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Split Hybrid Weapon systems for Gallente and Caldari

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Parsee789
Immaterial and Missing Power
#1 - 2012-10-11 03:21:57 UTC
Why are hybrids so hard to balance? From what I can see is that its a weapons systems that has shared by 2 races that have completely different war philosophy.

Gallente is come close up and melt you with blasters. Caldari is to stay far away and wear you down.

Railguns are too weak for Gallente and Blasters are too short for Caldari.

I think we should completely separate the weapon systems of Gallente and Caldari, the two races broken apart and have been at war with each other.

Therefore their weapon technologies should have diverged to a point where neither system works with the other races.

Gallente should have invented their own long range turrets, while Caldari should have done the same for their shorter range.

MY PROPOSAL:

Gallente should ditch the railguns and get particle accelerators, which work in similar concept with blasters, but still pack a punch at longer ranges.

Caldari should ditch blasters and get coil or gauss guns, which are similar to railguns, but pack more punch in exchange for range.

This will make balancing weapon systems and races much easier.
Xolve
State War Academy
Caldari State
#2 - 2012-10-11 03:23:55 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
It's based on in-game lore, sorry you don't understand the game you play.

Also- your idea is bad and should have probably been posted to 'Features & Ideas'.
Suddenly Forums ForumKings
Doomheim
#3 - 2012-10-11 03:24:04 UTC
Torps are shared by Caldari and Minny but you don't seem to be advocating splitting those.
Cede Forster
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#4 - 2012-10-11 03:28:00 UTC
why is this on GD? Why is this not moved to proposals yet, where it can die like all other proposals?
Parsee789
Immaterial and Missing Power
#5 - 2012-10-11 03:29:34 UTC
Suddenly Forums ForumKings wrote:
Torps are shared by Caldari and Minny but you don't seem to be advocating splitting those.


Only a few ships share torps between Caldari and Minny, but Gallente and Caldari are stuck with each other's weapons for the majority of their shipline.

Gallente uses greedy Caldari Railguns in order to hit beyond blaster range.

Caldari uses fruity Gallente Blasters in order to fight up close.

If you balance hybrids as a whole for one race, you adversely affect another.
Parsee789
Immaterial and Missing Power
#6 - 2012-10-11 03:30:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Parsee789
Minmatar and Amarr have their own turret systems, while Gallente and Caldari have to share one.

Blaster don't work well with caldari in general and railguns don't work well with gallente in general.
Cede Forster
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#7 - 2012-10-11 03:50:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Cede Forster
ah crap, this will be another stealth: Hey make everything freaking same in order to buff what i can fly.

Yes, EVE has things that are not perfectly symmetrical. That is the point of the game, to not be always symmetrical - comparable - identical. There are four weapon systems and four races, why not make it ... one for each - because that makes it ... symetrical and everything and it needs to be symmetrical because --

yes, i am freaking listening, why again does it need to be symmetrical weapon distributions?


So why not specialize Caldari and Galante weapons? Because the point of hybrid weapon system is that they SHARE it. Galante have drones and hybrid, caldari have hybrid and missiles. Galante is being screwed with their drones, Caldari is now getting screwed with heavy missiles (after the other missile nerfs, such as torpedo), in turn people will drop the ships and other weapon systems will get screwed.

deal with it
Parsee789
Immaterial and Missing Power
#8 - 2012-10-11 04:26:56 UTC
Cede Forster wrote:
Blah Blah Blah Winmatar Autocannons and Awesome Lasers is fine, we should ignore hybrids.


Such a brilliant way of balancing, keeping weapon systems crappy for years is great balancing and management of the game.
Schalac
Apocalypse Reign
#9 - 2012-10-11 04:47:16 UTC
Parsee789 wrote:
Blaster don't work well with caldari in general.
That is news to me. And if that is so how come so many people shield fit gal boats for blaster use?

And a list of good blaster cal ships.
Merlin, Harpy
Cormorant
Moa
Ferox, Naga
Rokh

SCHALAC HAS SPOKEN!! http://eveboard.com/pilot/Schalac
Kaanchana
Tax-haven
#10 - 2012-10-11 05:05:50 UTC
Parsee789 wrote:
Why are hybrids so hard to balance? From what I can see is that its a weapons systems that has shared by 2 races that have completely different war philosophy.

Gallente is come close up and melt you with blasters. Caldari is to stay far away and wear you down.

Railguns are too weak for Gallente and Blasters are too short for Caldari.

I think we should completely separate the weapon systems of Gallente and Caldari, the two races broken apart and have been at war with each other.

Therefore their weapon technologies should have diverged to a point where neither system works with the other races.

Gallente should have invented their own long range turrets, while Caldari should have done the same for their shorter range.

MY PROPOSAL:

Gallente should ditch the railguns and get particle accelerators, which work in similar concept with blasters, but still pack a punch at longer ranges.

Caldari should ditch blasters and get coil or gauss guns, which are similar to railguns, but pack more punch in exchange for range.

This will make balancing weapon systems and races much easier.


How long are you playing eve? Do you know, there is a reason caldari and gallante share weapon systems. Always do your research before you come up with 'brilliant' ideas OP.
Taiwanistan
#11 - 2012-10-11 05:07:45 UTC
What about drones.

TA on wis: "when we have a feature that is its own functional ecosystem of gameplay then hooks into the greater ecosystem of EVE as a whole, and it provides good replayability."
ugh zug
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#12 - 2012-10-11 05:11:19 UTC
wataf go back to hiding under a rock and never come out again.

Want me to shut up? Remove content from my post,1B. Remove my content from a thread I have started 2B.
Nylith Empyreal
Sutar Rein
#13 - 2012-10-11 05:12:46 UTC
Wait what, sacrifice range for dmg? I can't put my finger on it, but I'm pretty sure that hybrid exists already.

Who's the more foolish the fool or the fool who replies to him?
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#14 - 2012-10-11 05:29:51 UTC
Actually OP... the problem lies mostly with railguns and not so much blasters.

Railguns deal anemic damage on both Caldari and Gallente ships unless they have damage bonus to boost them a bit... and even then other long range weapon systems are still better (including HMLs after the nerf).

On the other hand, blasters work very well on Caldari ships. Some good examples would be the "Blarpy" (Blaster Harpy), "Blaga" (Blaster Naga), and "Blokh" (Blaster Rokh). The last two examples can deal considerable DPS at 20+km away using Null.

As for Gallente... if you look closely at many Thorax, Brutix, and Talos fits you'll see that there is a trend of using shields rather than armor... which, in a way, means that people see an inherent advantage to using a defense system that is, lorewise, Caldari over the armor systems "favored" by the Gallente.

How did you Veterans start?
Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#15 - 2012-10-11 05:34:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Barrogh Habalu
Schalac wrote:
Parsee789 wrote:
Blaster don't work well with caldari in general.
That is news to me. And if that is so how come so many people shield fit gal boats for blaster use?

And a list of good blaster cal ships.
Merlin, Harpy
Cormorant
Moa
Ferox, Naga
Rokh

Which are almost every Caldari hybrid platform out there (and Moa, Cormorant and, indirectly, Ferox are going to recieve some attention in Retribution, if anything). So is there really a problem?

Also, if you need to do something to hybrids, you can tinker specifically with rails (average forum opinion: medium rails and maybe even medium long-range turrets in general). As far as I can tell, blasters are good enough with right ships (which is a lot of ships tbh), not to mention that if CCP are indeed going to tweak armor rigs and it's not just a rumor, then blasters will become even better in practice.

Future of T3 cruisers - multi-tool they aspired to be instead of sledgehammer they have become
Irya Boone
The Scope
#16 - 2012-10-11 06:09:31 UTC
it's most the gallente Line they have to balance not only the guns how can a buffer tank can come close when you have a mass like a domi or megathron you can't so you swithc to sniper mode .... and here the laugh begin ...

CCP it's time to remove Off Grid Boost and Put Them on Killmail too, add Logi on killmails .... Open that damn door !!

you shall all bow and pray BoB
D4mane
Wazan Tme Inc.
Corelum Syndicate
#17 - 2012-10-11 06:19:27 UTC
Khanid hulls are missile boats, so amarr share split weapons too.
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
#18 - 2012-10-11 06:25:58 UTC
Hybrids suck.

I put pulse lasers loaded with scorch on my Myrm and friggin' OWN!

Mr Epeen Cool
Darth Nupis
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#19 - 2012-10-11 06:34:30 UTC
Oh the old EVE semi-profession of the snarky forumite....Brilliant!
Ocih
Space Mermaids
#20 - 2012-10-11 06:36:27 UTC
The hulls are unique. Maybe it's just me but I'd opt for a blaster Vulture over an Astarte any day. 15 km optimals on a Blaster boat allows for a lot of turkey shooting while the Astarte is burning to range.

I do agree they have far too many similarities in some respects. Fed and Cal Navy Anti Matter are identical in every way. You would have thought they would have at the very least flipped out base shield and armor to reflect what they were trying to shed off the enemy.
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