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Courier contracts only frauds?
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Robbin Sund
#1 - 2012-09-29 09:43:56 UTC
Since I am still fresh and not sure on what to do, I am taking a peak into hauling, not for NPCs, They dont got feelings, so if I fail or succeed I wont even make a bad or good name for myself.

Then I took a peak into courier contracts.
Reading up on everything and started to look around on the current contracts.
Seems like the risk vs reward is totaly unbalanced on most of the contracts, some are obvious traps.

But I cant see myself hauling a shitload of cargo via a lowsec/nullsec area where I will have to pay 100m if I fail, and my reward is equal to an hour of mining in a noobie ship (1m).
The trip itself could probably be re-routed, but with the high risk and the high Collateral, its probably safer to mine 20 minutes more then the contract takes, to earn the same ammount of money within the timeframe.


So.. do people do their private courier missions via corps/allianced or forums perhaps? or do I need to get myself a rep inorder to recive private contracts?

One way trip! Why dont you drive?
Vilnius Zar
SDC Multi Ten
#2 - 2012-09-29 09:58:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Vilnius Zar
There's just two ways to scam with courier contracts, and they're actually very similar

1) create a courier to a destination people simply can't dock at (player outpost in 0.0), forcing them to fail the contract and lose the collateral

2) have a contract lead through low sec/0.0 where there's a big chance the hauler gets destroyed, loses its collateral and gives the other guys a killmail as a bonus. This can also happen in a quiet high sec that's camped in by a suicide group, but that's not a real danger unless you have a collateral of billions

These days this is easy to check by setting destination to the contract origin system and then add the courier destination as a waypoint, so you can see if it leads through low sec or not. There are no other ways to scam with it, they can't halfway the contract decide to cancel it and keep the collateral or anything like that. So IF you're capable of completing the contract it's not a scam.

Many have very crappy rewards though but that in and of itself isn't a scam as such, hauling isn't really a profitable thing to do unless you scale it up massively.
Robbin Sund
#3 - 2012-09-29 10:08:03 UTC
Vilnius Zar wrote:
There's just two ways to scam with courier contracts, and they're actually very similar

1) create a courier to a destination people simply can't dock at (player outpost in 0.0), forcing them to fail the contract and lose the collateral

2) have a contract lead through low sec/0.0 where there's a big chance the hauler gets destroyed, loses its collateral and gives the other guys a killmail as a bonus. This can also happen in a quiet high sec that's camped in by a suicide group, but that's not a real danger unless you have a collateral of billions

These days this is easy to check by setting destination to the contract origin system and then add the courier destination as a waypoint, so you can see if it leads through low sec or not. There are no other ways to scam with it, they can't halfway the contract decide to cancel it and keep the collateral or anything like that. So IF you're capable of completing the contract it's not a scam.

Many have very crappy rewards though but that in and of itself isn't a scam as such, hauling isn't really a profitable thing to do unless you scale it up massively.



So people are just putting low rewards because they want to come away as cheap as possible?
Oh well, guess courier contracts is nothing to actually gain anything on, might pick them up for some challenge later on when I can afford a failure.

Do you have any idea if corps/alliance run "courier missions" within themselves, where I can apply and profit on it?
Or is it all for the greater good of the corp, and no profit for the lone player?

Might be looking into buying low selling high, just need to bring out the old calulator and pen/paper thou.
Mining is interesting, but courier works seems to beat that by a longshot, carrying valueable cargo across dangerous places.

One way trip! Why dont you drive?
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#4 - 2012-09-29 10:14:12 UTC  |  Edited by: J'Poll
Also besides the public contracts (who usually are scams) there are dedicated hauling corporations.
For example:

Red Frog alliance - red frog freight, blue frog logistics and black frog logistics.
Push Industries.

If you really like hauling stuff you might look into joining one of them.


I know that all payments in red frog are going to the pilots. So the alliance only gets profit from donations.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

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Vilnius Zar
SDC Multi Ten
#5 - 2012-09-29 10:27:46 UTC
Robbin Sund wrote:
So people are just putting low rewards because they want to come away as cheap as possible?
Oh well, guess courier contracts is nothing to actually gain anything on, might pick them up for some challenge later on when I can afford a failure.

Do you have any idea if corps/alliance run "courier missions" within themselves, where I can apply and profit on it?
Or is it all for the greater good of the corp, and no profit for the lone player?

Might be looking into buying low selling high, just need to bring out the old calulator and pen/paper thou.
Mining is interesting, but courier works seems to beat that by a longshot, carrying valueable cargo across dangerous places.


Yes, many times freighters will move to a certain system anyway and will pick up anything that fits in their cargo to that destination, even if it pays bad. As long as haulers keep doing that then people will keep offering low rewards. They're not scams, just badly paid.

Generally hauling like that is done by alts and as such it's difficult to make good profit on, it can be done though. Couple of years ago I set up a "hauling company" with some alts, offering very specific services (into low sec etc) and because I knew what I was doing I could do it very quickly and very safely. I made some decent isk with it and after a while i found several ppl having repeat contracts so I contacted them and set up a deal that way, player interaction and all that.

These days there's Red Frog, the best known freighting corp in EVE who handle a ton of hauling for a set price so it'll be kinda difficult to get in there and grab a niche part of the market but it can be done with the right effort, knowledge and attitude. As an actual income form just don't bother with it unless you really like the idea of it.
mkint
#6 - 2012-09-29 15:37:06 UTC
My observation is that courier contracts are RARELY scams. People who may think so just did something stupid by accepting a contract they can't complete. Even a lowsec contract the person really wants the thing moved but wants to shift the risk of loss to someone else.

Look at it from the point of view of the scammer. It could take days for someone to make the trip, and may take any route. Are you really going to camp a wrong gate for days on end when you could just camp a regular choke point?

As far as making money, you'll pretty much need to join a reputable hauling corp. That is unless you just want to get paid for a trip you were about to do for free anyway, then check the contracts.

Maxim 6. If violence wasn’t your last resort, you failed to resort to enough of it.
Kitty Bear
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#7 - 2012-09-29 17:39:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Kitty Bear
The rewards offered can be a little underwhelming at times ...

look for around 10k per jump (base hisec travel), scale upwards for losec/nul.
or look for a reward thats at least 10% of the collaterol.


If they are too cheap to offer at least that much, they don't deserve to get thier stuff shipped.






+edit.
Forgot to mention the other possible courier contract scam to watch out for ..

They know when you've accepted the contract.
They know where your going to.
They know how long you have to compete it succesfully.

They will have a 'most probable route' that you will take, and they will be waiting
with an alt, in an 'alpha strike' ship along the way .....
I'm sure you can figure out the rest.
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#8 - 2012-09-30 21:55:39 UTC
In general, all the GOOD contracts get snapped-up very quickly.

Beware of contract for larger amounts than you can haul (making a contract for an amount only a Charon pilot with Caldari Industrial 5 can haul), and contracts that have really high collateral (they will be waiting for you).
Omega Sunset
Black.Omega
#9 - 2012-10-01 00:50:24 UTC
Tau Cabalander wrote:
In general, all the GOOD contracts get snapped-up very quickly.
This is true. There are some very good contracts that go up, but you need to keep checking the queue as they come and go fast. You can grab them even if you don't have time to do them at that moment ...which I recommend so to avoid gank contracts; waiting. So if a contract is posted with short delivery time, not worth it imo.

—Ω—
The Odiato
Arrodan Drydock Company
#10 - 2012-10-01 06:07:21 UTC
Yes, watch out for contracts that require you to deliver in a dead end system or a contract that will take you through a choke point. If the contract is to a low sec dead end system your probably gonna die.