, you would not receive Amarr Battlecruisers but the Caldari Battlecruisers skill at 3 instead. The same principle work with the Destroyers skill.
With the way nested skill requirements work in EVE, it also means that you will still be able to fly an Apocalypse even if you don’t have the Amarr Battlecruiser skill trained at 4 after the change. It won’t matter as long as you have the Amarr Battleship skill at the proper level.


But its still not totally clear to me.

Indeed, for the destroyers, for instance, which skill will be considerated as a reference for the new racial skill, the destroyers one, or the frigates one?

For instance :
I have Caldari frigate IV and Destroyers V, will i get Caldari destroyers V or Caldari destroyers IV?

Also, will the changes for the destroyer skill come in the next retribution update the 4th december?

Thank you in advance :)!

EDIT : Answer found :

Tau Cabalander wrote:
Just to avoid any misunderstanding:

Destroyer level X + Racial Frigate 3 = Racial Destroyer level X

Battlecruiser level X + Racial Cruiser Level 3 = Racial Battlecruiser level X

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2145728#post2145728
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2145814#post2145814 [best example]
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2146090#post2146090
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2149140#post2149140

CCP Fozzie wrote:
We'll do the destroyer and battlecruiser skills in one batch, after the BC and BS rebalance is done.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2155506#post2155506

CCP Fozzie wrote:
Want to make this clear to everyone, the stuff in this blog is not coming on the 4th with Retribution. This blog covers some of what we are going to be working on in the beginning of next year.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2145578#post2145578

CCP Fozzie wrote:
I'll come right out and say the skill changes will not come on December 4th with Retribution but that you should still seriously consider taking them into account when you pick your next skills.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2146465#post2146465


Destroyers 5 (rank 2) = 2 * 256,000 skill points
Battlecruisers 5 (rank 6) = 6 * 256,000 skill points

Max Free Skill Points = 3 * Destroyers 5 + 3 * Battlecruisers 5
= 3 * (2 * 256,000) + 3 * (6 * 256,000)
= 6,144,000

Free Training Time @ 2,700 skill points per hour = Max Free Skill Points / 2,700
= 6,144,000 / 2,700
= 2,275.55 hours
= 94d 19h 33m 20s
Knot'Kul Sun
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2012-11-20 23:51:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Knot'Kul Sun
Have BC 5,
destroyers 5,
racial frig 4,
racial cruiser 3 or 4 (4 to be safe)

and youll get all racials to 5(as i was told)


and its not due on december 4th.




as for your caldari, since you have destroyers 5 with caldari frig 4 you should get caldari destroyers 5... again, as i was told. Since theyre measuring what level of racial to give you by your destroyers skill level, youll be awarded 5 for 5, but WHICH racials you get are awarded based on what frigate skills are at 4 i believe.
MystLynx
Lulzsec Space
#3 - 2012-11-20 23:55:53 UTC
Knot'Kul Sun wrote:
Have BC 5,
destroyers 5,
racial frig 4,
racial cruiser 3 or 4

and youll get all racials (as i was told)


and its not due on december 4th.




as for your caldari, since you have destroyers 5 with caldari frig 4 you should get caldari destroyers 5... again, as i was told.

Yeah, i was told the same but CCP stay quite unclear (in the example Ytterium give, the two skills are at the same level...) about that, so it would be nice, if they could make a statement about it.
Sarah Schneider
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#4 - 2012-11-20 23:56:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Sarah Schneider
use

the

search

function


tyvm.

PS: Yes, your question was answered; yes, CCP Ytterbium confirmed the answer; yes, this has been asked many times; no, you ain't getting one from this reply, please put some effort to actually search for the answer.

"I'd rather have other players get shot by other players than not interacting with others" -CCP Soundwave
Shederov Blood
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
#5 - 2012-11-20 23:57:44 UTC
Sarah Schneider wrote:
use

the

search

function


tyvm.

Who put the goat in there?
MystLynx
Lulzsec Space
#6 - 2012-11-20 23:58:02 UTC
Sarah Schneider wrote:
use

the

search

function


tyvm.


Already done, but i must have typed the wrong keywords i guess?
Dorian Wylde
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#7 - 2012-11-20 23:58:07 UTC
Or actually read the blog you're talking about.
Spurty
#8 - 2012-11-20 23:58:38 UTC
Doesn't it just mean that you'll not be able to fly the new racial destroyers if you don't have Vs ?

Unless you NEED to fly those, you should be ok.

There are good ships,

And wood ships,

And ships that sail the sea

But the best ships are Spaceships

Built by CCP
MystLynx
Lulzsec Space
#9 - 2012-11-21 00:00:24 UTC
Dorian Wylde wrote:
Or actually read the blog you're talking about.

Done, answers to my questions are not clear.
Knot'Kul Sun
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2012-11-21 00:01:23 UTC
Spurty wrote:
Doesn't it just mean that you'll not be able to fly the new racial destroyers if you don't have Vs ?

Unless you NEED to fly those, you should be ok.


Youll be able to fly them without V's... its just everyone trying to maximize which free skills they get once they release. having BC at 5 with all the pre-reqs gives you around 4.5 million extra SP once it hits.


thats ALOT of training time to miss out on by not getting a few skills early.
Dave stark
#11 - 2012-11-21 00:02:36 UTC
new racial skill level will be the same as the old skill level. provided you meet the prerequisites.
Sarah Schneider
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#12 - 2012-11-21 00:03:43 UTC
MystLynx wrote:
Dorian Wylde wrote:
Or actually read the blog you're talking about.

Done, answers to my questions are not clear.

I and I'm pretty sure alot of people here knows the answer to your question. It has been answered, explicitly, by Ytterbium, both what skills you're going to get and how does the reimbursement works. Yes, even with examples and yes, even with missing prerequisites for the racial skill reimbursements. Use...the...search...feature.

"I'd rather have other players get shot by other players than not interacting with others" -CCP Soundwave
Destination SkillQueue
Doomheim
#13 - 2012-11-21 00:04:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Destination SkillQueue
It might be simpler for you to get it, if you use the other way they explained it. You will be able to fly everything you can before the change at the same skill level. This means if you can't fly a racial destroyer or battlecruiser before, you can't after. The frigate and cruiser skill requirements come from the current prequisites to fly those ships. You can see them by selecting show info on those ships and looking at their prerequisites.

Racial destroyers require racial frigates at 3 and battlecruisers require racial cruisers at 3 and frigate at 4, so you need them to get the corresponding racial destroyer and battlecruiser skill levels. If you lack any one of the prerequisites, you aren't getting the racial skill.

EDIT: To be clear the frigate and cruiser skill levels only determine, if you get the new racial destroyer/BC skills at all. Your current destroyer/BC skill level will determine at what level you will get them.
Ashterothi
The Order of Thelemic Ascension
The Invited
#14 - 2012-11-21 00:15:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Ashterothi
Allow me to sum up.

For Destroyers the prerequisite is racial frigate 3(so pre-req for Thrasher is Minmatar Frig 3, Destroyer 1).
For reference: http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Thrasher You can see that the requirement is Minmatar Frig 3.
The "Level" of destroyer is your currently trained Destroyer skill's level.

So for each Race you have the prerequisite for, you will receive that races destroyer skill to the level of your current destroyer skill.

Same for Cruiser (the BC's pre-req) and Battle cruisers.

If you have any doubt. Pick a destroyer/BC for the race in game, and check the prerequisites. Can you fly it? Then you will have that racials Destroyer/BC skill to the level of your prechange destroyer/BC skill.

Also, this is not coming out on the fourth. This is supposed to happen as part of the BC re-balancing. So it is safe to assume you have some time. I would not recommend putting it off, but they will likely give us enough time so that anyone who was willing to prepare, could.

Watch me live for all your Empyrean news and analysis!

MystLynx
Lulzsec Space
#15 - 2012-11-21 00:17:27 UTC
thank's
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#16 - 2012-11-21 00:24:13 UTC
good lord really? there's about a million threads on this and it's explained VERY clearly by CCP in various posts and blogs.
what's more, it isnt really rocket science.

please, STOP posting this question.

There is no Bob.

Stuck In Here With Me:  http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/

Down the Pipe:  http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout
MystLynx
Lulzsec Space
#17 - 2012-11-21 00:31:09 UTC
Tau Cabalander wrote:
Just to avoid any misunderstanding:

Destroyer level X + Racial Frigate 3 = Racial Destroyer level X

Battlecruiser level X + Racial Cruiser Level 3 = Racial Battlecruiser level X

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2145728#post2145728
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2145814#post2145814 [best example]
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2146090#post2146090
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2149140#post2149140

CCP Fozzie wrote:
We'll do the destroyer and battlecruiser skills in one batch, after the BC and BS rebalance is done.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2155506#post2155506

CCP Fozzie wrote:
Want to make this clear to everyone, the stuff in this blog is not coming on the 4th with Retribution. This blog covers some of what we are going to be working on in the beginning of next year.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2145578#post2145578

CCP Fozzie wrote:
I'll come right out and say the skill changes will not come on December 4th with Retribution but that you should still seriously consider taking them into account when you pick your next skills.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2146465#post2146465


Destroyers 5 (rank 2) = 2 * 256,000 skill points
Battlecruisers 5 (rank 6) = 6 * 256,000 skill points

Max Free Skill Points = 3 * Destroyers 5 + 3 * Battlecruisers 5
= 3 * (2 * 256,000) + 3 * (6 * 256,000)
= 6,144,000

Free Training Time @ 2,700 skill points per hour = Max Free Skill Points / 2,700
= 6,144,000 / 2,700
= 2,275.55 hours
= 94d 19h 33m 20s

Found the right keywords...
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#18 - 2012-11-21 00:57:15 UTC
Im glad we have confirmation on this skill issue for the 90000000th time. What we STILL dont have is confirmation on the "Search Forums" function that seems to be either broken or completely missing from most of these peoples forum clients. CCP, a response please.

Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
Roll Sizzle Beef
Space Mutiny
#19 - 2012-11-21 01:05:02 UTC
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:
Im glad we have confirmation on this skill issue for the 90000000th time. What we STILL dont have is confirmation on the "Search Forums" function that seems to be either broken or completely missing from most of these peoples forum clients. CCP, a response please.

That all depends on if they know the eve lingo to even acquire the right results. That's if the search actually does work and not hang with a time out. Griping about it wont change the fact most wont use the search until badgered about it, its not like they will search for "should I use search?"
Muestereate
Minions LLC
#20 - 2012-11-21 02:17:56 UTC
My Search forums function doesn't work, never did or I would not have to ask, What about command ships? That will be a nasty one. I don't see it anywhere but the Battlecruisers will be some sort of prereqs. Even if I dodge the bullet, that means a new person would have to train for half a year additional to run all command ships. Right now the BCs are worth 94 days and I think CS5 is 27 days just from 4 to 5. thats 81 days or 175 days additional train time for what. A ship class they want to nerf? The T3 training balance is going to be absurd.
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