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Eve Online - Retribution - Winter Expansion announced

Author
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#121 - 2012-09-30 11:35:53 UTC
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
From the Massively article:

Quote:
Here's how the new bounty system in Retribution works: Any player can, for any reason, create a bounty on another player.(...) There are no longer limitations on creating bounties; players do not have to be below a certain security rating to qualify.


Maybe the guys at Massively got it wrong, maybe i am getting it wrong, but that sounds as a gateway to CCP-sanctioned player harrassment. Question

Are there any Developer details on it yet?


How so? Putting a bounty on another player doesn't give anyone any special in-game rights, does it?

Right now I could, quite legitimately, offer a bounty on you via the forums. How would being able to do it in the game make it more or less "harrassment"? The only real difference I can see is that with Retribution, another player would be confident of the bounty being honoured whereas now they'd just have to trust me and hope.

Conversely, now you'll be able to put in-game bounties on people you deem criminal, regardless of their sec status.

Incidentally, most hi-seccers seem to have some wrong ideas about bounties. Specifically, about how much is a reasonable bounty. There seems to be this general supposition that if an NPC battleship carries a bounty of 500k-1.9M, then that's a reasonable amount to put onto a player. If you want anyone remotely competent to actually go out of their way to collect a bounty, I suggest you start around the 250M mark for an easy target, and work quickly up into the 9-digit zone for a perp who's actually any good.

If people wanted to shoot a ship for a lousy mill, they'd just shoot an NPC BS, you damb tightwads.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

Bagrat Skalski
Koinuun Kotei
#122 - 2012-09-30 11:50:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Bagrat Skalski
Lets place bountys on bounty hunters. Lol
Dread Pirate Pete
Doomheim
#123 - 2012-09-30 11:57:59 UTC
I foresee a substantial amount of miner isk being placed on James 315's head. Roll
Benny Ohu
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#124 - 2012-09-30 12:12:52 UTC
I don't see the use - The Invincible Stabber is... well, an invincible Stabber.
TharOkha
0asis Group
#125 - 2012-09-30 12:35:58 UTC  |  Edited by: TharOkha
Andski wrote:
Idris Helion wrote:

So why are you complaining about highsec? What does it matter to you?


Because hisec isn't an isolated shard.

As well as null. Why does your alliance interfere with hisec then?

Quote:
This is what's killing EVE, that "PvP is for low/null, not hisec" mentality.


Yeah. Because growing numbers of subs is the indication of death... oh... i forgot... "eve is dying" (happily since 2003). And yes, Hisec shouldnt be the griefer haven as it is now. it should also provide retribution. You comite crime? You are a criminal, everybody should kill you. Thats why we call it HISEC.
I Love Lesbians
Doomheim
#126 - 2012-09-30 12:40:02 UTC
So where is the trailer? How can it be announced without a trailer Shocked
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#127 - 2012-09-30 12:42:08 UTC
TharOkha wrote:
Andski wrote:
Idris Helion wrote:

So why are you complaining about highsec? What does it matter to you?


Because hisec isn't an isolated shard.

As well as null. Why does your alliance interfere with hisec then?



Because hi-sec isn't an isolated shard.
What happens in hi-sec and the conditions that pertain there matter to people living in lo-sec, W-space, NPC 0.0 and sov 0.0.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

TharOkha
0asis Group
#128 - 2012-09-30 12:43:56 UTC  |  Edited by: TharOkha
Malcanis wrote:


Because hi-sec isn't an isolated shard.
What happens in hi-sec and the conditions that pertain there matter to people living in lo-sec, W-space, NPC 0.0 and sov 0.0.


This is also true vice versa. What happens in Low/null/wh and the conditions that pertain there matter to people living in hisec as well.

Question is. Do hisec dweller whine soooooooooooo much about life in null as nullbears whine about hisec? Please...
Singeabooty Raj
Doomheim
#129 - 2012-09-30 13:21:52 UTC
Personally I think the new bounty system will be abused as a viable griefing mechanic that evades enforcement by the Eula.

Put things in perspective and consider what happened at fanfest last year.

Post Retribution if a similar thing happened the new bounty system would allow a collective of players to effectively make any individual constantly financially viable for ganking isk wise potentially in perpetuity.

As I understand it assuming isk is not an issue (and with dedicated bounty hunters) retribution will allow one person or groups to effectively target any specific player / groups and shut down their play style unless the targeted player(s) opts to take the risk.

Since things are left to player interpretation the "Crime" could be as simple as flying a pimped ship.

Black Man with Goggles

Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#130 - 2012-09-30 13:26:21 UTC
TharOkha wrote:
Yeah. Because growing numbers of subs is the indication of death... oh... i forgot... "eve is dying" (happily since 2003). And yes, Hisec shouldnt be the griefer haven as it is now. it should also provide retribution. You comite crime? You are a criminal, everybody should kill you. Thats why we call it HISEC.


Ahahaha you seem to think that increased safety will bring more subscribers

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar

Scatim Helicon
State War Academy
Caldari State
#131 - 2012-09-30 13:30:16 UTC
TharOkha wrote:
This is also true vice versa. What happens in Low/null/wh and the conditions that pertain there matter to people living in hisec as well.


This is barely true at all.

Highsec has so much provided for them on a plate by NPCs and highsec mechanics that they're effectively insulated from any effects caused by events elsewhere in the game. CCP could delete 0.0 space overnight and 90% of those players based out of highsec would barely notice.

Every time you post a WiS thread, Hilmar strangles a kitten.

Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#132 - 2012-09-30 13:36:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
Malcanis wrote:
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
From the Massively article:

Quote:
Here's how the new bounty system in Retribution works: Any player can, for any reason, create a bounty on another player.(...) There are no longer limitations on creating bounties; players do not have to be below a certain security rating to qualify.


Maybe the guys at Massively got it wrong, maybe i am getting it wrong, but that sounds as a gateway to CCP-sanctioned player harrassment. Question

Are there any Developer details on it yet?


How so? Putting a bounty on another player doesn't give anyone any special in-game rights, does it?

Right now I could, quite legitimately, offer a bounty on you via the forums. How would being able to do it in the game make it more or less "harrassment"? The only real difference I can see is that with Retribution, another player would be confident of the bounty being honoured whereas now they'd just have to trust me and hope.

Conversely, now you'll be able to put in-game bounties on people you deem criminal, regardless of their sec status.

Incidentally, most hi-seccers seem to have some wrong ideas about bounties. Specifically, about how much is a reasonable bounty. There seems to be this general supposition that if an NPC battleship carries a bounty of 500k-1.9M, then that's a reasonable amount to put onto a player. If you want anyone remotely competent to actually go out of their way to collect a bounty, I suggest you start around the 250M mark for an easy target, and work quickly up into the 9-digit zone for a perp who's actually any good.

If people wanted to shoot a ship for a lousy mill, they'd just shoot an NPC BS, you damb tightwads.


As I said, I haven't seen any details on this so haven't made my mind up. It depends upon what does mean to put a bounty on someone, and what effect this haves on criminal flagging. If putting a bounty on someone is like now, and doesn't grants kill rights on the target, then it's fine. But, it's not as if we could trust the CSM nor CCP on this, and maybe they litherally mean that anyone with a bounty becomes a free piñata anywhere and anytime.

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you

Jax Bederen
Dark Horse RM
#133 - 2012-09-30 13:39:30 UTC
Would be good to be able to counter bounty the one that singled you out, but I can see bounties being made by perma docked alts to avoid this.
Ludi Burek
The Player Haters Corp
#134 - 2012-09-30 13:41:00 UTC
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
maybe they litherally mean that anyone with a bounty becomes a free piñata anywhere and anytime.



Well, it better be like this or it will be just another gimmick like wardecs. Oh noes, I have a bounty, hold me. Roll
Benny Ohu
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#135 - 2012-09-30 13:47:55 UTC
Nah, I think to grab a bounty you'll need to purchase or rent kill rights, wardec them or suicide gank them (in highsec). There's no way CCP'd let you just mark another player to get shot. It's insane. But how do you find out who has kill rights on someone :S Also if someone who has a big bounty kills you are you going to get a bunch of offers for the killrights?
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#136 - 2012-09-30 14:05:47 UTC
TharOkha wrote:

Yeah. Because growing numbers of subs is the indication of death... oh... i forgot... "eve is dying" (happily since 2003). And yes, Hisec shouldnt be the griefer haven as it is now. it should also provide retribution. You comite crime? You are a criminal, everybody should kill you. Thats why we call it HISEC.

Removing PVP from our PVP game sure will help subscription numbers!
Kopfy
#137 - 2012-09-30 14:06:57 UTC
Real Poison wrote:
Kopfy wrote:
Will be interesting to see how things will change and people adapt. Winter is coming, it seems.

Regarding the new Minmatar dessy: http://i.imgur.com/765EW.png
It's clearly a monitor with pointy bits.



How did you extract and render the in-game model to put the flags on?


Oh, i didn't i "borrowed" a picture of the actual USS monitor and put some low quality adobe illustrator magic on to it... Big smile
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#138 - 2012-09-30 14:19:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
Benny Ohu wrote:
Nah, I think to grab a bounty you'll need to purchase or rent kill rights, wardec them or suicide gank them (in highsec). There's no way CCP'd let you just mark another player to get shot. It's insane. But how do you find out who has kill rights on someone :S Also if someone who has a big bounty kills you are you going to get a bunch of offers for the killrights?


That would make sense, but, then, since when CCP are known for their abbility to make sensible choices without first letting the nonsense to stink the game for years?

If someone managed to get kill rights on him, then let him have it. That's retribution. But holding a grudge on someone and turn him into a flying piñata with a bounty would be nonsense.

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you

Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#139 - 2012-09-30 14:42:19 UTC
TharOkha wrote:
Malcanis wrote:


Because hi-sec isn't an isolated shard.
What happens in hi-sec and the conditions that pertain there matter to people living in lo-sec, W-space, NPC 0.0 and sov 0.0.


This is also true vice versa. What happens in Low/null/wh and the conditions that pertain there matter to people living in hisec as well.

Question is. Do hisec dweller whine soooooooooooo much about life in null as nullbears whine about hisec? Please...


Yeah, pretty constantly if these forums are any guide.

Or are you saying that hi-sec is so overbuffed that there's literally not a single thing about any of the other sec zones that the inhabitants need to care about..?

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

Elinarien
Doomheim
#140 - 2012-09-30 14:48:51 UTC
Scatim Helicon wrote:
TharOkha wrote:
This is also true vice versa. What happens in Low/null/wh and the conditions that pertain there matter to people living in hisec as well.


This is barely true at all.

Highsec has so much provided for them on a plate by NPCs and highsec mechanics that they're effectively insulated from any effects caused by events elsewhere in the game. CCP could delete 0.0 space overnight and 90% of those players based out of highsec would barely notice.


Just a slight exaggeration there.