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Fleet hangars and changes to various settings

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Bloodpetal
Tir Capital Management Group
#61 - 2012-10-20 13:28:40 UTC


When people wonder "Do you really play this game?"... these kinds of feature changes are why.

Where I am.
Sh'iriin
Perkone
Caldari State
#62 - 2012-10-20 13:51:41 UTC
since no scap pilot would allow access to his fleethangar & the billions of isk in mods in there, you either need seperated access control for smb and fh - or nobody will ever be able to use that smb....
Shobon Welp
GoonFleet
Band of Brothers
#63 - 2012-10-20 15:53:41 UTC
Bloodpetal wrote:
I'm just blown away that you didn't consider the fact that people STEAL THINGS IN EVE as it is, and you're giving us no granularity in controlling that.

Why is having people steal things in Eve a 'bad' thing and why does it need to be controlled?
Evander Grimson
Doomheim
#64 - 2012-10-20 16:36:39 UTC
give us the corp hangers! Otherweise it would suck hard - or give us diffrent devision with shared size and diffrent access levels ( nobody/corp/allianz/fleet - same for smb

cheers
zufina
BLACK SQUADRON.
Get Off My Lawn
#65 - 2012-10-20 16:48:13 UTC
Only 1 hanger is a bad idea!
CCP What do you think you're doing?
The Corp hangers were actually fine - an improvement would be devision for the smb and giveing an option to allow fleet access a division.
You're doing it the wrong way.

An other Optioin would be giveing us a fleet hanger with diffrent division and access levels - same would be nice for the smb - all of cause with a shared size.
How about Peronal / Corp / Alliance / Fleet ?
And you should still be able to put stuff in if in Fleet / Corp /etc. without haveing the rights to take stuff out.


Guess for example a low/00 mining op, a rorqual with all nice T2 mining ships inside and the ore - somebody of the fleet warps in a Orca / Rorqual / Carrier / Supercarrier / Titan and takes everything out of the Rorqual - all Cristals / Ore / Ships etc. - This fact would destroy nearly even mining op - and new player won't be invited anymore to join.

Same issue with Capital fleets. Imagen 100+ Carrier/Supercarrier/Tittans jumping a long way - cap fitted and well at a midpoint somebody needs LO or Fuel and ask if somebody could turn access on ( most everybody will have it denied after you're horrible change - except some people who didn't get the informatioin ) and this Carrier / Super / Titan Pilot how ask just steels 100bil + from everybody in fleet - cause the expensive Tank / Fight fit's are stored in Fleet hanger ?

So are you serious about this change and have thought and talked to us before codeing - no.
So I better guess learn it the heard way from the negative feedback and fix those issues.
Monasucks
BLACK SQUADRON.
Get Off My Lawn
#66 - 2012-10-20 17:02:50 UTC
I absoluty agree with Sh'iriin and zufina and all the other who says that it's horrible.

Give us diffrenet sections with a shared space and diffrent access levels. The idea / use of the corp hangers where haveing a shared space with diffrent access lvl's to statisfy everybody in corp with gieving access and you're still able to store stuff save.

there are so many good ideas here like the one with diffrent access levels for fleet or corp or just you personal - that's the way to go I think.
Would be nice to get you're feedback on monday.

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CCP Habakuk
C C P
C C P Alliance
#67 - 2012-10-20 17:12:04 UTC
Monasucks wrote:
...
there are so many good ideas here like the one with diffrent access levels for fleet or corp or just you personal - that's the way to go I think.
Would be nice to get you're feedback on monday.


It is clear to us, that we need to improve something in regards to the lost divisions and the simplified access-settings and I promise to post here on Monday after I had a talk with the team. I cannot promise, that we find a solution on Monday, but we'll try our best.

I personally like some of the posted suggestions a lot, but I am neither a programmer nor a game designer. ;)

CCP Habakuk | EVE Quality Assurance | Team Five 0 | (Team Gridlock)

Bug reporting | Mass Testing
RC Mine
#68 - 2012-10-20 22:02:56 UTC
vidax wrote:
"These fleet hangars have no divisions" Are you kidding me CCP? Its the only way I had, to organise the 100s of items carriers have to carry.


+1

This sounds very bad. As a rorqual pilot I keep multiple fittings for the actual ship + different fittings for the industrial fleet.
On top of that I have various types of fuel and about 100 BPO's

If you remove the corp hangar divisions you remove the only way I'm able to keep some kind of organization in the huge pile of modules, goods and Bpo's.
I cannot see how this update benefits anyone really. It will from a rorqual pilots point of view only bring frustrations.
Z1gy
Vindicator Corporation
#69 - 2012-10-20 23:40:51 UTC
i like the division of corp hangars on my cap/orca and i think putting a check box on each of the division tab would make life easier as sometime the corp roles are sometime bugged!
Major JSilva
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#70 - 2012-10-21 02:40:28 UTC
Will the 10 people max refitting limit still be in place ?

Twitter: @Silva117
Scrapyard Bob
EVE University
Ivy League
#71 - 2012-10-21 02:45:10 UTC
Antir wrote:
Some people have suggested using cans to replace divisions in the fleet hangar, on tranquility a can cannot be used when it is in a corp hangar in space. On duality I took1 of every can I could find, put them in my fleet hangar and undocked my carrier http://i.imgur.com/Lx3Xk.jpg.


Well, the eternal optimist in me would hope that they could make cans usable from the new fleet hangar (and heck, maybe fix cans in POS Corp Hangar Arrays while they're at it).
Finde learth
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#72 - 2012-10-21 07:00:00 UTC
Thomas Gilmour wrote:

Those filters don't let me select a group of modules to refit with.


maybe "name is" or "name is" or "name is" can make it ?
Orchyre
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#73 - 2012-10-21 07:23:09 UTC
Any possible addition of a log for SMB/Hangar activity? It'd be nice to know who takes what/when.
Aurelius Valentius
Valentius Corporation
#74 - 2012-10-21 21:27:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Aurelius Valentius
I can see both sides of the situation - being and Orca pilot [max mind you] and I do run ops from time to time but mostly it's a storage RV for moving around... and I am into capitals heavy on SISI [now buckingham] so I can see the point of organization.

However I hated the "Corp" tied division tabs... not for the tab but because it was tied to the "corp divisions" - which is imho just a stupid tie in for a ship hangar, so the idea of a "Fleet Hanger" is good.

I would have liked it to simply be a "Ship Hangar" with Access rights then given to anyone in fleet or corp with two distinct check arrows.... makes sense to me, sometimes I might want to allow corpies or not, sometimes fleet [basically the whole point of it] when in fleet and often alot of them are not corpies for most miners but ad-hoc ops with your mining-mates. So Fleet option is a good change.

Organization... EVE is lacking in this, and I think the suggestion of containers is a good idea... that is in the game already and mimics real world containers enough for it to be a natural way of even new players to figure out how to use them - while the idea of them being bigger inside than out [TARDIS] is a bit odd, I can live with it, though I always think it's odd...

it would be nice to be able to say have a line of as someone put simple containers, not secure, that fill in the missing sizes, cargo bays and cans have been a long over looked but so often used part of EVE that I think before they did the UI even CCP should have looked into this and found a systematic metric of sizes and sized cargo bays because this is an industrial game, and everything industrial uses standard sized box mentality more or less... real life gauges are used in everything to keep everything fitting together and organizes.

I would suggest both secure and non-secure (like the new default setting of unlocked though)...

100 [small]
200
300
400
500
1000 [large]
2000
3000
4000
5000
10000 [captial]
20000
30000
40000
50000
100000 [Freighter]
200000
300000
400000
500000
1000000 [Station Containers are fine at this point]

add more if you like but that would be a good stacking... so an orca could drop in 4x 10000 size to the hangar or 40x 1000, etc , or cargo for that matter... put the stuff then where you want it in containers... organization is good in all ways.... with the 1-5 you can cover everything above also with less cans - 6= 1+5 size, etc... to the next double up on the largest previous.
Adding...

Log [Good}

Hangar:
BPO Can [Roq]
Fittings Can
Crystals Can
Stripper Cam... oh sorry... *blush*
Tetania
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#75 - 2012-10-21 21:44:39 UTC
I like the idea of the change server side saving and simplified divisions are awesome, with the proviso that corp hangar wise we at least need a Private and public separation and separately turning on SMA and Corp hangar access would be good while you're coding stuf.

While talking about the other solutions to this like cans and the problem of transporting bigger cans to Titans and SC it occured to me that a cool way to do that and to give titans a nice feature could be to add build / research slots to titans. Just a couple with some kind of flavor racial bonus. Wouldn't be a game breaking but would be a nice convienience to have bigger containers constructed inside and for people who use their Super capitals as bases.
Matthew97
#76 - 2012-10-22 07:58:51 UTC
CCP Habakuk wrote:
Monasucks wrote:
...
there are so many good ideas here like the one with diffrent access levels for fleet or corp or just you personal - that's the way to go I think.
Would be nice to get you're feedback on monday.


It is clear to us, that we need to improve something in regards to the lost divisions and the simplified access-settings and I promise to post here on Monday after I had a talk with the team. I cannot promise, that we find a solution on Monday, but we'll try our best.

I personally like some of the posted suggestions a lot, but I am neither a programmer nor a game designer. ;)



Not sure if this has been mentioned but:

If I want to give my fleet access to the hanger but not the SMB, it doesn't seem to be possible with the new setup.

I.e.:

In fleet with random people
Have crystals in hanger
Want to let fleet take crystals
Don't want fleet to steal my l33t ships that I haven't had time to move
Either give access to both or access to neither.


We need separate controls for both the hanger and the SMB

If its already been mentioned then dis-regard this post.
Zendon Taredi
Tier Four Technologies
#77 - 2012-10-22 10:29:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Zendon Taredi
CCP Habakuk wrote:
Divisions: I am afraid that it would be very difficult to bring them back. I will discuss on Monday with the team, if we could find any good alternatives.


Bring them back? These changes are not on tranq. Just throw the fleet hangar idea in the waste bin and say "We listened to our players, for once."
Tetania
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#78 - 2012-10-22 11:56:58 UTC
Zendon Taredi wrote:
CCP Habakuk wrote:
Divisions: I am afraid that it would be very difficult to bring them back. I will discuss on Monday with the team, if we could find any good alternatives.


Bring them back? These changes are not on tranq. Just throw the fleet hangar idea in the waste bin and say "We listened to our players, for once."


Because standing still and not iterating on the already dated feeling UI is what Eve needs for it's next 10 years.
Kari Juptris
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#79 - 2012-10-22 13:43:45 UTC
Tetania wrote:

Because standing still and not iterating on the already dated feeling UI is what Eve needs for it's next 10 years.


There is a difference between iterating on functionality and outright removing it. You never take functionality away.
Rengerel en Distel
#80 - 2012-10-22 15:30:02 UTC
Kari Juptris wrote:
Tetania wrote:

Because standing still and not iterating on the already dated feeling UI is what Eve needs for it's next 10 years.


There is a difference between iterating on functionality and outright removing it. You never take functionality away.


It really seems like their goal is to make the coding easier on themselves, regardless of functionality they remove. I can't say that the new coders are worse than the old ones, but when the new ones can't seem to code in the same functionality as the old ones, it's one way to look at it.

With the increase in shiptoasting, the Report timer needs to be shortened.