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Add New Skill to Reduce T3 Cruiser Skillpoint Loss - LONG TRAINING TIME

Author
Darius Brannock
Doomheim
#1 - 2012-10-06 18:57:51 UTC
I would like to see a new sill added called something "Strategic Cruiser Interfacing" which would mitigate the skillpoint loss that comes with getting destroyed while in a T3 cruiser. With the coming Crimewatch changes, T3 cruiser pilots will be stuck with limited options for preserving their skillpoints as they will have to choose to either run (if possible) or fight and lose skillpoints if they die (since they will no longer be able to eject because of the weapons flag). Anyhow, the new skill would help mitigate the skillpoint loss by reducing the so-called damage a pilot receives by being ripped from their T3 cruiser.

It would work like this:


You mitigate the pain of being ripped from your cruiser by being more adept at creating loose connections that allow the same level of management at a lower integration level.

Rank 16 racial skill (like a Titan)
- Amarr Strategic Cruiser Interfacing
- Caldari Strategic Cruiser Interfacing
- Gallente Strategic Cruiser Interfacing
- Minmatar Strategic Cruiser Interfacing

For every each level 1-4, skillpoint loss of the a random sub-system wold be reduced by 8% - a 32% reduction in 14 days training with evenly distributed attributes and +4 implants
Level 5 would grant 100% reduction - total training time 76 days with evenly distributed attributes and +4 implants


The whole T3 skillpoint loss mechanic seems kind of arbitrary to begin with, but there should be an in-game mechanic to reduce this loss to zero if CCP is going to make it so that you have to go down with your ship. A VERY LONG training skill seems a fair way to address this issue.

Flame away....
Mars Theran
Foreign Interloper
#2 - 2012-10-06 19:18:44 UTC
Rank 16?

..anyway, not a horrible idea, so far as these things go. I'd probably up the rank of Tech 3 Subs to at least 3x, and make this skill a 5 or 8x skill.

Also, I'd minimum level the various Subs, and add more of them. Min. level would be 2 in a specific subsystem skill, to fit any Sub, and some would have prereqs like CovOps, and probably a new skill for Interdiction Nullification type Subs, which would also, reduce the drag effect on Bubbles or something, maybe even grant an extra point of Warp Stability at level 5.
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ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#3 - 2012-10-06 19:42:57 UTC
Because losing 5 days of training time is the end of the world.

T3s are supposed to be painful to lose (in more than one way). Take your loss like a man.
Harvey James
The Sengoku Legacy
#4 - 2012-10-06 20:46:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Harvey James
i still don't get why they did it in the first place remove the level loss and make all T3 skills including hull an 8x skill and be done with it

T3's need to be versatile so no rigs are necessary ... they should not have OP dps and tank

ABC's should be T2, remove drone assist, separate HAM's and Torps range, -3 HS for droneboats

Nerf web strength, Make the blaster Eagle worth using

Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#5 - 2012-10-06 21:35:16 UTC
If you think T3s suck to train into then you've clearly never trained to fly a battleship.
Paikis
Vapour Holdings
#6 - 2012-10-06 22:30:41 UTC
Every time T3 balancing is bought up, the usual justification for them being as good as they are is that they are expensive and cost you SP when you die in them. CCP have said on several occasions that they won't be balancing based on cost, are you sure you want to change this?

Be careful what you wish for.
Darius Brannock
Doomheim
#7 - 2012-10-07 00:07:49 UTC
I think it is fine that they make losing a T3 painful...whatever makes CCP warm an fuzzy. It's just that they are planning on taking away the only mechanic that allowed the T3 pilot to have a chance to avoid skillpoint loss through ejecting in a losing battle - not ejecting in time cost you skill points.

I think that they should provide a way to mitigate that change, and having a skill with the longest training time is fair.

Having it be rank 16 would give it a training time equal to training two racial Battleships skills to 5 - equivalent of losing a rank 5 subsystem skill 15 times.

Not training it to 5 would not provide much benefit (only 32% mitigation) if done as I specified above.

And yes I would wish for a skill that provided this...giving me the choice to take the pain up front in training for 75 days or take it in chunks from losing a level 5 skill.

The reason I do not think they should change the rank of the existing T3 skills is that many/most already have them at 5. I think changing the rank on existing skills would be far more complicated than adding a new skill of a high rank which is just another row in the database and a change in the calculation for skillpoint loss to check the level of the new skill and remove the appropriate amount of skillpoints from a random subsystem skill - if not a level 5 in the new skill.

Griffin Omanid
Knights of the Zodiac
#8 - 2012-10-07 00:35:21 UTC
Darius Brannock wrote:
I think it is fine that they make losing a T3 painful...whatever makes CCP warm an fuzzy. It's just that they are planning on taking away the only mechanic that allowed the T3 pilot to have a chance to avoid skillpoint loss through ejecting in a losing battle - not ejecting in time cost you skill points.

I think that they should provide a way to mitigate that change, and having a skill with the longest training time is fair.

Having it be rank 16 would give it a training time equal to training two racial Battleships skills to 5 - equivalent of losing a rank 5 subsystem skill 15 times.

Not training it to 5 would not provide much benefit (only 32% mitigation) if done as I specified above.

And yes I would wish for a skill that provided this...giving me the choice to take the pain up front in training for 75 days or take it in chunks from losing a level 5 skill.

The reason I do not think they should change the rank of the existing T3 skills is that many/most already have them at 5. I think changing the rank on existing skills would be far more complicated than adding a new skill of a high rank which is just another row in the database and a change in the calculation for skillpoint loss to check the level of the new skill and remove the appropriate amount of skillpoints from a random subsystem skill - if not a level 5 in the new skill.




They are all rank 1 skills so training lasts around 6 days to train them to level 5 from zero. And only one day to bring them to level 4.

And also their is one really important fact for all skill I know so far in EVE. Every skill level add the same bonus to the total skill bonus this way you get 80 % of a skill in less then 20 % of the total training time for a skill (someting around 15 %). If their is an exception I really like to know.

So most times the only use of training a skill to level 5 is for T2 stuff or advance skills, or if you really want to squeeze the last bit of advantage from your skills, which is not allways needed.

If you once forget to upgrade a new clone and get poded you loose with a 10 mill SP Char already more SP then you loose already more SP then while loosing a T3. Ok, flying around with an Alpha clone is really stupid, but flying in a T3 into situations, where you may seriously loose your ship is also stupid
Lelob
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#9 - 2012-10-07 00:41:34 UTC
How about you stop sucking so you don't have to worry about such a miniscule detail. That you are being penalized for your own pvp incompetence is hilarious.
Darius Brannock
Doomheim
#10 - 2012-10-07 00:56:12 UTC
As far as I know, for every other ship in the game, you do not lose any skillpoints when you lose the ship. So obviously CCP makes exceptions when they feel like it.

Also, there are skills where level 5 potentially covers more than the previous skill levels - like the trade skills where level 5 covers the whole region as opposed to systems ((level - 1) * 5) jumps away. Again, CCP makes exceptions when it feels like it.
Griffin Omanid
Knights of the Zodiac
#11 - 2012-10-07 01:28:59 UTC
Darius Brannock wrote:
As far as I know, for every other ship in the game, you do not lose any skillpoints when you lose the ship. So obviously CCP makes exceptions when they feel like it.

Also, there are skills where level 5 potentially covers more than the previous skill levels - like the trade skills where level 5 covers the whole region as opposed to systems ((level - 1) * 5) jumps away. Again, CCP makes exceptions when it feels like it.


Come on, Visiability, Procurement and Daytrading should stay this exceptions cause it is really hard to find a system where you are more then "max-level" jumps away from a system in the same region. And a further skill which would add further jumps in the same regions wouldn´t be bought by anyone, because it would be mostly useless.

But I think the formula is wrong it should be 5 * 2^(level-1) starting with level 2.
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#12 - 2012-10-07 05:43:50 UTC  |  Edited by: ShahFluffers
Darius Brannock wrote:
I think it is fine that they make losing a T3 painful...whatever makes CCP warm an fuzzy. It's just that they are planning on taking away the only mechanic that allowed the T3 pilot to have a chance to avoid skillpoint loss through ejecting in a losing battle - not ejecting in time cost you skill points.

I'm pretty certain that CCP never intended for T3 pilots to do this. However, being a relatively "niche" issue, CCP was probably content to just "let it be" until they came across another issue using the same mechanics.

And they did.

With the crimewatch changes to the aggression mechanics people can no longer pull that nasty Orca/carrier ship-swap trick... PLUS T3 pilots now must endure the full penalties that they were intended to suffer from the get go.
Talk about killing birds with one stone. Twisted