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Proportion of new EVE players vs Old

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Karrl Tian
Doomheim
#61 - 2012-11-19 22:47:37 UTC
Demolishar wrote:
All the old players made swarms of alts. They don't seem to realise it's self-destructive as they are destroying the "ecosystem" of EVE by marginalising the new players.


This. PLEX did more damage to EVE than ten Incarnas.
Beekeeper Bob
Beekeepers Anonymous
#62 - 2012-11-19 22:51:41 UTC
Kenneth O'Hara wrote:
Beekeeper Bob wrote:
Kimsemus wrote:
I was discussing this with some mates on TS while playing last night, and we got into an interesting topic about player proportions.

I've been playing since 2003, and I used to notice a disproportionate number of older players, vs relatively fewer new players.

In the past year, or maybe couple years, I've noticed greatly increased numbers of new characters/players, and fewer older players. I just wanted to get your guys perspective on player populations and changing demographics of characters/players.

I feel personally that lots of new people is a good thing, it means a healthy game, but I've noticed that a lot of my fellow old timers are going into semi-retirement, moved on, or maybe I notice fewer outside of hardcore null PVP alliances because of higher populations...or maybe I'm just being an idiot and way off base.

What are your thoughts?



I think you're dreaming.....Cool


Have you joined an NPC corp lately? Nothing like an indication of alts when you have 100+ people in channel, and no one is saying a word. Or one person is, and he's not getting any response.
If new people are really joining this game, 90% of them are apparently quitting after the first month......Oops


In all fairness, I learned most about the gaming running the tutorial missions and asking questions in rookie help. If I could not find answers there, I googled what I was looking for and I'd usually find an answer. I pretty much had all of the basic stuff down within the first 2 weeks. I still didn't join an actual corp until like a week or 2 after that. I wanted to make sure I could learn as much as I could on my own. Plus, I was working on the basic core competency cert so I could fit my ships. Not for tech 2 stuff but at least meta 4s. I'm currently working on my tech 2 fitting now.



I too believe in 3 month old alts with 5000 likes as being "New players"

I also believe in fairies......Oops



Signature removed - CCP Eterne
Ocih
Space Mermaids
#63 - 2012-11-19 23:20:24 UTC
The whole meta thing with EVE makes it impossible to know who is new and who is refurb. There are new people coming in to the game. They just don't stay but even Vets are interval players. EVE doesn't have the hold on people it used to.
Kimsemus
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#64 - 2012-11-20 00:59:35 UTC
Truly, I wish CCP would spend less time developing things like the Noble Exchange, which no one asked for, and spent more time improving their core product. I personally think this upcoming expansion is a step in the right direction, though. Maybe they will turn over a new leaf?
Kenneth O'Hara
Sebiestor Tribe
#65 - 2012-11-20 06:31:14 UTC
Beekeeper Bob wrote:
Kenneth O'Hara wrote:
Beekeeper Bob wrote:
Kimsemus wrote:
I was discussing this with some mates on TS while playing last night, and we got into an interesting topic about player proportions.

I've been playing since 2003, and I used to notice a disproportionate number of older players, vs relatively fewer new players.

In the past year, or maybe couple years, I've noticed greatly increased numbers of new characters/players, and fewer older players. I just wanted to get your guys perspective on player populations and changing demographics of characters/players.

I feel personally that lots of new people is a good thing, it means a healthy game, but I've noticed that a lot of my fellow old timers are going into semi-retirement, moved on, or maybe I notice fewer outside of hardcore null PVP alliances because of higher populations...or maybe I'm just being an idiot and way off base.

What are your thoughts?



I think you're dreaming.....Cool


Have you joined an NPC corp lately? Nothing like an indication of alts when you have 100+ people in channel, and no one is saying a word. Or one person is, and he's not getting any response.
If new people are really joining this game, 90% of them are apparently quitting after the first month......Oops


In all fairness, I learned most about the gaming running the tutorial missions and asking questions in rookie help. If I could not find answers there, I googled what I was looking for and I'd usually find an answer. I pretty much had all of the basic stuff down within the first 2 weeks. I still didn't join an actual corp until like a week or 2 after that. I wanted to make sure I could learn as much as I could on my own. Plus, I was working on the basic core competency cert so I could fit my ships. Not for tech 2 stuff but at least meta 4s. I'm currently working on my tech 2 fitting now.



I too believe in 3 month old alts with 5000 likes as being "New players"

I also believe in fairies......Oops




I think you need to click the link in my sig. Don't worry, it loops back to another thread here on the forums.
If you don't want to believe that I am a new player, then don't. I'm not gonna twist your arm.

Bring Saede Riordan back!! Never Forget! _"__Operation Godzilla Smacks Zeus"  ~__Graygor _
Lord Rixus
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#66 - 2012-11-20 06:43:31 UTC
Well... im new... sort of lol. Subbed a year ago, but prob only played 3-4 months of it.

Im enjoying it a lot more now, my 3rd attempt. Although 24 day skills etc are a tough pill to swallow. I understand the mechanics, but it still feels like "lol come back in a month and then play gg"
Josef Djugashvilis
#67 - 2012-11-20 09:13:59 UTC
Just out of curiosity, how long does one need to have been playing for to be classed as 'old'?

This is not a signature.
Max Doobie
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#68 - 2012-11-20 09:48:23 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
Spurty wrote:
Max Doobie wrote:
So not being able to fly effectively makes you a "window licker"?


Positively. fly what you have trained for.

Max Doobie wrote:
See this is the vet mentality that I'm talking about.


Yes, this is the vet mentality. "Why didn't this guy just ask me for help?"

Max Doobie wrote:
And the thing is YOU were once one of those ignorant window lickers you despise to much, but now that you know the game you want to crap on everyone else still climbing up. It's lame, ridiculous and will kill the game eventually because those noobs you despise? They keep the game running. There is no EVE without us. So keep talking down to us and treating us like s**t. We will stop coming and the damn game will die. Then you'll be a bittervet with nothing to do and your wife will actually have to start spending time with you now.


Was never an ignorant window licker. Always asked if I didn't know. Always learned from mentors and vets. I actually have friends that will help me out if lost.


Now, you've really lost the plot with the personal attack here.

You're saying I despise people that undock in ships they can't fit / fly yet as they are in a rush to be a body on the battle field (objective, 100% to **** up the overview).

Wrong. I "Despair" and "pity" them for having no one to help them suggest the correct ship to bring to be useful.

People that push words into others mouths end up with no teeth. You're probably well aware of this mind you.

haha Wow you're really starting to pop that vein out of your forehead lol

What a reply.



Personal attack removed. Please keep it on topic. -ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
Kenneth O'Hara
Sebiestor Tribe
#69 - 2012-11-20 16:18:57 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
Max Doobie wrote:
Spurty wrote:
Max Doobie wrote:
So not being able to fly effectively makes you a "window licker"?


Positively. fly what you have trained for.

Max Doobie wrote:
See this is the vet mentality that I'm talking about.


Yes, this is the vet mentality. "Why didn't this guy just ask me for help?"

Max Doobie wrote:
And the thing is YOU were once one of those ignorant window lickers you despise to much, but now that you know the game you want to crap on everyone else still climbing up. It's lame, ridiculous and will kill the game eventually because those noobs you despise? They keep the game running. There is no EVE without us. So keep talking down to us and treating us like s**t. We will stop coming and the damn game will die. Then you'll be a bittervet with nothing to do and your wife will actually have to start spending time with you now.


Was never an ignorant window licker. Always asked if I didn't know. Always learned from mentors and vets. I actually have friends that will help me out if lost.


Now, you've really lost the plot with the personal attack here.

You're saying I despise people that undock in ships they can't fit / fly yet as they are in a rush to be a body on the battle field (objective, 100% to **** up the overview).

Wrong. I "Despair" and "pity" them for having no one to help them suggest the correct ship to bring to be useful.

People that push words into others mouths end up with no teeth. You're probably well aware of this mind you.

haha Wow you're really starting to pop that vein out of your forehead lol

What a reply.




Personal attack removed. Please keep it on topic. -ISD Dorrim Barstorlode

Wow...

Bring Saede Riordan back!! Never Forget! _"__Operation Godzilla Smacks Zeus"  ~__Graygor _
Sarlot
Doomheim
#70 - 2012-11-20 16:29:56 UTC
How many of these, "I'm a new player and I suck at this game so it must be the fault of all the older players" posts do we get tin the forums these days?
Far too many that's for sure. You came here because this isn't WoW and then you complain because it's not as easy as WoW or whatever FPS you grew bored of. Please play and excel at EvE as it is and pretty much has been for 10 years. If you don't own all of null-sec within a month maybe you should adjust your goals or playing style.
This whole "I'm so worried about the new players" lie is boring also, just admit you suck at EvE and you want to make it easier for yourself.
Amitious Turkey
10kSubnautic
Warriors of the Blood God
#71 - 2012-11-20 16:43:32 UTC
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:
Just out of curiosity, how long does one need to have been playing for to be classed as 'old'?


When your pod starts growing gray hair.

In all seriousness, probably when a person hits ~40 mill sp or so (if they play only with one toon).

I like to lick things.

Haunting the forums since 03.
Gotch Urarse
The Legion of Spoon
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
#72 - 2012-11-20 16:44:29 UTC
Sarlot wrote:
How many of these, "I'm a new player and I suck at this game so it must be the fault of all the older players" posts do we get tin the forums these days?
Far too many that's for sure. You came here because this isn't WoW and then you complain because it's not as easy as WoW or whatever FPS you grew bored of. Please play and excel at EvE as it is and pretty much has been for 10 years. If you don't own all of null-sec within a month maybe you should adjust your goals or playing style.
This whole "I'm so worried about the new players" lie is boring also, just admit you suck at EvE and you want to make it easier for yourself.


As new player, I agree with the first part. If you're going to get into something, do the research. I have no problem taking any kind of risks and paying the price. Why? I continuously research EVE.

Now, the second part, worrying about new players, should be a concern IMHO. You get some instra-grad whining about not flying BS in a week, sure, I agree. But new players who try to understand, ask questions, pay dues and be patient, could use some worrying about, as they contribute to the longevity of EVE.

just my 0.02 ISK.
Amitious Turkey
10kSubnautic
Warriors of the Blood God
#73 - 2012-11-20 16:45:46 UTC
Also, what's with the solo player hate? I've been solo playing since the game began, and I love it...

But perhaps my definition of solo play is different. I like to have people there in case I need them/feel lonelyRoll, but I prefer to do my own thing most of the time.

I like to lick things.

Haunting the forums since 03.
Kenneth O'Hara
Sebiestor Tribe
#74 - 2012-11-20 16:46:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Kenneth O'Hara
Sarlot wrote:
How many of these, "I'm a new player and I suck at this game so it must be the fault of all the older players" posts do we get tin the forums these days?
Far too many that's for sure. You came here because this isn't WoW and then you complain because it's not as easy as WoW or whatever FPS you grew bored of. Please play and excel at EvE as it is and pretty much has been for 10 years. If you don't own all of null-sec within a month maybe you should adjust your goals or playing style.
This whole "I'm so worried about the new players" lie is boring also, just admit you suck at EvE and you want to make it easier for yourself.

OK, first off, we new players could not care less for your sense of entitlement for respect and ego. We don't care. Respect is something that is earned and frankly most vets do not deserve it from what I have seen.

FYI, I left WoW because it was easy and I come over to eve and find it had a steep learning curve and I'm still finding stuff out all the time. I think the most difficult thing in this game is not the game itself. It's the arrogant vets. Not all of the vets are like what I have described and I thank those few for being exceptions to the rule.

Mind you, I learned the basic stuff all on my own. How to actually survive in the most difficult places such as W-space and nullsec, I learned from vets and not the arrogant ones you come across in nullsec and on the forums.

If you take offense to this, just know that I am only going based on what I have observed in game and on the forums. If you disagree with what I have said, prove me wrong.

Bring Saede Riordan back!! Never Forget! _"__Operation Godzilla Smacks Zeus"  ~__Graygor _
Sarlot
Doomheim
#75 - 2012-11-20 17:00:45 UTC

[/quote]
I apologize, misread your post. I'll edit a better post here in a sec.[/quote]
I was responding to the the doobie fellow mostly but I didn't think it conducive to copying all that text. This thread degenerated into the us versus them mentality that many supposedly newer players that make posts in GD often turn to in blame.
I think helping newer players learn EvE is part of the fun of this game but this older player bashing is tiresome and fundamentally wrong.
Kenneth O'Hara
Sebiestor Tribe
#76 - 2012-11-20 17:05:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Kenneth O'Hara
Sarlot wrote:
Kenneth O'Hara wrote:
I apologize, misread your post. I'll edit a better post here in a sec.

I was responding to the the doobie fellow mostly but I didn't think it conducive to copying all that text. This thread degenerated into the us versus them mentality that many supposedly newer players that make posts in GD often turn to in blame.
I think helping newer players learn EvE is part of the fun of this game but this older player bashing is tiresome and fundamentally wrong.

Then why bash back? He was only bashing because he felt talked down to by the other vet. If he wasn't talking down, then he should have worded his statements better.

Bring Saede Riordan back!! Never Forget! _"__Operation Godzilla Smacks Zeus"  ~__Graygor _
Denegrah Togasa
Togasa Iron Ring Industries
#77 - 2012-11-20 18:05:10 UTC
One of the Problems with the way the game is setup for new players is they want you to specialize to become good at one thing. The problem comes in that your character is way more "powerful" if they can fly many different things so when an FC says we need more X you can be like i can fly X and switch over. Instead of well i can only fly slasher's and then your FC either has to fit you in to their sniper fleet somehow or come up with another concept or you are basically out there with your ass hanging in the wind with no support.

Power in the game comes from Generalization in practice. New players are often encouraged to train "Support skills" Which are general skills. So the way the game is designed and the way the game plays are at odds with each other and the new player suffers with confusing messages and indicators that they are doing it wrong.

Myself i decided i don't like the Skill que game and now i train skills randomly, because i came to the conclusion i can either let my lack of skills hinder me from having fun or i can just have fun with my corp who excepts whatever i fly regardless of how well i fly it.

But prior to my decision about Skills it was easily the most frustrating part of the game I dreaded whenever my skill que was less then 24hours.
Kenneth O'Hara
Sebiestor Tribe
#78 - 2012-11-20 18:11:10 UTC
Denegrah Togasa wrote:
One of the Problems with the way the game is setup for new players is they want you to specialize to become good at one thing. The problem comes in that your character is way more "powerful" if they can fly many different things so when an FC says we need more X you can be like i can fly X and switch over. Instead of well i can only fly slasher's and then your FC either has to fit you in to their sniper fleet somehow or come up with another concept or you are basically out there with your ass hanging in the wind with no support.

Power in the game comes from Generalization in practice. New players are often encouraged to train "Support skills" Which are general skills. So the way the game is designed and the way the game plays are at odds with each other and the new player suffers with confusing messages and indicators that they are doing it wrong.

Myself i decided i don't like the Skill que game and now i train skills randomly, because i came to the conclusion i can either let my lack of skills hinder me from having fun or i can just have fun with my corp who excepts whatever i fly regardless of how well i fly it.

But prior to my decision about Skills it was easily the most frustrating part of the game I dreaded whenever my skill que was less then 24hours.

I usually train skills for what I wanna do. Like now, I wanna fly a maelstrom. I trained skills to fly a maelstrom and all the support skills to fit it properly and use all the right guns. It really does help to have focus. Not for your skills but what you want to do, the skills will follow on an as needed bases.

Bring Saede Riordan back!! Never Forget! _"__Operation Godzilla Smacks Zeus"  ~__Graygor _
Denegrah Togasa
Togasa Iron Ring Industries
#79 - 2012-11-20 18:14:47 UTC
I want to explode ships mine theirs doesn't matter do i need more skills then i start with to do that? nah
Solhild
Doomheim
#80 - 2012-11-20 19:18:00 UTC
My thinking is that new is defined as younger than the mean age of a player; whereas old is older than the mean age.

I predict that the proportion of new to old players will remain about the same for a while Blink