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How to improve a nomadic lifestyle
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Alx Warlord
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#61 - 2012-10-02 19:22:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Alx Warlord
Some Ideas HERE Concerning the new pos system ccp is developing....

Please read these!

New POS system New SOV system
Deornoth Drake
Vandeo
#62 - 2012-10-02 19:49:50 UTC
Indeed some interesting ideas.
Jin alPatar
Entertainment 7wenty
The Burning Contingent Alliance
#63 - 2012-10-02 21:00:03 UTC
I love so many of these ideas. I think much of it can be distilled down to: "I want a place to call home"

Right now, the barrier to having a POS or capital ship is pretty high and not realistic for many individual players to have on their own.

I know this is an MMO and there's a social aspect, but I think most of us really just want something that's ours that's a home instead of a ship.

Someone mentioned a winnebago and I think that's the best comparison so far. Most RVers tow a car behind their winnie.

Drive across the country, park somewhere, do stuff in the car, then hop back in the RV and go somewhere else.


Love:
single clone clone vat
1 or 2 research / manufacturing slots
refining capability (and no tax, right!?)
Space for a few ships.
Ability to anchor 'structure' and use one of the ships.

Let us leave the stations, CCP!
Vanessa Vansen
Vandeo
#64 - 2012-10-02 21:26:14 UTC
Yes, I'm hoping that CCP will take that into account when re-working the POS:

Being able to scale it from single person to alliance level.

From my point of view, homeworld offers some good ideas. I mentioned that already a few times Cool

An Orca is already pretty close to the space RV.
The problem is that you can't park it in a similar way like POS.

Back to the scaling:
It would be great if the slots would be unified:
- research slots
- manufacturing slots, or better manufacturing space, and of course a super-capital would need more slots/space to build than a frigate

In addition to components required for production with e.g. 5% damage (similar to R.A.M-...).
This way you could scale your research production the way you want it.

In addition, more slots should yield a better performance in terms of cpu/powergrid requirement,
e.g. if you have 10 slots in on POS should need less than 10times the requirement of 1 slot,
since they would be able to share stuff.
Lavitakus Bromier
WTF Bunnies
#65 - 2012-10-02 21:37:10 UTC
IM ganna keep this thread alive till I hear something from a Dec.
But as a stated before I wanna see a ship and less of a pos
Mars Theran
Foreign Interloper
#66 - 2012-10-07 07:25:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Mars Theran
I had this awesome vision of a CovOps carrier uncloaking earlier today. Imposing idea without a doubt. Would be cool to have in game, with some limitations. Smile
zubzubzubzubzubzubzubzub
Mars Theran
Foreign Interloper
#67 - 2012-10-07 07:27:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Mars Theran
Lavitakus Bromier wrote:
IM ganna keep this thread alive till I hear something from a Dec.
But as a stated before I wanna see a ship and less of a pos


I'll deck you if you like. Lol oh.. you mean Dev don't you? Sad

*up too late and some things just seem funny on my end. On yours, I'd guess it was tired. Blink
zubzubzubzubzubzubzubzub
Lavitakus Bromier
WTF Bunnies
#68 - 2012-10-07 15:52:27 UTC
Mars Theran wrote:
Lavitakus Bromier wrote:
IM ganna keep this thread alive till I hear something from a Dec.
But as a stated before I wanna see a ship and less of a pos


I'll deck you if you like. Lol oh.. you mean Dev don't you? Sad

*up too late and some things just seem funny on my end. On yours, I'd guess it was tired. Blink


Go ahead and Dec my Npc corp well eat you.

Agreed hats stop drinking when IM on these forums. I send to never check what IM saying and it comes out slugged...er slurred.
Jin alPatar
Entertainment 7wenty
The Burning Contingent Alliance
#69 - 2012-10-08 21:47:25 UTC
Mars Theran wrote:
I had this awesome vision of a CovOps carrier uncloaking earlier today. Imposing idea without a doubt. Would be cool to have in game, with some limitations. Smile


*shameless plug*

This is my idea for a CovOps 'carrier' : https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=159418

*sigh*

GIVE ME BETTER NOMADIC LIFESTYLE!!
Deornoth Drake
Vandeo
#70 - 2012-10-09 16:04:57 UTC
Jin alPatar wrote:
Mars Theran wrote:
I had this awesome vision of a CovOps carrier uncloaking earlier today. Imposing idea without a doubt. Would be cool to have in game, with some limitations. Smile


*shameless plug*

This is my idea for a CovOps 'carrier' : https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=159418

*sigh*

GIVE ME BETTER NOMADIC LIFESTYLE!!


Interesting!

I would be missing a way to somehow anchor you ship, including a module to make it unprobeable.
In addition, you should be able to access the ship and (both corp and non corp) hangar bay and maybe even get access to the fitted high slots, to repair a ship if an armor repper is fitted in the highs, similar to POS guns.

Why unprobeable?
This way you can anchor you ship, board a ship from the hangar, do something PVE,
when bad persons appear you could warp to the anchored ship switch into a pvp ship and have fun.

Think about a fleet of anchorable orcas moving around with a scout ahead,
switching to the ship required to perform the job and coming back to the anchored ship to get a new one afterwards.

And while the anchored ship is unprobeable, each regular ship around is probable :D
Imigo Montoya
BreadFleet
Triglavian Outlaws and Sobornost Troika
#71 - 2012-10-10 03:46:24 UTC
I like the concept of a nomadic playstyle, but I'm not necessarily sold on any of the ideas presented here. Reason being there are a lot of tools that already exist to support the concept.

  • Carriers can move ships around.
  • Rorquals can haul POSes to set up temporary refining/manufacturing if desired.
  • Jump freighters can move supplies around.


If there is a tweak that could make the lifestyle a more viable choice, then I would prefer that over adding a "Jesus feature" like a whole new ship.
Deornoth Drake
Vandeo
#72 - 2012-10-10 14:53:54 UTC
Imigo Montoya wrote:
I like the concept of a nomadic playstyle, but I'm not necessarily sold on any of the ideas presented here. Reason being there are a lot of tools that already exist to support the concept.

  • Carriers can move ships around.
  • Rorquals can haul POSes to set up temporary refining/manufacturing if desired.
  • Jump freighters can move supplies around.


If there is a tweak that could make the lifestyle a more viable choice, then I would prefer that over adding a "Jesus feature" like a whole new ship.


How would the following sound?

Anchor (or something similar)
* only fittable to carriers, super-carrier, titans (maybe not), Rorquals and Orcas
* occupies one high slot
* basically the ship becomes a kind of POS
* you could access the hangars
* you could access the fitted slots, like POS guns
* but Anchor-module also tricks probes, i.e. you won't be able to scan the anchored ship, but each other ship close-by.
* separate access and unachor rights with flavours personal, corporation, alliance, standing

Additionally, it would be good to get rid of the industrial restriction on Rorqual, so that miners could bring some PVP ships with them.
Jin alPatar
Entertainment 7wenty
The Burning Contingent Alliance
#73 - 2012-10-10 16:15:33 UTC
Deornoth Drake wrote:
Imigo Montoya wrote:

If there is a tweak that could make the lifestyle a more viable choice, then I would prefer that over adding a "Jesus feature" like a whole new ship.


How would the following sound?

Anchor (or something similar)
* only fittable to carriers, super-carrier, titans (maybe not), Rorquals and Orcas
* occupies one high slot
* basically the ship becomes a kind of POS
* you could access the hangars
* you could access the fitted slots, like POS guns
* but Anchor-module also tricks probes, i.e. you won't be able to scan the anchored ship, but each other ship close-by.
* separate access and unachor rights with flavours personal, corporation, alliance, standing

Additionally, it would be good to get rid of the industrial restriction on Rorqual, so that miners could bring some PVP ships with them.


There is no reason to have an unprobeable ship. It's NOT going to happen and is a bad idea. There needs to be balance, and automatic unprobeability for a POS-like item is NOT BALANCED.

If it's like a POS, then it should absolutely be probeable and it should be easy to probe down.


If you want a portable POS then work within the guidelines of how POSes are balanced. There needs to be a time it takes to anchor/unanchor. It needs to use FUEL. It has shields/weapons/EWAR to protect itself when unattended.
Deornoth Drake
Vandeo
#74 - 2012-10-10 16:54:49 UTC
Jin alPatar wrote:
Deornoth Drake wrote:
Imigo Montoya wrote:

If there is a tweak that could make the lifestyle a more viable choice, then I would prefer that over adding a "Jesus feature" like a whole new ship.


How would the following sound?

Anchor (or something similar)
* only fittable to carriers, super-carrier, titans (maybe not), Rorquals and Orcas
* occupies one high slot
* basically the ship becomes a kind of POS
* you could access the hangars
* you could access the fitted slots, like POS guns
* but Anchor-module also tricks probes, i.e. you won't be able to scan the anchored ship, but each other ship close-by.
* separate access and unachor rights with flavours personal, corporation, alliance, standing

Additionally, it would be good to get rid of the industrial restriction on Rorqual, so that miners could bring some PVP ships with them.


There is no reason to have an unprobeable ship. It's NOT going to happen and is a bad idea. There needs to be balance, and automatic unprobeability for a POS-like item is NOT BALANCED.

If it's like a POS, then it should absolutely be probeable and it should be easy to probe down.


If you want a portable POS then work within the guidelines of how POSes are balanced. There needs to be a time it takes to anchor/unanchor. It needs to use FUEL. It has shields/weapons/EWAR to protect itself when unattended.



First, the ship would be unprobable only when in anchored mode.
Why? Because it won't have a POS shield and all that stuff.
It's just anchored so it needs a bit of defense.
Once you're scanned while sitting beside it in you capsule or other ship,
it won't have defences at all. Besides those following the call to defend it.
While it is not in POS-mode it is probable, it's a regular ship then.

So, what would that ship provide?
A simple way to move somewhere and start out of the box.
For bigger groups, it would still be better to setup a real POS (atm still with POS shield).

You somehow have to ensure that not anybody passing by could just enter your ship and take it away.
Think about going somewhere with a RV and a car on a trailer.
You park the RV and lock, afterwards you take the car to have a look around.

Balancing ...
- module could require fuel (orca like small tower, carriers/rorqual like med tower and titans/super-carriers like large towers)
- or it would only be able to unprobable for an hour or two with a cooldown of (insert time here) hours

Most important, it should fit into the new POS system CCP is working somewhere deep within Island.
(Hint at CCP ... yes, sharing your ideas might be a good idea Cool)
Lavitakus Bromier
WTF Bunnies
#75 - 2012-10-11 16:35:22 UTC
Personally a mobile pos is to..er over powerd.
I think it should act like a pos is some way but with limitations.
Manufacture ships no larger then a cruiser sized hull.
Limited manufacturing, copying, research extra.
Less refining then a station.

and not alot of fire power so it will have to rely on it's nomadic family for protection.
Drago Misharie
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#76 - 2012-10-11 19:24:27 UTC
I think you are really on to something, CCP should listen. We do need to have a supported nomadic play style.

It is really a struggle at times because it seems like the entire universe is fighting you.
Vanessa Vansen
Vandeo
#77 - 2012-10-11 19:59:55 UTC
Drago Misharie wrote:
I think you are really on to something, CCP should listen. We do need to have a supported nomadic play style.

It is really a struggle at times because it seems like the entire universe is fighting you.


A dev saying hello in this thread would be an accolade.

I do hope that CCP did take notice but probably this thread is too small to get noticed.
Lavitakus Bromier
WTF Bunnies
#78 - 2012-10-12 16:16:47 UTC
Well it would be nice if some one could crunch numbers and come out with a prototype.
I would but IM not the best At math.
Buzzy Warstl
Quantum Flux Foundry
#79 - 2012-10-12 17:51:14 UTC
The fundamental basis here is that to play extensively in space that you don't control you need one of two options:

1. A ship that is capable of truly extended independent operations.
2. A mobile base that you can fly away from for hours at a time with a *reasonable expectation* that it will still be there when you get back.

I think that option 1 is a non-starter, though a case could be made that a carrier constitutes such a ship. Good luck with that, eh?

Something that can be scanned down in 60 seconds and walked off with by any reasonably skilled pilot (like an orca abandoned at a "safe" point) clearly fails to satisfy option 2.

This leaves something that can be anchored at an arbitrary point in space and has at least minimal defense and utility capabilities. Defensive capabilities can actually be allowed to be considerable (only while anchored), but utility should be little more than a garage with at most some very slow refining and a single ammunition manufacturing line. i.e. just enough to keep a single player in drones and ammunition while they wander about nullsec.

http://www.mud.co.uk/richard/hcds.htm Richard Bartle: Players who suit MUDs
Jin alPatar
Entertainment 7wenty
The Burning Contingent Alliance
#80 - 2012-10-12 21:06:48 UTC
Buzzy Warstl wrote:
The fundamental basis here is that to play extensively in space that you don't control you need one of two options:

1. A ship that is capable of truly extended independent operations.
2. A mobile base that you can fly away from for hours at a time with a *reasonable expectation* that it will still be there when you get back.

I think that option 1 is a non-starter, though a case could be made that a carrier constitutes such a ship. Good luck with that, eh?

Something that can be scanned down in 60 seconds and walked off with by any reasonably skilled pilot (like an orca abandoned at a "safe" point) clearly fails to satisfy option 2.

This leaves something that can be anchored at an arbitrary point in space and has at least minimal defense and utility capabilities. Defensive capabilities can actually be allowed to be considerable (only while anchored), but utility should be little more than a garage with at most some very slow refining and a single ammunition manufacturing line. i.e. just enough to keep a single player in drones and ammunition while they wander about nullsec.



Well put.

Do you think it makes more sense to have this as a ship that can be anchored? or more as a POS like structure that you need an industrial for?