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Testing ASB adjustments on Duality

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CCP SoniClover
C C P
C C P Alliance
#1 - 2012-09-19 17:17:46 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP Goliath
Hi all! As mentioned in this thorough post by CCP Fozzie, we're going to have Duality up and running for a few days to test some of the stuff we're doing in the winter expansion.

One of those things are making adjustments to the Ancillary Shield Boosters. There is a version now on Duality with different stats, we would love for you guys to test them out with us to give us a better indication of whether these adjustments are the right one or not.

The adjustments are:

  • Reducing capacity in all four ASBs so they can now fit 7 normal ones (9 navy ones)
  • Upping the duration of X-Large ASB from 4 to 5 seconds
  • Adjusting the capacitor need of all four ASBs considerably


Again, we're still in the process of figuring out the best way to adjust the ASBs, so don't take the current stats as the final word on what will happen in the winter expansion. Hopefully this is just the first test of many with you guys.

Finally, there are a few other module adjustments we're contemplating, but are not testing right now, so more module testing is likely in the future.

Thanks in advance,
CCP SoniClover on behalf of Team Super Friends
James1122
Perimeter Trade and Distribution Inc
#2 - 2012-09-19 17:25:04 UTC
keep them as they are and just limit it so you can only fit 1 per ship

....

Warde Guildencrantz
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#3 - 2012-09-19 17:26:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Warde Guildencrantz
Does this mean we will get navy cap booster 50s? 50s are what people use in medium ASBs. Maybe even navy cap booster 25s for small ASBs, even though they arent used much.

As well, i dont think increasing cap need of ASBs is necessary, they already are crippling in 1-2 rounds without charges

@previous post: no, limiting 1 per ship is a crappy idea. ASBs are a good concept and it helps active tanking as it should, it just needs to not be able to perma tank through reloads with 2 boosters. (While one is reloading, you should only have enough charges in the second booster to last 1/2 or maybe 2/3 of the reload from the first, when receiving the full DPS that your ship can tank with a single ASB)

Out of interest however, i think they should not limit resistance shifting hardeners to a single one. Maybe 2 or 3 will make them more useful in more circumstances.

TunDraGon ~ Low sec piracy since 2003 ~ Youtube ~ Join Us

Hoarr
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#4 - 2012-09-19 17:26:49 UTC
Interesting balance pass. I think most people were expecting a 1 module limit. Should be interesting to try them out.
CCP SoniClover
C C P
C C P Alliance
#5 - 2012-09-19 17:27:05 UTC
James1122 wrote:
keep them as they are and just limit it so you can only fit 1 per ship


That option is still very much on the table, but we want to explore a few other alternative as well.
CCP SoniClover
C C P
C C P Alliance
#6 - 2012-09-19 17:28:30 UTC
Warde Guildencrantz wrote:
Does this mean we will get navy cap booster 50s? 50s are what people use in medium ASBs. Maybe even navy cap booster 25s for small ASBs, even though they arent used much.


Most like not at this time.
Matthew97
#7 - 2012-09-19 17:30:04 UTC
Your link doesn't exist btw.
Warde Guildencrantz
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#8 - 2012-09-19 17:30:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Warde Guildencrantz
CCP SoniClover wrote:
Warde Guildencrantz wrote:
Does this mean we will get navy cap booster 50s? 50s are what people use in medium ASBs. Maybe even navy cap booster 25s for small ASBs, even though they arent used much.


Most like not at this time.


So does that mean medium ASBs won't be able to fit 9 charges, only 7? Sorry if the cap booster sizes are messing me around here.

Maybe a good idea of balancing them is to make a stacking penalty on their cap booster storage for each module. The more ASBs you have, the less cap boosters you can fit in them. I think that's a good way of doing rather than just limiting it to one if it comes to considering that.

TunDraGon ~ Low sec piracy since 2003 ~ Youtube ~ Join Us

CCP SoniClover
C C P
C C P Alliance
#9 - 2012-09-19 17:34:07 UTC
Warde Guildencrantz wrote:
CCP SoniClover wrote:
Warde Guildencrantz wrote:
Does this mean we will get navy cap booster 50s? 50s are what people use in medium ASBs. Maybe even navy cap booster 25s for small ASBs, even though they arent used much.


Most like not at this time.


So does that mean medium ASBs won't be able to fit 9 charges, only 7? Sorry if the cap booster sizes are messing me around here.


Yes, until we do the navy 50 version. Which I think we're going to do at some point, I just don't think it will make it into the winter expansion. But I've been wrong before Blink
Warde Guildencrantz
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#10 - 2012-09-19 17:34:56 UTC
CCP SoniClover wrote:

Yes, until we do the navy 50 version. Which I think we're going to do at some point, I just don't think it will make it into the winter expansion. But I've been wrong before Blink


Ahhhhh my hawk becomes possible to kill for a couple of months!

:P

TunDraGon ~ Low sec piracy since 2003 ~ Youtube ~ Join Us

Aliventi
Mouth Trumpet Cavalry.
Mouth Trumpet Cavalry
#11 - 2012-09-19 17:36:33 UTC
You only need to change 1 thing about them: 1 size booster per ASB. Right now the XLASB gets the same boost no matter if it uses an 800 or a 400. So everyone uses the 400 to get more cycles off. Which means it takes longer to run out of charges and they can fit more charges in their hold. That's the only thing unbalanced about them.

I don't mind ships being able to fit more than 1 ASB. usually you have to gimp the fit somewhat to get the first on and majorly gimp to get the second one on. And no only does that usually involve more Co-pros in the low but faction equipment in other slots. And that adds up to nice kills.
CCP SoniClover
C C P
C C P Alliance
#12 - 2012-09-19 17:37:00 UTC
Warde Guildencrantz wrote:
CCP SoniClover wrote:

Yes, until we do the navy 50 version. Which I think we're going to do at some point, I just don't think it will make it into the winter expansion. But I've been wrong before Blink


Ahhhhh my hawk becomes possible to kill for a couple of months!

:P


You should try the quadruple-ASB Kitsune fit Twisted
Warde Guildencrantz
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#13 - 2012-09-19 17:45:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Warde Guildencrantz
Aliventi wrote:
You only need to change 1 thing about them: 1 size booster per ASB. Right now the XLASB gets the same boost no matter if it uses an 800 or a 400. So everyone uses the 400 to get more cycles off. Which means it takes longer to run out of charges and they can fit more charges in their hold. That's the only thing unbalanced about them.


The point behind it is to get people to use the smaller charges. You aren't supposed to use the larger ones, those are for cap boosters, not ASBs. They want cap booster 200s, 150s, 100s, 50s, and 25s to actually sell on the market, thats why they made the boost the same as long as you had the right size range of cap booster in there. I thought it was a good way of getting those charges to be useful in PvP. The only cap charges people used for PvP prior to the expansion was navy 400s in small cap boosters, navy 800s in medium cap boosters, and 800s/navy 800s in large cap boosters. Now people use 25s in small ASBs occasionally, 50s in medium asbs, 150s/200s in large asbs, and standard 400s in XL ASBs.

another question: When do we get the T2 version? Twisted

Make it cost more fitting but holds 1 more navy charge

TunDraGon ~ Low sec piracy since 2003 ~ Youtube ~ Join Us

Aliventi
Mouth Trumpet Cavalry.
Mouth Trumpet Cavalry
#14 - 2012-09-19 17:54:55 UTC
Except it should have to use the largest sized booster to get the largest shield boost. These were designed to combine the shield booster and the cap booster in to 1 module that for balancing it would be to give it a 60 second reload time and high fitting requriements. Since, as you pointed out, most cap boosters use the largest booster because it gives the most benefit then the ASB should get the most benefit out of the largest booster and a reduced benefit from a smaller one.

And if it matters so much as to getting smaller boosters to sell then make the smaller booster the max size and reduce the amount boosted. My main point is you are getting too much shield boost for a smaller sized cap booster.
Slighet
Siempre Muerto
#15 - 2012-09-19 17:59:08 UTC
CCP SoniClover wrote:
James1122 wrote:
keep them as they are and just limit it so you can only fit 1 per ship


That option is still very much on the table, but we want to explore a few other alternative as well.


This would be the best fix IMHO.
Rayge PVV
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#16 - 2012-09-19 18:04:10 UTC
Aliventi wrote:
Except it should have to use the largest sized booster to get the largest shield boost. These were designed to combine the shield booster and the cap booster in to 1 module that for balancing it would be to give it a 60 second reload time and high fitting requriements. Since, as you pointed out, most cap boosters use the largest booster because it gives the most benefit then the ASB should get the most benefit out of the largest booster and a reduced benefit from a smaller one.

And if it matters so much as to getting smaller boosters to sell then make the smaller booster the max size and reduce the amount boosted. My main point is you are getting too much shield boost for a smaller sized cap booster.


I like what you're saying here. It would be nice if you could choose between longer duration/less tank, shorter duration/ more tank based on the size of the cap mod.

‎"Don't give yourselves to the unnatural men, machine men, with machine minds and machine hearts. You are not machines, you are not cattle, you are men!" -Charlie Chaplin

Pattern Clarc
Citeregis
#17 - 2012-09-19 18:05:04 UTC
Quick to Nerf, and slow to boost. One would think only 2 modules were released last expansion...

Ex CSM member & Designer of the Tornado. Gallente - Pilot satisfaction

Natalia de Sade
Plutonium For All
#18 - 2012-09-19 18:25:18 UTC

Why not implement stacking penalty on multiple ASBs instead of imposing a hard limit of one per ship?
Warde Guildencrantz
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#19 - 2012-09-19 18:34:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Warde Guildencrantz
Natalia de Sade wrote:

Why not implement stacking penalty on multiple ASBs instead of imposing a hard limit of one per ship?


See I'm not the only one that thinks a stacking penalty is better.

Hopefully just to the capacity of the booster, really their boost amount should be left alone. The current issue isn't "It has too big of a burst tank", it is "It has too big of a sustained tank"

TunDraGon ~ Low sec piracy since 2003 ~ Youtube ~ Join Us

Pinky Denmark
The Cursed Navy
#20 - 2012-09-19 19:03:01 UTC
You can adjust stuff all you want and the limitation of how many cap boosters in the ASB is a fine adjustment...

But if you don't want to hard limit it like damage control and that armor resist abomination you will risc to ruin the ASB instead of making it a balanced alternative.

Also 1 KEY feature I know you HAVE to adjust is the double overheat bonus.
Currently you don't only get a bonus to cycle time which makes you tank more but also making you run out of cap boosters faster - But at the same time you get an 10% extra hitpoint pr cycle... You MUST remove this as long people use oversized ASB.
I've seen people with oversized and double ASB master this to an advantage where the heat almost doesn't build up at all...

Pinky
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