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Incoming heavy missile nerf and how you plan to handle it.

Author
Hans Momaki
State War Academy
Caldari State
#81 - 2012-10-01 10:17:47 UTC
serras bang wrote:
atm i got me CNR built but thats a 2 bill isk ship that needs to be mission speicificaly tanked ...[..]


You put 2 billion into a CNR and still have to use specific tank? Srsly? You are doing it wrong mate.
Herr Ronin
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#82 - 2012-10-01 12:19:40 UTC
Syn Fatelyng wrote:
Quote:
citation: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=155029

-Base flight time reduced by 30%
-Base velocity increased by 6.66%
-In total, base range reduced by ~25%
-Damage decreased by 20% (rounded to closest digit)
-Affects all variant Heavy missiles, including FOF.

This obviously affects the drake and tengu equally for C2/C3s and III/IVs. Will you be moving to heavy assault missiles, a new ship, or changing your playstyle? I'm curious as to your responses.

Edit: Here's some interesting information to consider, comparing HMLs to other long-range cruiser weaponry.
Takeshi Yamato wrote:
citation: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1937253#post1937253
Here are some raw numbers useful for understanding the proposed HML, beam laser and artillery changes:

250mm Railgun II with Spike:
DPS: 20
Alpha: 92
Optimal: 65 km
Falloff: 15 km
Cap/sec: -1.1
PG: 187.2
CPU: 31.5

Heavy Beam Laser II with Aurora:
DPS: 21
Alpha: 91
Optimal: 54 km
Falloff: 10 km
Cap/sec: -3.8
PG: 223.2 (previously 248.5)
CPU: 27.8

720mm Artillery II with Tremor:
DPS: 17
Alpha: 242
Optimal: 54 km
Falloff: 22 km
Cap/sec: 0
PG: 223.2 (previously 248.5)
CPU: 24

Heavy Missile Launcher II with Caldari Navy Scourge:
DPS: 23 (previously 29)
Alpha: 189 (previously 237)
Range: 63 km (previously 84)
Cap/sec: 0
PG: 94.5
CPU: 41.3

This is without any ship bonuses. My view on this is that a 25% range and a 20% dps nerf only seem ridiculous if one ignores just how much better HMLs were than other weapon systems.



The new mission Tengu will simple be the HAM Tengu, with a range of 70Km with 800 dps? Tengu is getting a Buff.

Well imo.

I'll Race You For A Amburhgear

Daniel Plain
Doomheim
#83 - 2012-10-01 13:10:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Daniel Plain
Herr Ronin wrote:

The new mission Tengu will simple be the HAM Tengu, with a range of 70Km with 800 dps? Tengu is getting a Buff.

Well imo.


i didn't do the exact numbers but from what i did see, the ham tengu will not be able to deal with frigs any better than it currently does which means it will not be viable for LVL4, no matter the range/dps.

edit: please correct me if i'm wrong there. in fact, i would appreciate some math on post-patch HAMs vs. frigates.

I should buy an Ishtar.

Uwara
The Ares project
#84 - 2012-10-01 13:35:01 UTC
Assuming CCP wont nerf Tengu, o wait, they already said they will.
So numbers for HAM Tengu right now could be ~20% dps overrated.

Won a G510 keyboard in AT-X on  21.07.2012. Still not delivered, CCP keeps quiet. Customer support needs a raise.

Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#85 - 2012-10-01 19:45:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Tyberius Franklin
Daniel Plain wrote:
Herr Ronin wrote:

The new mission Tengu will simple be the HAM Tengu, with a range of 70Km with 800 dps? Tengu is getting a Buff.

Well imo.


i didn't do the exact numbers but from what i did see, the ham tengu will not be able to deal with frigs any better than it currently does which means it will not be viable for LVL4, no matter the range/dps.

edit: please correct me if i'm wrong there. in fact, i would appreciate some math on post-patch HAMs vs. frigates.

Per the updated proposal the guided missile precision skill as well as all explosion radius affecting rigs/implants affecting unguided missile types is on the table now. Also fatcor in that the new proposition suggest a 10% damage nerf coupled with a 10% explosion radius increase for HML's. Not sure if that changes anything there, but it might.
Gaming God
Gaming God Corporation
#86 - 2012-10-08 07:05:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Gaming God
OMG and again a missile nerf Cry

Torpedos compleet useles
Cruise missiles can't even kill an Elite cruiser

And now this Cry

Whats next ?? Removing Caldari ships from the game ?
feihcsiM
Sons Of 0din
#87 - 2012-10-08 11:58:59 UTC
Lastest devblog now suggests 10% damage nerf rather than 20%

It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine.

Gaming God
Gaming God Corporation
#88 - 2012-10-09 06:49:50 UTC
Maybe we need to nerf the rockets to ?
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#89 - 2012-10-09 19:17:19 UTC
Gaming God wrote:
Cruise missiles can't even kill an Elite cruiser

This may be a personal issue as I've had no real issues in cruise missile ships killing elite cruisers
Hans Momaki
State War Academy
Caldari State
#90 - 2012-10-10 14:26:40 UTC
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
Gaming God wrote:
Cruise missiles can't even kill an Elite cruiser

This may be a personal issue as I've had no real issues in cruise missile ships killing elite cruisers


You really need to try harder, use Fury's and fit 3x CCC's and no TP at all! ;)
Doddy
Excidium.
#91 - 2012-10-11 15:07:24 UTC
Nikolai Dostoyevski wrote:
stoicfaux wrote:
Melina Lin wrote:
Sergi Arro wrote:
A 20% damage reduction is pretty significant.

Yes it is and they will nerf the T3 hull too. They will nerf it hard. Lol

Quoting CCP Ytterbium: " Tech3 ships need to be put down, like a rabid dog drooling everywhere in the house, they are out of line."

Entertaining times ahead.

Yes, but my concern is if they're nerfing them to the point that they're not really worth their high cost anymore.



I don't get CCP's recent push to homogenize everything. It's okay to have a "better" ship that costs millions of ISK to fit properly.

Not everything needs to be the same.


Right....... so people flying tengus for missions, tengus for ratting, tengus for exploration, tengus for wormholes, tengus for solo pvp (100mn esp), tengus for sig tanking pvp (thunderbirds), tengus for buffer fit pvp, usually all with the same weapon system and often even with the same subs/mods is not homogenisation?
Dorian Wylde
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#92 - 2012-10-12 00:29:43 UTC
I'm quite enjoying how people can't decide whether HM's are used more in PvE or PvP.

Back and forth posts whether this is a nerf to pvp blobs, or pve afk isk farmers.
Lugia3
Lazerhawks
L A Z E R H A W K S
#93 - 2012-10-14 23:08:30 UTC
I'll be happy that Tengu's won't be able to blap battleships anymore.

"CCP Dolan is full of shit." - CCP Bettik

Ceptia Cyna
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#94 - 2012-10-14 23:49:48 UTC
I will just stop paying my account. No Rage just Reaction.
Kara Books
Deal with IT.
#95 - 2012-10-15 01:41:28 UTC
This might be really stupid, but how was a finishing missions in a sub 400 DPS rattle, in 30 min average while the tears are flowing over a drop to 720 DPS from 800?

Cant even kill an elite cruiser? are you guys effing serious?

This has got to be the most childish reaction iv seen since iv bin playing.
Xavier Poljus
Roman Liberation Force
#96 - 2012-10-15 12:53:01 UTC
ok after reading about this nurf i have to say wasy to go ccp. Effectivly your are targeting 2 ships in this game with the Drake and Tengu. I mean its not like evryone who flys thes ships has spent 3 months training time and at least 2 billion in fittings for the ships. in all hounsty i have to aske ccp for a refund of the time i have spent, and the time i will have to spend on retraining and refitting a new set of ships now that this nerf is going to happen. Im sorry if i seem angry but in the real world they dont nerf rich peoples income or collage students curiculem because some under privliaged kids did get ther shoot.
Lord Calus
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#97 - 2012-10-15 20:25:50 UTC
Train Gila. Drop sentries. Orbit a sentry. Come back and have bacon.
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#98 - 2012-10-15 20:48:22 UTC
Xavier Poljus wrote:
ok after reading about this nurf i have to say wasy to go ccp. Effectivly your are targeting 2 ships in this game with the Drake and Tengu. I mean its not like evryone who flys thes ships has spent 3 months training time and at least 2 billion in fittings for the ships. in all hounsty i have to aske ccp for a refund of the time i have spent, and the time i will have to spend on retraining and refitting a new set of ships now that this nerf is going to happen.


So? You can still fly a Tengu, and it will still be highly effective at what it does best. It just won't be quite as effective, meaning that there might actually be better choices out there. But it's not as if Tengus are being removed as viable options; that would be absurd. It's just that they are no longer always the best option.

Xavier Poljus wrote:
Im sorry if i seem angry but in the real world they dont nerf rich peoples income or collage students curiculem because some under privliaged kids did get ther shoot.


Actually, this is in fact how much of the world works. Not that it's a relevant comparison in the first place, mind.
Jack Togenada
Doomheim
#99 - 2012-10-15 21:19:46 UTC
I finally got to start flying my tengu yesterday. It's beyond awesome. The speed alone is worth the price of admission. It's also really nice not having to micro manage drones with eve's horrible drone control panel.
octahexx Charante
Doomheim
#100 - 2012-10-16 13:09:35 UTC
for nullsec tengu will be useless,you dont wanna have to struggle with elite scram web frigs with them coming with every wave while a red can enter local at any time.
most of the trolling ppl on the forums obviously dont actually use the tengu..reaload time and missile travel time adds enough of slow pace as it is,the upcoming nerfs hits the pain barrier.

just start skilling gunnery is my advice.
drones will be targeted by new npc AI..im note sure is this is aimed at carriers with sentry drones but it will hit gallente pretty hard that just leaves you 2 races and depending on where you live in eve just go for the race with the best bonus.

once gunnery support skills are up its easy to swap what turret system you use,missiles on the other hand is a toatlly wasted skill tree.

It strikes me as a nerf in whole towards iskmaking more or less...since i dont work at ccp there is no way to see what the goal is but it why would anyone play a game where the grind becomes to horrible?

If this is supposed to be a pvp game as ccp claims why drag out the grinding part more and more?

Skill gunnery!