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Dommi vs Rattlesnake for AFK mission running.
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Christopher Dulson
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#1 - 2012-09-19 18:54:14 UTC
Hello

There are times when i need to be away from the computer so it would be good if i could pull all aggro and just leave the mission running with drones doing all of the work.


I am unsure of the what to fit in each one apart from the new drone damage amplifiers and omni directional and drone navigational computer.

Questions.

1. Do you think that a passive Rattlesnake would work better than an active tanked Dommi ( i can afford both)

2. If i am away and someone comes in and loots my cans and my drones attack is it goodnight to the ship.

3. Do you have a good fit for either.

4. Do you think that I need heavy drones/Sentries II before using this boat.

5. Can these ships AFK when they engage the entire room in Worlds collide


Thanks for all of your help

feihcsiM
THE B0YS
#2 - 2012-09-19 19:25:40 UTC  |  Edited by: feihcsiM
There is no truly afk missioning nowadays apart from a select few single pocket missions you will only get once in a while. If your drones accidentally pop a couple of triggers in a mission you can quite easily be swamped by dps and lose your ship in no time.

For minimal input missioning I would recommend an active tanked sentry rattler. It's my favorite 'low-input' mission running ship right now, 800dps from drones alone, almost instantly swappable damage type & range, no ammo requirement.
I would however recommend you have decent drone skills and definitely T2 sentries, look at it this way; training sentry drone interfacing to V gets you access to ALL 4 racial T2 sentry drones, they are much better than the T1, it's SP very well spent.

For lower skilled characters a cap stable twin large armour repper dominix is a dependable, solid ship. If your skills are geared more towards shields you can fit an excellent shield tank on navy domis, but I've never done this personally so couldn't really comment

If someone loots your wrecks, your drones will NOT aggress the thief.

With good skills you might be able to afk the guristas room in worlds collide, but I seriously wouldn't try it with the serpentis one...

It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine.
John Ratcliffe
Tradors'R'us
IChooseYou Alliance
#3 - 2012-09-19 20:04:25 UTC
You could consider a passive Rattlesnake as well. Pop 4 SPRs and 3 DDAs in the Lows, 2 Omnis 2 LSEs and mission specific resists in the Mids and 4 CMLs and 2 Drone Links in the Highs.

Nice ship TBH.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose
Lucas41
SOMACOM
#4 - 2012-09-26 18:16:30 UTC
My personal preference is a passive fit rattler. However, with the new PVE AI coming not sure how much longer you will be able to go afk from your boat with drones in space.
Bommel McMurdoc
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2012-09-26 18:56:34 UTC
I'm not a fan of people going AFK during anything in the game, and there are people in the game that will punish you severely for it. But, of course you are a paying customer and it's your risk to take. =)

aside from that, you might want to reconsider this as there are revisions of mission NPC's AI in the works. Which means your programmer coded opponents will now change targets at whim. Ergo, your drones will be in danger of immediate retaliation, making it more difficult for the controller to depend on the drones to do all the work.

should you choose to ignore that, I am in agreement with Lucas41 on the passive rattler suggestion. such will allow you quite a buffer. this link ---> http://eve.battleclinic.com/loadout/46045-Rattlesnake-Passive-Level-4-Missioner.html is a good example.
Kasutra
No Vacancies
No Vacancies.
#6 - 2012-09-27 01:34:33 UTC
The Dominix is likely to be better for this due to cost, I think. It's similarly good at fitting DDAs and sitting there with heavy drones as the Rattlesnake is, and the assumption you're making about the tank is that it's "enough", which the Dominix can satisfy.

So yeah. If you're going to spend time on the low-income option that is AFK missioning, I don't suggest getting spendy on it.
Shereza
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2012-09-27 02:22:12 UTC
A passive "super-tanked" rattlesnake can push darn near 2k omni DPS tank, 1.9k against Sansha/Raider type rats, which is more than enough to let you aggro whole rooms, deploy your drones, and never have to worry about them getting aggro so long as there aren't trigger-based spawns that you didn't trigger yet and that your drones could trigger. Only problems with the build are that it uses a pair of invulnerability fields which in turn means your cap runs out in 27 minutes so if you're AFK longer than that your tank will drop to a paltry 1.4k, and it takes T2 rigs to manage that much.

All that said it would probably be a smart idea to set your sites on a lower tank and fit damage mods and rDPS->eDPS conversion mods. Even if you're "AFK missioning" time to completion can still be a factor.
Lady Naween
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#8 - 2012-09-27 03:10:53 UTC
bear in mind that come winter the AI will change target to your drones now and then and nuke them if you are afk.

so i would go with a domi since it is cheaper
Shereza
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2012-09-27 12:20:39 UTC
Lady Naween wrote:
bear in mind that come winter the AI will change target to your drones now and then and nuke them if you are afk.

so i would go with a domi since it is cheaper


I don't see how your points are connected. In any "AFK" build you should have more than enough tank to handle what you aggro in the mission, and depending on just how AFK you are and how much of each room you intend to AFK (if you spawn multiple waves/groups right off the bat) that can be a substantial tank. Losing your drones won't change that unless you're doing Blood Raider missions and they have those ever so lovely old school vampires.

If you'd gone with "so I would go with the rattlesnake because it has 25m3 more drone space" or "so I'd go with the dominix because it has more drone-independant DPS" I could have seen the correlation, or even "so I'd recommend using T1 drones regardless of which ship you use," but I can't see one between ship cost and losing drones.
Bommel McMurdoc
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2012-09-27 18:59:29 UTC
Shereza wrote:
Lady Naween wrote:
bear in mind that come winter the AI will change target to your drones now and then and nuke them if you are afk.

so i would go with a domi since it is cheaper


I don't see how your points are connected. In any "AFK" build you should have more than enough tank to handle what you aggro in the mission, and depending on just how AFK you are and how much of each room you intend to AFK (if you spawn multiple waves/groups right off the bat) that can be a substantial tank. Losing your drones won't change that unless you're doing Blood Raider missions and they have those ever so lovely old school vampires.

If you'd gone with "so I would go with the rattlesnake because it has 25m3 more drone space" or "so I'd go with the dominix because it has more drone-independant DPS" I could have seen the correlation, or even "so I'd recommend using T1 drones regardless of which ship you use," but I can't see one between ship cost and losing drones.
=


come winter expansion ..... no drones = zero dps = 100% incoming dps = wasted time and money.

rattlesnake is a faction ship..... dominix is not, ergo rattlesnake costs more. Quite a risk to undertake if all your drones are swallowed by pirates and your tank breaks while being AFK.
Ashterothi
The Order of Thelemic Ascension
The Invited
#11 - 2012-09-28 23:35:49 UTC
Your tank probably wont break if you fit your Rattler even close to right, but without your drones you are pretty much just sitting there waiting for something to come along and gank you.

Watch me live for all your Empyrean news and analysis!

Shereza
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#12 - 2012-09-29 00:41:35 UTC
Bommel McMurdoc wrote:
come winter expansion ..... no drones = zero dps = 100% incoming dps = wasted time and money.

rattlesnake is a faction ship..... dominix is not, ergo rattlesnake costs more. Quite a risk to undertake if all your drones are swallowed by pirates and your tank breaks while being AFK.


Full drones still means 100% incoming DPS. They might reduce the total amount you get hit with over time, but you're still getting hit by 100% of that amount regardless of how many drones you have in space. That particular nit picked if you didn't pack the tank necessary to take 100% of the DPS of the worst room in the mission given that all NPCs are spawned or aggro'd then you're asking to lose your ship regardless of what ship you're flying or if you do it now or post-AI change.

The real risk isn't that the rattlesnake loses all of its drones and then the AFK runner loses an expensive ship. The real risk is that the AFK'er is a moron in that they both relied on drone DPS to afk missions post-change and didn't pack enough tank to handle the worst possible s***storm the mission could throw at them.

I'll also point out that currently the rattlesnake is, barring player intervention, the less risky choice between the two to AFK missions in. You can amass a very, very heavy tank on one that is 100% passive, down to using amplifiers intead of hardeners, which the dominix would find difficult if not impossible. That in turn means that any and all Blood Raider missions that have vampires won't be a threat do the rattlesnake whereas they would be to the dominix.
Nor Tzestu
Dos Pollos Hermanos
#13 - 2012-09-29 14:01:02 UTC
Shereza wrote:
Bommel McMurdoc wrote:
come winter expansion ..... no drones = zero dps = 100% incoming dps = wasted time and money.

rattlesnake is a faction ship..... dominix is not, ergo rattlesnake costs more. Quite a risk to undertake if all your drones are swallowed by pirates and your tank breaks while being AFK.


Full drones still means 100% incoming DPS. They might reduce the total amount you get hit with over time, but you're still getting hit by 100% of that amount regardless of how many drones you have in space. That particular nit picked if you didn't pack the tank necessary to take 100% of the DPS of the worst room in the mission given that all NPCs are spawned or aggro'd then you're asking to lose your ship regardless of what ship you're flying or if you do it now or post-AI change.

The real risk isn't that the rattlesnake loses all of its drones and then the AFK runner loses an expensive ship. The real risk is that the AFK'er is a moron in that they both relied on drone DPS to afk missions post-change and didn't pack enough tank to handle the worst possible s***storm the mission could throw at them.

I'll also point out that currently the rattlesnake is, barring player intervention, the less risky choice between the two to AFK missions in. You can amass a very, very heavy tank on one that is 100% passive, down to using amplifiers intead of hardeners, which the dominix would find difficult if not impossible. That in turn means that any and all Blood Raider missions that have vampires won't be a threat do the rattlesnake whereas they would be to the dominix.



Lets start at the top. Full drones means things die at a reasonable pace. That very point means it will be impossible for you to take 100% of a missions DPS. It can't be any more clear that as NPC's die, the total mission DPS possible goes down. It's really not up for debate. You can either tank the mission or you can't. Can you spawn enough dps to sink your tank? if yes than pack more tank or I have a great idea...don't go afk. Fit some weapons on your boat and kill stuff before it can kill you.

In you next part. So the real risk isn't drones dying and losing the ship? It's losing the ship because of low DPS? Let's make this clear right now and forget your attempted argument about semantics. The real risk is losing the ship. Full stop. The real point of the AI changes is to force people to stop "AFK" mission running. They are lazy and very very inefficient way's to make isk. And now they will be a great way to lose your ship.

If I had to afk a mission for some godawful reason your 100% correct in that the Rattler is the top choice with it's huge passive tank. That said if I had to pick a ship to mission in between the two, and might have to hop up from the keyboard at times due to RL events I take the Domi everyday. Low cost, fully insured, and if you actually put some guns on it you have far better damage application as things stand now. A well skilled t2 fit domi can push upwards of 1000 dps out to 50km with a total isk outlay of half the rattler hull.
Bommel McMurdoc
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2012-09-30 00:38:50 UTC
Nor Tzestu couldn't have said it better......

yer a sitting duck without drones while being afk.
Onictus
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#15 - 2012-09-30 07:43:51 UTC
Nor Tzestu wrote:


If I had to afk a mission for some godawful reason your 100% correct in that the Rattler is the top choice with it's huge passive tank. That said if I had to pick a ship to mission in between the two, and might have to hop up from the keyboard at times due to RL events I take the Domi everyday. Low cost, fully insured, and if you actually put some guns on it you have far better damage application as things stand now. A well skilled t2 fit domi can push upwards of 1000 dps out to 50km with a total isk outlay of half the rattler hull.


Well more like a quarter with a standard domi, half with a navy domi, and I don't think you can make a rattler do that much DPS.

My dual armor repper did something like 650, and that was befre T2 drone mods or damage amps. With a shield tank I'm sure its perfectly ridiculous.