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Recommended Amarr Battleship for L4 Sansha/Blood

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Author
Jennifer Starling
Imperial Navy Forum Patrol
#1 - 2011-10-14 19:02:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Jennifer Starling
Hi all,

I've been missioning in a Tengu for some time now and I'd like to get myself a nice Amarr battleship to fight the EM weak rats in missions a bit more effectively. It's also getting slightly boring to fly the same ship all the time, no matter how easy.

Now I have Amarr BS IV and Large Pulse & Beam Specialization IV and very good tank/cap skills so that's not a problem. I can't use sentries though.
I wonder if I should get a Abaddon for the DPS, a Apoc for the range, perhaps a Navy Geddon for lots of drones and more cap regeneration with the extra mid? The purpose is to breeze through those missions as fast as possible.

If you have any recommended ships & fits don't hesitate to post them! :-)
Niko Lorenzio
United Eve Directorate
#2 - 2011-10-14 19:32:28 UTC
if you can afford it get a nightmare. Its the best ship for any mission

The CSM XI Election are now open until March 25th, 2016. Consider Niko Lorenzio for CSM XI.

CSM matters, your voice matters, your vote matters!

REDNECKMINING
Fidget Spinners in Space
#3 - 2011-10-14 19:32:31 UTC
Honestly if you want to go through the Blood/Sansha missions as fast as possible, nothing is going to beat a Nightmare. Its huge optimal and falloff with even the short-range high-damage crystals allows you to start hitting stuff the second you come out of warp. In multi-pocket missions, simply approach the gate and kill stuff as you go, and in single-pocket missions you won't have to move an inch. It might not have the "eft warrior" DPS of ships like a Pulse Navy Geddon or a Pulse Paladin, but the applied DPS with the huge range and tracking speed bonus is unmatched. Also, you won't be going through T2 crystals (like Scorch L) like crazy like you do with the Navy Geddon... IN Multifrequency, IN Xray and IN Standard L are all that you should ever need.

You do, however, need excellent capacitor skills and be prepared to drop some money on a complex shield booster and IN Tachyon Beam Lasers. Run your shield booster off Cap Booster 800 charges, and your lasers off cap recharge. Its an expensive ship so be prepared to spend some ISK to make it perform to its max but trust me, you won't be disappointed. The first time you roll through a L4 Blockade even with numerous tracking-disrupting cruisers trying their best to slow you down, you'll know what I'm talking about.
Jennifer Starling
Imperial Navy Forum Patrol
#4 - 2011-10-14 19:40:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Jennifer Starling
Haha what's this? P

Gentlemen thanks a lot for the advice but I don't want to train Caldari BS and I think the Nightmare is incredibly ugly!
I can afford whatever fitting and have a lot of IN LP though - so don't let that stop you.

The second best ship then? ;-) I guess that'll be the Abaddon?
Niko Lorenzio
United Eve Directorate
#5 - 2011-10-14 19:42:11 UTC
Paladin : p

The CSM XI Election are now open until March 25th, 2016. Consider Niko Lorenzio for CSM XI.

CSM matters, your voice matters, your vote matters!

Novah Soul
#6 - 2011-10-15 01:37:00 UTC
I don't wanna make another thread seeing as this one is already here, so here goes:

Given the option of either an standard issue Apoc or an Abaddon, which one is preferred given the use of beam lasers? I cant yet use T2 large guns so from what I hear pulses are sub-optimal in that respect.

I was going to use a Domi as I was concerned of the effects of Sansha/Blood TD effects but even with those in play I assume one of the actual Amarr BSes would still be more efficient.

My Amarr BS and Large Energy turret skills, as well as all support skills for gunnery are at 4 if that is a factor to consider.

Thx in advance.

A man is known by the quality of his friends. - Lex Luthor

GankuVerymuch
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#7 - 2011-10-15 02:53:18 UTC
Paladin is sweet when it comes to Blood/Sansha missions. But if you are waiting for skills to fly it you can't go wrong with a Mega Pulse II Apocalypse. (train T2 guns, you will not be disappointed) It'll need an afterburner though.

When you do get a Paladin Tachs are the only way to go. 1 shot bc's and 2 to 3 shot BS's, that'll make you smile and your wallet all blinky.

Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#8 - 2011-10-15 02:58:40 UTC
Novah Soul wrote:
Given the option of either an standard issue Apoc or an Abaddon, which one is preferred given the use of beam lasers? I cant yet use T2 large guns so from what I hear pulses are sub-optimal in that respect.


Apoc. If you're feeling ganky and don't care about cap stability, try to fit meta 4 tachs. If you want more stability and fewer fitting mods, use meta 4 mega beams. In either case, a pulse Apoc with T2 megapulse is about as good as you're going to get with that hull.

A tach Abaddon is also possible, but cap constraints go from limiting to stifling pretty quickly. The Abaddon in general is just harder to work with, especially with suboptimal skills. By the time it really starts to shine, you pretty much have the skills to sit in a Paladin by default.
Jennifer Starling
Imperial Navy Forum Patrol
#9 - 2011-10-15 09:10:33 UTC
Zhilia Mann wrote:
A tach Abaddon is also possible, but cap constraints go from limiting to stifling pretty quickly. The Abaddon in general is just harder to work with, especially with suboptimal skills. By the time it really starts to shine, you pretty much have the skills to sit in a Paladin by default.

Well Amarr BS V is still more than a month or more ahead (training other skills first) ... so I guess I'll get an Abaddon with Megapulses.
CCP Spitfire
C C P
C C P Alliance
#10 - 2011-10-15 09:39:37 UTC
I suppose it is a subjective thing, but i didn't like the Abaddon much when I tried it with my new Amarr character (admittedly, my skills were pretty sub-par then, but I still was happy to switch that ship for something else). I'm currently flying a Navy Apoc now w/ pulses and all the trimmings and skilling for a Paladin. Very happy with the Apoc, although doing the lvl 4 Blockade vs. Sanshas without skills for T2 drones was an experience I don't want to repeat ever again.

Speaking of the Nightmare, I love that ship but somehow I never had a chance to fly one during my 5+ years in EVE. I think at least two of my characters have the skills for it... Roll

CCP Spitfire | Marketing & Sales Team @ccp_spitfire

Jill Antaris
Jill's Open Incursion Corp
#11 - 2011-10-15 14:06:33 UTC
Abaddon all the way if you look for a very fast L4 ship that offers maximum dps, the Apoc is easier to handle by his higher range and easier cap management. Navy geddon is also very good if you have the skills for T2 sentry's.
King Rothgar
Deadly Solutions
Panic Attack.
#12 - 2011-10-15 14:27:58 UTC  |  Edited by: King Rothgar
Navy geddon with MPII if you have t2 sentries (curators II's), otherwise pulse abaddon unless you want to drop the isk on a nightmare. The paladin is pretty decent too (tachs or pulses) but obviously you can't fly that with BS4.

[u]Fireworks and snowballs are great, but what I really want is a corpse launcher.[/u]

Jennifer Starling
Imperial Navy Forum Patrol
#13 - 2011-10-15 18:29:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Jennifer Starling
Thanks @ Jill Antaris and King Rothgar!

Little question: cap rechargers and/or cap boosters?
I've seen fits of both types, is there any (dis)advantage of the one above the other?

[Abaddon, Sansha, boosters]
Imperial Navy Large Armor Repairer
Energized Reflective Membrane II
Energized Reflective Membrane II
Energized Reflective Membrane II
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Imperial Navy Heat Sink

Tracking Computer II
Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800
Quad LiF Fueled I Booster Rockets
Cap Recharger II

Mega Pulse Laser II, Multifrequency L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Multifrequency L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Multifrequency L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Multifrequency L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Multifrequency L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Multifrequency L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Multifrequency L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Multifrequency L

Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I

Hammerhead II x5
Hobgoblin II x5
King Rothgar
Deadly Solutions
Panic Attack.
#14 - 2011-10-15 20:24:00 UTC
Rechargers, I've tried both ways and nothing is more annoying than having to warp to station cause you can't fire your guns anymore. You also need to tank thermal a bit and 3x EM hardeners is a bit over the top. I'm a fan of a single rep, DCII and 2x EANM's but that's just me. Virtually everyone else loves fitting 3x active hardeners and a rep instead for some reason. In any case, I recommend no less than 3x CR's and possibly dropping a heatsink for a CPR. That said it's been so long since I used an abaddon for pve I honestly can't remember how I optimized mine.

[u]Fireworks and snowballs are great, but what I really want is a corpse launcher.[/u]

Jill Antaris
Jill's Open Incursion Corp
#15 - 2011-10-16 11:02:02 UTC
I was never really a big fan of a cap booster on it. I always liked this fitting for the awesome range and damage, cap is tight but manageable, the complex medium repper is for maximum cap efficiency. There are some missions like assault where you want another hardener instead of the 3. HS, to avoid issues if you stay jammed for to long. I used it in a clone with a cap, tracking, rep amount and both damage imps, it is similar effective as a paladin(if you are good at cap management). It basically acts like a gank fitted neutron mega at close range(especially with conflagration) with 5 times the optimal plus the ability to swap to 66+16km range in a second.

[Abaddon, L4 pulsgank]
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Beta Reactor Control: Capacitor Power Relay I
True Sansha Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane
True Sansha Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane
Corpum A-Type Medium Armor Repairer

Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range
Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range
Cap Recharger II
Gist A-Type 100MN Afterburner

Mega Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L
Mega Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L

Large Energy Locus Coordinator II
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit II


Hammerhead II x5
Hobgoblin II x5
Terghon Tu
Rockbane Enterprises
#16 - 2011-10-16 21:18:00 UTC
I've run just about everything Amarr in level 4 missions. For Sansha/Blood I generally prefer an Abaddon. The extra resists help your tank so you only need two active hardeners (1 EM, 1 Therm). Then I stack up three heatsinks to give me lots of dps. Using T2 Mega pulse lasers with Scorch crystals for range or IN Multifreq for anything inside 20km. A tracking computer with both scripts available lets you hit just about anything from 10km to 60km. Two flights of T2 drones (5 light + 5 medium) take care of anything your guns can't hit and add dps for the rest of the time.

Navy Apoc is great for the range, but doesn't tank quite as well. Navy Geddon has more drone space, but you can only fly 5 at once anyway and heavies aren't that useful (take too long to get on target). Paladin is nice for saving crystals but the T2 resists are actually worse against Sansha/Blood then T1. Going smaller, Absolution tanks L4s nicely but lacks the dps of a battleship. Legion can either tank well or do decent dps (though still short of a battleship). Speed tanking in a dps-Legion works but still doesn't go through missions as quickly.

Right now my mission fleet is:

Abaddon vs. Sansha/Blood
Navy Geddon vs. Gurista, Mercs, Drones, Serpentis
CNR vs. Angels (used to use a Paladin but thought I'd try missiles and shields for a bit).
Korgan Nailo
5ER3NITY INC
#17 - 2011-10-18 17:45:29 UTC
Terghon Tu wrote:
I've run just about everything Amarr in level 4 missions. For Sansha/Blood I generally prefer an Abaddon. The extra resists help your tank so you only need two active hardeners (1 EM, 1 Therm). Then I stack up three heatsinks to give me lots of dps. Using T2 Mega pulse lasers with Scorch crystals for range or IN Multifreq for anything inside 20km. A tracking computer with both scripts available lets you hit just about anything from 10km to 60km. Two flights of T2 drones (5 light + 5 medium) take care of anything your guns can't hit and add dps for the rest of the time.

Navy Apoc is great for the range, but doesn't tank quite as well. Navy Geddon has more drone space, but you can only fly 5 at once anyway and heavies aren't that useful (take too long to get on target). Paladin is nice for saving crystals but the T2 resists are actually worse against Sansha/Blood then T1. Going smaller, Absolution tanks L4s nicely but lacks the dps of a battleship. Legion can either tank well or do decent dps (though still short of a battleship). Speed tanking in a dps-Legion works but still doesn't go through missions as quickly.

Right now my mission fleet is:

Abaddon vs. Sansha/Blood
Navy Geddon vs. Gurista, Mercs, Drones, Serpentis
CNR vs. Angels (used to use a Paladin but thought I'd try missiles and shields for a bit).

Right, i was browsing around looking desperately for answers as I can't kill a single freaking cruiser against Sansha due to tracking disruption.

All the tank / DPS info is great, but if you can't hit ****, how do you mission?

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Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#18 - 2011-10-18 18:09:05 UTC
Korgan Nailo wrote:
Right, i was browsing around looking desperately for answers as I can't kill a single freaking cruiser against Sansha due to tracking disruption.

All the tank / DPS info is great, but if you can't hit ****, how do you mission?


NPC tracking disruption hits optimal hard but does relatively little to tracking and nothing at all to falloff. So if you're up against heavy tracking disruption, you want to pick a weapon with decent falloff. This means that beams -- especially Tachs -- and ACs are the best weapons for the job.

Alternatively, make sure your fit includes TCs and maybe a speed mod. It's actually not as hard to get around as, say, Serpentis damping or Guristas jamming and has less chance of utterly killing your ship than getting neuted to all hell. Of course the might Angel Target Painters of Doom tend to go completely unnoticed, but oh well.
AureoLion
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#19 - 2011-10-18 18:52:44 UTC
Paladin for isk/h, Nightmare for standing/lp.
Korgan Nailo
5ER3NITY INC
#20 - 2011-10-18 19:00:51 UTC
Zhilia Mann wrote:
Korgan Nailo wrote:
Right, i was browsing around looking desperately for answers as I can't kill a single freaking cruiser against Sansha due to tracking disruption.

All the tank / DPS info is great, but if you can't hit ****, how do you mission?


NPC tracking disruption hits optimal hard but does relatively little to tracking and nothing at all to falloff. So if you're up against heavy tracking disruption, you want to pick a weapon with decent falloff. This means that beams -- especially Tachs -- and ACs are the best weapons for the job.

Alternatively, make sure your fit includes TCs and maybe a speed mod. It's actually not as hard to get around as, say, Serpentis damping or Guristas jamming and has less chance of utterly killing your ship than getting neuted to all hell. Of course the might Angel Target Painters of Doom tend to go completely unnoticed, but oh well.

Hi Zhilia, thanks for the reply. I was really mad at the time I wrote that post that I didn't even took the time to check optimal.

My tracking went from 0.052 to 0.009, check this out:
http://api.cld.me/0C2H2L3O22461j440M2T/Screen_Shot_2011-10-18_at_12.38.37_PM.jpg

And using standard crystals, optimal felt to 16 down from 28 with a single TD.

I was using a TC, but completely missed the optimal change.

I played a bit with Optimal Range and Tracking Speed scripts, but it seems like I should have 2 TCs, given that just Optimal or just Tracking made me feel like I was missing too much of the other.

Thanks, I'll check it out how it goes, but not being able to clear L2 Recon really pissed me off at that time.

I just cleared it, same mission, although it took as long as doing a L4. =p

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