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I want a program that tracks profits.
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Juelz Carlos
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#1 - 2012-11-14 07:49:06 UTC
Eve Trader used to do this (http://wiki.eve-id.net/images/EveTraderDashboard.png) in a very simple way. Eve Nexus also used to do this similarly and they were awesome.

But Trader isn't being updated and Nexus is breaking for me, so is there a program that gives you your daily profits like these?

I've tried Mentat, EMMA, and EWA before, but none of them do what I want.
Vadane Deninard
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2012-11-14 07:53:47 UTC
I think I know what you're looking for. I used Eve-Profit.de website for that but it's been down since the last API patch.

Fortunately, VV updates his Eve Income Analyzer (look for the thread in this forum or VVs website). It doesn't exactly do what you are looking for, but at least it provides you information to estimate your daily profits pretty well (along with some other neat info!).

Give this tool a try, its really a good one. You can check your daily profits under the tab "Efficiency" and then check absolute / volume ... then manually summarizing all entries will give you the profits in the time horizon you defined.
Juelz Carlos
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#3 - 2012-11-14 08:08:52 UTC
Vadane Deninard wrote:
I think I know what you're looking for. I used Eve-Profit.de website for that but it's been down since the last API patch.

Fortunately, VV updates his Eve Income Analyzer (look for the thread in this forum or VVs website). It doesn't exactly do what you are looking for, but at least it provides you information to estimate your daily profits pretty well (along with some other neat info!).

Give this tool a try, its really a good one. You can check your daily profits under the tab "Efficiency" and then check absolute / volume ... then manually summarizing all entries will give you the profits in the time horizon you defined.


Ok, Income Analyzer is pretty good. It is manual, but it also is accurate and does what i want, so I will try it out for a bit. Thanks!
Vera Algaert
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#4 - 2012-11-14 09:14:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Vera Algaert
Tracking "profit" only seems easy as long as you don't think about it.

Here is an example:

Day -1: you deposit 2b ISK into your corporate account and buy 3 PLEX @ 500m each
Day 0: PLEX prices are 500/520 - you sell 2 PLEX @ 520m
Day 1: PLEX prices have risen to 510/525, you buy 3 PLEX @ 510m
Day 2: PLEX prices are 510/525, you sell 2 PLEX @ 525m
Day 3: PLEX prices are 520/550, CCP announces the CPI has risen by 10% since Day -1, none of your orders fills.
Day 4: the world ends and God wants to know your profits.

for the sake of simplicity any PLEX you are holding are on a sell order at the market price.

Your assets at the start of each day:
Day 0: 3 PLEX, 500m
Day 1: 1 PLEX, 1540m
Day 2: 4 PLEX, 10m
Day 3: 2 PLEX, 1060m
Day 4: 2 PLEX, 1060m

What are your profits?

(A) You compare your assets on Day 0 and Day 4, valuing any PLEX stock at buy order (instant liquidation) value.
P = (1060 + 2x 520) - (500 + 3x500) = 100

(B) You compare your assets on Day 0 and Day 4, valuing any PLEX stock at sell order value (you didn't know the world was going to end and justify this valuation by arguing that you thought your business was a going concern).
P = (1060 + 2x 550) - (500 + 3x520) = 120

(C) Actually your profits are what is left over when you have replaced your original endowment. Sounds logical, right?
Guess you'd have to pretend buying a 3rd PLEX at 550m (as your buy order @ 520m didn't fill) to determine profits:
P = (2 PLEX + 500m + 560m) - (3 PLEX + 500m) = (3 PLEX + 500m + 10m) - (3 PLEX + 500m) = 10m

(D) Options (A) and (B) are preferable to option (C) but they don't take into account that the same amount of ISK can buy 10% less on Day 4 than it could on Day 0.
P = (1060 + 2x 520)/1.1 - (500 + 3x500) = -90.91
P' = (1060 + 2x 550)/1.1 - (500 + 3x520) = -76.36
oops, looks like you made a loss.

(E) Is there someway to to get a daily profit graph using the valuation approach from Option (A)? (FIFO)

Day 0 start: 3 PLEX (500, 500, 500), 500m
Day 0 end: 1 PLEX (500), 1540m
=========================
Day 0 profit: 40m

Day 1 start: 1 PLEX (500), 1540m
Day 1 end: 4 PLEX (500, 510, 510, 510), 10m
=========================
Day 1 profit: 0m

Day 2 start: 4 PLEX (500, 510, 510, 510), 10m
Day 2 end: 2 PLEX (510, 510), 1060m
=========================
Day 2 profit: 40m

Day 3 start: 2 PLEX (510, 510), 1060m
Day 3 end: 2 PLEX (520, 520), 1060m
=========================
Day 3 profit: 20m

total profit = 40 + 0 + 40 + 20 = 100

(F) Option (E) looks good but maybe you would prefer LIFO?

Day 0 start: 3 PLEX (500, 500, 500), 500m
Day 0 end: 1 PLEX (500), 1540m
=========================
Day 0 profit: 40m

Day 1 start: 1 PLEX (500), 1540m
Day 1 end: 4 PLEX (500, 510, 510, 510), 10m
=========================
Day 1 profit: 0m

Day 2 start: 4 PLEX (500, 510, 510, 510), 10m
Day 2 end: 2 PLEX (500, 510), 1060m
=========================
Day 2 profit: 30m

Day 3 start: 2 PLEX (500, 510), 1060m
Day 3 end: 2 PLEX (520, 520), 1060m
=========================
Day 3 profit: 30m

total profit = 40 + 0 + 30 + 30 = 100

.
Vera Algaert
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#5 - 2012-11-14 09:19:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Vera Algaert
There are half a dozen programs that give you some number they call "profit" and none of them makes transparent what that word means to them.

Reality is much more complex than the example above - You have to pay broker fees/taxes (even for orders that expire because they don't fill), maybe you withdrew 10m from the corporate account to get yourself a Slasher for your solo pvp adventures, or you handed out a partially collateralized loan on MD but are starting to feel uneasy about whether you will ever get your money back, ...

(I am no accountant and barely passed the few accounting classes I had to take. There are probably terrible mistakes in the example above.)

.
Vadane Deninard
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2012-11-14 10:30:00 UTC
I get your point Vera but I also think you are overthinking this a bit.

From my feeling the OP is looking for a tool that gives you +/-% of your transactions (at least thats what I'm looking for). I.e. you bought Tritanium for 5.42 PU and sell it for 5.76 PU -> the difference minus tax/fee is your profit from that trade.

Thats what Eve-profit did and what VVs tool is doing as well. I know that this does not display your "total wealth growth" but at least its better than just tracking your NAV (which is even more inaccurate).
Juelz Carlos
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#7 - 2012-11-14 10:47:00 UTC
I get what you're saying Vera, and was well aware of the potential errors, but I was also under the impression that those programs used some kind of "matching" system between bought/sold items (I can't quite recall the acronym for it) that made the tracked profit relatively accurate. Broker fees can also be easily accounted for manually, and not something I'm particularly concerned about.

Regardless, the method outlined with Isk Analyzer is actually quite accurate and will suit my needs for now.
JohnathanGalt
Northern Sky Industries
#8 - 2012-11-14 13:26:55 UTC
Ever since eveprofit.de went down for the API changes, I have been using Market Mogul. While it is still being developed, it has been pretty good. One of the nice features is the ability to remove something from "stock" so it is taken out of the queue of items that you purchased. For example, lets say you trade in PLEX, and a certain one you bought for personal use, you can remove it from "stock" so that that particular PLEX is not considered when selling off your inventory. Here is the forum topic:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=154301&find=unread
March rabbit
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2012-11-14 16:14:22 UTC
i made my own program (why not anyway?).

Procedure is easy and stupid:
1. I have DB of all transactions for chars i control.
2. I read API and update DB.
3. Difference between bought and sold prices == profit. No taxes here.
4. DB is stored in text-based format which gives you lots:
- manually check operations if you need
- manually add/remove operations (like when you buy something from contract and then sell to market. You just add buy operation by hands into DB)
- "close" some operations (set flag IGNORE). It gives option to start operations "from zero" without cutting DB
5. Display:
- wallets of controlled chars (+total)
- daily buy/sell operations sorted by solar systems
- "profit" by days, last week and total
- "profit" by item - amount/summ of buy, amount/summ of sell, time of operation (from first item bought to last item sold), profit
6. Ruby-based program with simple syntax - ease of modifications

The Mittani: "the inappropriate drunked joke"
Anubis Star
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2012-11-15 11:59:01 UTC
http://pwning.de/neat/ might be worth a try
Rhadit
Habemus
#11 - 2012-11-16 10:34:16 UTC
Tackled In Belt released a very, very good profit tracking program.. It's called Market Mogul and it's free! It creates graphs and reports that can be shared online.
Ronix Aideron
Zymurgy Corp.
#12 - 2012-11-16 13:12:42 UTC
I use EVE Trader on my iPhone and Market Mogul for tracking this information. They both have good and okay features.

Start the day off slow and taper off from there.

http://eveboard.com/pilot/Ronix_Aideron