Player Features and Ideas Discussion

The main problem with cruise missiles is three-fold.

1) lack of dps/alpha
2) despite good range they are not fast enough to get on target.
3) The Raven is the sole platform on which they can be used to even marginal effectiveness (MARGINAL)

Solutions:

1) Pick either dps or alpha and do not compromise. Since it is a long range weapon - alpha normally dominates
2) Cruise missile flight time should be better than torpedo, but velocity should be far higher, faster than 20K/sec if possible. In-fact their flight range at max skills should extend beyond 250Km as targets tend to move and flight paths may extend as people move around a battlefield.
3) The Raven is the premier missile based long range stand-off platform, that has been in the unenviable role of a short range brawler that gets called primary often. The Raven's feelings are very very hurt CCP. Aside from flight time, speed, or rof for bonus choices I suggest a new bonus: role bonus

Role Bonus: Cruise Missile Specialist

Caldari Fire Control Specialists have revamped the targeting and tracking systems of the Raven for increased efficacy

Cruise missile damage increases as range increases (up to 200% of base damage @ 150km+)

Damage is based on missile flight distance (time*speed): 0-30 Km Base+40%, 31-60 Km+80%, and so on until you get that nice alpha.

Of course at these rates one could slow down RoF and there would have to be balancing with ballistic controls, but cruise missiles already have the slowest RoF...but someone else can do those maths!

Cruise missiles need to travel much faster to be viable in their intended role. That I will agree with.

But modifying the missile formula isn't something i could get behind.

The weapon platforms really need an overhaul.

Small weapons: Pretty much even here. Missiles and turrets are both good.

Medium weapons: No contest. Heavy Missiles just leave the Medium turrets in the dust.

Large weapons: Due to the increase in range over Medium turrets, and packing quite a punch, Large turrets tend to beat Cruise/Torpedoes. It is just too much effort to get decent DPS on Cruise Missiles, and getting near the paper DPS of Torpedoes requires a ship like the Golem or a Stealth Bomber.

I'll have to agree that Cruise Missiles are a little weak, DPS wise. Their alpha isn't bad though (the problem there is the travel time, not the volley damage). I'd say a nice way to buff them would be to decrease the cooldown between attacks on all Cruise Launchers. That way the volley damage won't reach sick levels (do keep in mind the crazy range Cruise have) and the DPS will be upped a bit. Perhaps lowering the damage reduction on frigates and cruisers slightly would also be nice.

I think the DPS of Cruise missiles is ok. But it wouldn´t hurt to increase the damage but lower the rate of fire. And for the speed: I think it was something around speed 10 km/s and flight time 30 s (maybe already skill modified) change it to something like speed 15 km/s and flight time 20 s. Result is roughly the same range (except fast moving target with MWD) but you hit them earlier which would make cruise a little bit more usefull.

You all forgot the problem of long range missiles doing the same damage at extreme range than at point blank ; hence, comparing them to close range ammo turret dps is dumb.

With 3BCS, the Raven does 500dps at 250km. That is the dps of a long range BS at 70-80km.

The problem is also HML which are too powerful : a drake or a tengu can achieve the same dps of a 2BCS Raven but without the problems of cruise missiles (low explosion velocity and large explosion radius).

And if missiles velocity is often mentioned to be a critical problem, I'm not so sure about it : cruise missiles velocity is the same as HML velocity on tengu (>8km/s). And if this time to hit is definitely a weakness of long range missiles, tengus prove that this is not a so critical factor.

I think the only problem of cruise missiles is their low explosion velocity and large explosion radius. Even Precision missiles don't allow to hit cruiser size target for decent damage. Though, the more I look to cruise Raven, and the more I wonder why it's not use ; my best bet is that it's not good enough *compared to the drake and its HML*... The problem is then more about the the drake or HML than about the raven or cruise missiles.

CCP said in the CSM Minutes that they need a buff, but that is about it. No word on what will change. I expect that nothing will happen until tiericide reaches battleships. As for your ideas, damage of missiles should be constant.

i totaly disagree with all these points tbh

point 1 if you want a raven or cnr to achiev the same dps as a tengu go and spend tengu money on it. My tengu 740 dps or so my cnr has the ability to be that or more . i spend 1.8 bill on me tengu and 2 bill on buying and fitting me cnr point made here i think.

Point 2 Low explosive velocity vs high radius again this is all bull all criuse missle have like a 1.5 km explosive radius even tech 1 and tbh if you want low explosive radius then go use tech 1 ammo as tech 1 explosive radius even on criuser will drop bellow or not much above 160 explosive radius and last i cheacked thats full dmg on criuser.

I'd like to see something done with Torps, Citadel Cruise Missiles and Citadel Torps as well. At present they are... weak.

Found it...

I think it should be noted that the Torp Raven was once a feared battleship. I think that as things have changed, the effectiveness of the Raven has waned. A light buff is in order.