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So CCP, any comment on Plex Prices?

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James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#121 - 2012-09-29 13:46:44 UTC
Selinate wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Selinate wrote:
Why should CCP step in for your sorry asses?

It's just 15$ a month. Pony up and pay.

Because they make more money per PLEX bought than per month of direct account subscription?
It's in their own best interest to keep the PLEX market healthy.


Depends on your definition of healthy.

Healthy according to the OP? No. If I suddenly decide to buy 300 or 400 plex at Jita and just trash them all or go in a bestower and see how far I get and have the plex destroyed, then CCP will be loving that. It won't be good for any of you plexing players though.

How does that help CCP at all? If you buy 300 or 400 PLEX, you bought that many PLEX. It doesn't matter much to CCP what happens to the PLEX after that, except that when that much PLEX gets destroyed the cost gets run up and as a result less people will be willing to buy it.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#122 - 2012-09-29 13:57:59 UTC
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
Naturally, this thread will be hijacked by the null sec zealots screaming "nerf high sec!", but does anyone at CCP, who is not part of the null sec cadre, have any idea why plex prices are out of control, and have numbers to back it up?


The net amount of ISK in circulation increases by a few trillion each month.


The end.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Sasha Deren
Mosquito Squadron
D0GS OF WAR
#123 - 2012-09-29 15:01:14 UTC
Seems to me to be a simple case of demand out stripping supply, since volume traded appears to be on a downward curve over the last couple of weeks.

I would hazard a guess that demand is coming from FW players plex'ing accounts via proceeds from LP cashouts, possible PLEX hoarding by speculators and the traditionally busier Q4/Q1 just around the corner too.

CCP can stimulate the supply side by further PLEX buying offers in account management, but the adjustment to demand will require a longer term fix. Then again, I pay RL cash for my sub and tend to use PLEX purely for ISK supply so I'm not really worried either way.
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
#124 - 2012-09-29 15:18:32 UTC
Sasha Deren wrote:
Seems to me to be a simple case of demand out stripping supply, since volume traded appears to be on a downward curve over the last couple of weeks.

I would hazard a guess that demand is coming from FW players plex'ing accounts via proceeds from LP cashouts, possible PLEX hoarding by speculators and the traditionally busier Q4/Q1 just around the corner too.

CCP can stimulate the supply side by further PLEX buying offers in account management, but the adjustment to demand will require a longer term fix. Then again, I pay RL cash for my sub and tend to use PLEX purely for ISK supply so I'm not really worried either way.



I believe that an old demand is drying up leaving lots of ISK out there to increase the price of PLEX: those that used to spend about a trillion ISK on Titans saw the titans nerfed to near obsolecence so now we have ALOT more ISKies that are no longer tied up in the builing of these behemouths. Would be interesting to see what thosethat used to buy PLEXes fortitansare doing now but that kind o stat I doubbt is not even accessable to Dr E since it isn't really quantifiable except by conjecture 
An' then Chicken@little.com, he come scramblin outta the    Terminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system's    crashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children'
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
#125 - 2012-09-29 15:22:38 UTC
Zhade Lezte wrote:
And oh so sorry OP, but this "nullsec zealot" doesn't really give a damn about your desire to keep my carefully thought out opinion out of the topic :P

I am interested in CCP's take on it, however.


i DOUBT ccp WILL HAVE A TAKE ON IT
They have closed ranks on almost all economic stats of Eve... no QEN for years, Dr E's blogs have not been commented for months, & CCP Diagoras has not tweeted stats since the beginning of summer.
We are looking at a news blackout from CCP on all things economic.
An' then Chicken@little.com, he come scramblin outta the    Terminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system's    crashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children'
Natsett Amuinn
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#126 - 2012-09-29 15:24:35 UTC
He who buys the plex from CCP controls the price. The more things you use plex for, the more likely people are to buy the plex from CCP.

You shouldn't be able to pay for a years subscription with less than a months play time. A billion ISK for 6 months of gametime isn't as much as some people think. There's a large number of players with an abundance of ISK and nothing to spend it on. Once someone has purchased 6 months or a years worth of gametime they're unlikely to buy any more plex in game, and the guys trying to sell what they got from CCP lose a potential customer.

The number of potential isk for plex buyers lost is constantly rising, and reduces the number of $ for plex buyers.


CCP can't depend on speculators and new accounts to stimulate the sale of plex for $.

The overal price of plex should always be rising; the rate of increase is more important than "it costs to much". Plex sales aren't to reduce the cost of plex for ISK, it's to control how quickly the overall price rises.

More "plex for..." options are needed.
Or
Lot's of really rich EVE characters need to stop playing for a couple of years.
And
CCP would have to remove all means of generating isk through gameplay for a little while.
And
Make ISK dissapear from everyones wallet over time.


In the meantime, learn to make more money.
Karrl Tian
Doomheim
#127 - 2012-09-29 15:34:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Karrl Tian
1) It's not CCP's job to control the price of stuff (or it shouldn't be).

2) Within the last two months they buffed the amount of ore a single miner could bring in while "improving" FW via letting people farm billions of isk on day-old alts in naked frigs (I've even seen mining frigs used). The increase in isk generation led to an economic event known as "inflation" where prices on everything sky-rocket from an overabundance of currency.

3) Nerfing highsec would lower the PLEX price as an overall reduced isk income would force sellers to bid lower. Carebears don't/won't see this, thinking any proposed changes exist solely for the purpose of dumping them into a gatecamp.
Natsett Amuinn
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#128 - 2012-09-29 15:40:53 UTC
Karrl Tian wrote:
1)

3) Nerfing highsec would lower the PLEX price as an overall reduced isk income would force sellers to bid lower. Carebears don't/won't see this, thinking any proposed changes exist solely for the purpose of dumping them into a gatecamp.


Would just slow it down, ISK has already been earned and it's not being removed from the game at a significant rate; which will always be the case.
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
#129 - 2012-09-29 15:52:44 UTC  |  Edited by: DarthNefarius
Karrl Tian wrote:
1) It's not CCP's job to control the price of stuff (or it shouldn't be).

2) Within the last two months they buffed the amount of ore a single miner could bring in while "improving" FW via letting people farm billions of isk on day-old alts in naked frigs (I've even seen mining frigs used). The increase in isk generation led to an economic event known as "inflation" where prices on everything sky-rocket from an overabundance of currency.

3) Nerfing highsec would lower the PLEX price as an overall reduced isk income would force sellers to bid lower. Carebears don't/won't see this, thinking any proposed changes exist solely for the purpose of dumping them into a gatecamp.



miners are not rolling in ISK its the FW Tier 5 farmers that are the root of the PLEX spike... its NULL/LO SEC that needs the nerfs with thier LP STORE reductions & passive TECH/moon goo incomes
An' then Chicken@little.com, he come scramblin outta the    Terminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system's    crashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children'
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#130 - 2012-09-29 16:00:27 UTC
DarthNefarius wrote:



miners are not rolling in ISK its the FW Tier 5 farmers that are the root of the PLEX spike... its NULL/LO SEC that needs the nerfs with thier LP STORE reductions & passive TECH/moon goo incomes


Hundreds of mining bots pop up in high sec over the last 2 months.

Plex prices rocket in the last 2 months.

Yep, it can't be miners!
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
#131 - 2012-09-29 16:03:09 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
DarthNefarius wrote:



miners are not rolling in ISK its the FW Tier 5 farmers that are the root of the PLEX spike... its NULL/LO SEC that needs the nerfs with thier LP STORE reductions & passive TECH/moon goo incomes


Hundreds of mining bots pop up in high sec over the last 2 months.

Plex prices rocket in the last 2 months.

Yep, it can't be miners!


Talking about bad correlations... miners individually unlike FWfarmers are NOT MAKING BILLIONS OF ISK PER WEEK
An' then Chicken@little.com, he come scramblin outta the    Terminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system's    crashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children'
Mistah Ewedynao
Ice Axe Psycho Killers
#132 - 2012-09-29 16:14:32 UTC
More like hundreds of FW exploiters show up in the last few months and Plex prices skyrocket.

Nerf Goons

Nuke em from orbit....it's the only way to be sure.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#133 - 2012-09-29 16:27:30 UTC  |  Edited by: baltec1
DarthNefarius wrote:


Talking about bad correlations... miners individually unlike FWfarmers are NOT MAKING BILLIONS OF ISK PER WEEK


Plex = a monthly cost. I think miners can manage to scrap up enough cash to pay for one and make a little profit. And I am willing to bet there is a hell of a lot more of them.
Garresh
Mackies Raiders
Wild Geese.
#134 - 2012-09-29 17:51:04 UTC
Doctor Gordon Freeman wrote:
Obviously CCP controls the RL $ price of plex, but could CCP be conducting experiments on us by making shadow purchases of plex ingame, and studying the outcome on their spreadsheet, observing the relationships between the variables as number six is experimentally manipulated?

How would we know? Is it a conspiracy to maximize number four and number five, lol? Is it far-fetched bunk?

Does anyone feel it's become a greater and exciting challenge over the last year to pay for your account with plex instead of real money?

Maybe it is just demand. Entirely possible.

I've wondered about people going back to school in the fall too, and whether that has anything to do with it.



Amusingly enough, if they *were* to do something like that on any sort of large scale there would be telltale signs in the economy because they would be creating isk with every shadow purchase. Those signs would be massive isk inflation as they are effectively creating a hidden, but extremely powerful isk faucet. So the eve economy would kind of look like it does right now. Lol

This Space Intentionally Left Blank
Kitty Bear
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#135 - 2012-09-29 18:00:22 UTC
James 315 wrote:
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
Naturally, this thread will be hijacked by the null sec zealots screaming "nerf high sec!", but does anyone at CCP, who is not part of the null sec cadre, have any idea why plex prices are out of control, and have numbers to back it up?


nulsec carebears driving up the price with passive moongoo isk. Smile


what he really meant to say, but daren't because of his POS owning overlords.
Lysa D
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#136 - 2012-09-29 18:31:39 UTC
There are 2 main factors that affect price: supply and demand.

Both Faction Warfare and an increase in AFK mining will increase demand. In both scenarios, players have realized that if 1 account makes N isk, 2 accounts make 2N isk, 3 accounts make 3N isk, etc. If N is higher than the cost of PLEX, the player may feel that he/she can maximize their ISK by subscribing more accounts. This increases demand which drives prices up.

CCP is also adding more ways to spend a PLEX other than adding game time. Just recently, there was an announcement about resculpturing your character for a PLEX. This also increases demand.

There is a secondary effect though. A sustained higher ISK price for PLEX will cause 2 reactions:

1. Some people will not be able to afford a PLEX. They are earning N isk a month, factoring in P price of PLEX. When N-P is too low (or below 0), they will stop buying PLEX for the account. This decreases demand.

2. Sustained elevation of the ISK price of PLEX may convince people to purchase PLEX with real money. These could be existing people who buy PLEX who decide to buy more (to maximize their in-game profit) or these could be people who normally don't buy PLEX but are attracted to the elevated price. This increases supply.

This secondary effect is what will (eventually) drive PLEX prices down. How far down? I'll leave that to the market speculators.
Aiwha
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#137 - 2012-09-29 18:33:51 UTC
Gogela wrote:


I think PLEX prices are going to be over 750 mil ea by mid December.




Well, I know what I'm asking my family to get my for Christmas...



Titan, here I come!

Sanity is fun leaving the body.
Pak Narhoo
Splinter Foundation
#138 - 2012-09-29 18:37:57 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
DarthNefarius wrote:


Talking about bad correlations... miners individually unlike FWfarmers are NOT MAKING BILLIONS OF ISK PER WEEK


Plex = a monthly cost. I think miners can manage to scrap up enough cash to pay for one and make a little profit. And I am willing to bet there is a hell of a lot more of them.


So you just completely dismiss the LP unbalance that is FW because your focus is solely on high sec miners? Shocked
Kewl.
Selinate
#139 - 2012-09-29 18:40:01 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:

How does that help CCP at all? If you buy 300 or 400 PLEX, you bought that many PLEX. It doesn't matter much to CCP what happens to the PLEX after that, except that when that much PLEX gets destroyed the cost gets run up and as a result less people will be willing to buy it.


Drives up the price of plex, people want to buy more plex for the same amount of money to get more isk for their buck, makes more plex sell. Because so many of you people have decided that you have to have plex in order to play the game, it's like gasoline at this point, you have to have it. In other words, you'd buy it anyway while the price goes down slowly due to the lessening demand of those who refuse to buy it at that price.

Not that complicated.
Doddy
Excidium.
#140 - 2012-09-29 18:41:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Doddy
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
Naturally, this thread will be hijacked by the null sec zealots screaming "nerf high sec!", but does anyone at CCP, who is not part of the null sec cadre, have any idea why plex prices are out of control, and have numbers to back it up?


Lets see, could it perhaps be something to do with an ongoing global recession meaning people have a little less RL isk to spunk away on internet spaceships?

No it couldn't be that.