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An idea against afk cloaking
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Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#61 - 2011-10-17 21:59:57 UTC
PLEAS CCP I HAV NO BALLS NERF EVERYTHING 2 MAEK ME HAV BALLZ!!11!!111111
Andy Landen
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#62 - 2011-10-17 23:43:40 UTC
The problem with afk cloaking is the cyno and covert cyno. Without those, I would have no issue with afk cloaking. An anti-cyno bubble module could protect ops from getting hotdropped right on top of them.

How do you conduct operations when any one threat can range from 0 (afk) to infinity (100 Titans through a cyno)? Troops cannot maintain 100% readiness for an unknown threat 24/7. With a cyno blocking ship which ALSO block cov cynos, I have no issue with afk cloakers because I can maintain fleets large enough to deal with them while my ops are in progress.

Anti-cloaking bubble upgrades on gates and stations are cool too.

I can also see alliance owned gate and station guns taking out reds. These upgrades help, protect, and encourage sovereignty. Helps an alliance defend their space against small numbers of intruders like checkpoints.

Some ideas for meeting the cyno threat aspect of the afk cloaky frustration. I like them, anyway.

"We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them." Albert Einstein 
Haxin Gam
Blackwater USA Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#63 - 2011-10-18 04:59:43 UTC
I really have to put in my two cents here. The problem for me, and most people i know who rat isn't exactly that the afk (or not) cloaky guy is there, its that anom's and the such do not require scanner probes to find. On top of that you run into the fact the stealth bombers can insta lock after-decloaking, tackle and pop a cyno (covert or not). at which point there is no feasible way to prevent that loss apart from not leaving the pos, or other safe zone.

that is the problem, not the cloaky, not the potential loss, not the fact that he is there. the fact that the only way to reduce his chances of success is to not be there yourself.

so, simple solution. once a player enters an anom that anom drops off the 100% system wide scanner thingy, meaning mr cloaky has to launch probes that mr carebear has to be watching his scanner for.

so bascly the way it works in WH's or hell make it so you have to launch probes to find anoms in the first place i don't really care.

so long as mr. carebear has some other line of defence other then oh hey there is a neut in local i guess I'm not doing anything today.

and the point of this is that it wont prevent that cloaky guy in local from being skury, its more that mr carebear now has a way to tell if he is being actively hunted by mr cloaky guy.

anyway that's my two cents, i think cloaks are fine the way they are, and the way they function, they make intel a little to easy but meh. The real problem stems in the lack of defenses a ratter has once that cloaky enters system. And the ease at which the cloaky can find his targets
Haxin Gam
Blackwater USA Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#64 - 2011-10-18 05:09:38 UTC
Andy Landen wrote:
The problem with afk cloaking is the cyno and covert cyno. Without those, I would have no issue with afk cloaking. An anti-cyno bubble module could protect ops from getting hotdropped right on top of them.

How do you conduct operations when any one threat can range from 0 (afk) to infinity (100 Titans through a cyno)? Troops cannot maintain 100% readiness for an unknown threat 24/7. With a cyno blocking ship which ALSO block cov cynos, I have no issue with afk cloakers because I can maintain fleets large enough to deal with them while my ops are in progress.

Anti-cloaking bubble upgrades on gates and stations are cool too.

I can also see alliance owned gate and station guns taking out reds. These upgrades help, protect, and encourage sovereignty. Helps an alliance defend their space against small numbers of intruders like checkpoints.

Some ideas for meeting the cyno threat aspect of the afk cloaky frustration. I like them, anyway.


they have those, its called intel and a cyno jammer. I know the cyno jammer only block normal cynos, but more then likley if there is a blops gang around they have been sighted, and you should have seen a report about it in your intel channel. meaning watch out, mr cloaky guy probably has friends
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
#65 - 2011-10-18 09:41:38 UTC
Andy Landen wrote:
The problem with afk cloaking is the cyno and covert cyno. Without those, I would have no issue with afk cloaking. An anti-cyno bubble module could protect ops from getting hotdropped right on top of them.

its not an issue but part of the game.
Its working like that, yes.

Andy Landen wrote:
How do you conduct operations when any one threat can range from 0 (afk) to infinity (100 Titans through a cyno)? Troops cannot maintain 100% readiness for an unknown threat 24/7.

you're right, you cant really know, there is no way to find it out reliably. But why should be there one?
If you live in a place full of such dangers, why not leave? Having a TCU in a system is not everything, this does not mean you control the space you live in.
Sphit Ker
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#66 - 2011-10-18 10:40:05 UTC
"Remove cloaked from local"?

This is the most asinine thing I've heard in a long time and I'm a TEST pilot, I've heard a fair bunch… How about your local turns blank when you cloak? While you are perfectly invisible and nothing can see you, why would you be entitled to see everything?

It knows what you think.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#67 - 2011-10-18 11:02:05 UTC
Sphit Ker wrote:
"Remove cloaked from local"?

This is the most asinine thing I've heard in a long time and I'm a TEST pilot, I've heard a fair bunch… How about your local turns blank when you cloak? While you are perfectly invisible and nothing can see you, why would you be entitled to see everything?
Have you read Ingvar Angst's idea? It's on p1.

If there is a AFK cloaking problem (and tbh, I have yet to see much in the way of an argument for this), his suggestion kills it and any surrounding issues dead in one blow.
Sphit Ker
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#68 - 2011-10-18 11:51:04 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Sphit Ker wrote:
"Remove cloaked from local"?

This is the most asinine thing I've heard in a long time and I'm a TEST pilot, I've heard a fair bunch… How about your local turns blank when you cloak? While you are perfectly invisible and nothing can see you, why would you be entitled to see everything?
Have you read Ingvar Angst's idea? It's on p1.

If there is a AFK cloaking problem (and tbh, I have yet to see much in the way of an argument for this), his suggestion kills it and any surrounding issues dead in one blow.


Are you kidding? :) There's no way I've read through 4 pages of sperg. I skimmed it, found something I can pick on then hit buttan.

Ingvar Angst's poast is better then nothing, really, as a "fix" to afk cloakers. Turning invisible is also blinding. It's cool when it goes both ways.

---

A sovereignty module might be a way of balancing afk cloakers but unfortunately, because it's a sov upgrade, it cannot benefit everyone equally. Can't support that, as is.

It knows what you think.
Ingvar Angst
Nasty Pope Holding Corp
#69 - 2011-10-18 12:16:10 UTC
Keep also in mind that the "fix" needs to be limited in ripple effects. If you nerf cloaking to "fix" the alleged afk cloak issue in null, you break a necessary function in wormholes.

Six months in the hole... it changes a man.
Jack Carrigan
Order of the Shadow
#70 - 2011-10-18 18:06:06 UTC
One of the Devs just shut another thing about AFK cloaking due to the fact that spamming threads about it doesn't help.

QUIT ****ING CRYING

There is no ****ing reason to nerf cloaking for the 3289643287563487956384756874368th time.

I am the One who exists in Shadow. I am the Devil your parents warned you about.

||CEO: Order of the Shadow||Executor: The Revenant Order||Creator: Bowhead||
Andy Landen
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#71 - 2011-10-18 18:38:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Andy Landen
Robert Caldera wrote:
Andy Landen wrote:
The problem with afk cloaking is the cyno and covert cyno. Without those, I would have no issue with afk cloaking. An anti-cyno bubble module could protect ops from getting hotdropped right on top of them.

its not an issue but part of the game.
Its working like that, yes.

Andy Landen wrote:
How do you conduct operations when any one threat can range from 0 (afk) to infinity (100 Titans through a cyno)? Troops cannot maintain 100% readiness for an unknown threat 24/7.

you're right, you cant really know, there is no way to find it out reliably. But why should be there one?
If you live in a place full of such dangers, why not leave? Having a TCU in a system is not everything, this does not mean you control the space you live in.

We know it is part of the game. These are proposals for CHANGE.
You ask, why should be there one? To make the game better and better match normal warfare mechanics. During WWII, the invasion began in Normandy, not in Berlin, for a reason. Can you imagine if the allied force had been able to hotdrop from New York straight into Berlin in 7 seconds? I say, CCP should modify cynos so that they cannot be lit unless you are blue with the sov holder. Cannot lock onto the cyno unless you are blue with the sov holder. That's what I say CCP should do.

PS to Jack: People who want change are not always "crying" or "whining." Such accusations are simply lame methods of protecting mechanics that, most likely, you enjoy exploiting.

"We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them." Albert Einstein