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Getting Destroyed

Author
Henry Montclaire
Guild of Independent Pilots
DammFam
#21 - 2012-08-18 21:41:04 UTC
For level 1s I'd really suggest flying a destroyer. Sure, once you have a good grip on the game and some skills trained up, you can destroy level 1s with a well fit frigate. It won't even be a challenge. But at this point, the destroyer is going to be far stronger. It is, by nature, an anti-frigate gunship. Even with just six rail guns it should be able to pop almost any level 1 ship in one volley.

Another thing that's essential for a ship using blasters is to have a "prop mod". Prop mods are ship modules that you activate to drastically increase your speed. They come in two flavors, afterburners, which will double your speed, and microwarpdrives which will make you feel like superman (until you run out of capacitor). Since you're already familiar with the afterburner, I suggest you give the microwarpdrive a try.

But again, at this point you will get the best bang for your buck flying a catalyst fitted with rail guns. Also remember that if you have an armor rapper you do not need to repair at a station. Just dock and undock, that will refill your cap and you can finish repairing to full hp.

If you are dead set on flying a frigate, try to work towards this fit: http://eve.battleclinic.com/loadout/60859-Incursus-Dual-repper.html

It's designed for PvP, but I fly it in level 2 missions and have a blast.
MadMuppet
Critical Mass Inc
#22 - 2012-08-18 22:39:27 UTC  |  Edited by: MadMuppet
Michell Starstrider wrote:
I followed a lot of the suggestions and used Armor Repair and Armor Plates to Armor Tank. I'm very disappointed in Small Hybrid Turrets, by the time I've gotten close enough to a target for them to be effective... the enemy has already been shooting me up quit a bit. Considering Hybrid Turrets are the suggested Weapon type for all Gallente ships, that's pretty disheartening. The Missiles work long range, but the DPS isn't great against tougher targets.

I will say the Armor Repair module worked surprisingly well in combination with the Armor Plates, but I still had to go Repair at the station before killing the Boss. That does not feel very heroic, it actually feels very cheap and almost borderline cheating.

I appreciate people's suggestions, I am trying everything you guys are saying. My Hybrid Turrets and Missiles were totally ineffective against the Boss and took forever to kill him. All the while, he's tearing through my Shields in about 3 seconds and is still doing quite a bit of damage to my Armor. As I said, I had to actually go repair and come back to beat the damn guy.

Should I just forget about Hybrid Turret Blasters? They really don't seem to be very effective, even when you're right on top of your target the DPS feels dismal.


Short range fighting is painful at first becuase you do have to suffer the 'wall of gun fire' as you close. However, once you are on top of your target you can often gun 'under the guns' of bigger ships (you are moving faster than their guns can turn to shoot you). If I missed it earlier I apologize, but what ship are you flying?

Advice from my toolbox:

Use rigs, if you are more worried about running out of cap in your frigate you should be looking as Small Capacitor Control Circuits I. http://www.eveiverse.com/items/small_capacitor_control_circuit_i The only skill you need to train to use this is Jury Rigging to level 1. Once you put a rig in a ship it cannot be removed without destroying it, so if you repacakage the ship they will be destroyed.

Use an afterburner to close the range on the target. Although you can also use a Microwarp drive in many missions I would advise against it since it makes your signature five times larger (and you are easier to hit).

I would actually advise against using armor plates, they slow you down. Use 'Plating' instead. These are low slot items that reduce the damage you take from specific damage types (example http://www.eveiverse.com/items/small_capacitor_control_circuit_i#items%2Fmagnetic_plating_i ) <-- that is an item that does not use cap or slow down your ship but reduces the Kinetic damage you take.

On that note, find out what the damage types are in the mission you are going to take. Look up the mission here: http://eve-survival.org/wikka.php?wakka=MissionReports and look at around the fourth line or so for 'Damage Dealt'. Then fit the right plates for the right mission.

Orbit, orbit, run, but rarely use approach. When you are moving in to fast orbiting shots on ships set the orbit distance to 500-1000m. Odds are you are not going to be able to turn that tight and on a frigate that means you are going to be looping in small arcs about 2000m in radius. The good thing about orbit is, once you kill your target you keep flying at speed away from the area, just pick the next closest guy, hit orbit on him, and open fire until he dies. Orbit also has you approach the target as a slight angle making it a little harder for you to hit, the afterburner you should be using also helps this. Note, this is called 'speed tanking'.

Approach and 'keep at distance' (which I have defaulted to 1000km to run away from fast ships/kiting) both have a nasty atribute, once the thing you are approaching or keeping at distance dies, you stop! You should never stop unless you are shooting at a stationary target at the end of a mission (warehouse). Again, use orbit to keep you from stopping. Or at least double-click in the direction of the target ship rather than use 'approach'.

While a lot of people scream the cap-stable is pointless, it isn't a bad thing to get near when you are starting out. In general I find a mission ship with 10 minutes of cap or so with combat systems running close enough to cap stable for my liking. When i say 'combat systems' I make sure to off-line things like salvagers and tractor beams in the fitting window WHEN IN STATION to get an accurate read of capacitor numbers. Just make sure to on-line them again before undocking.

Late edit: It you are wiling to throw two hours of training time at it, Shield Management to level 2 will increase your base shields by 10% (5% per level) which might be a volley of gunfire while closing range.

This message brought to you by Experience(tm). When common sense fails you, experience will come to the rescue. Experience(tm) from the makers of CONCORD.

"If you are part of the problem, you will be nerfed." -MadMuppet

Keith Gavner
Nomura Industries
#23 - 2012-08-19 01:17:05 UTC
If you are running missions with gallente, there are two things you want:

1) Active armor tank
2) Railguns

1) To tank mission as a gallente, you will hold the enemy fire on your armor. Thus, your shield will go away like Kristen Stewart and Robert Pattinson's relationship (i.e.: Down fast with loads of tears and drama, well no drama for the shield and no one will talk about it but you get the point.)

You want to put hardeners to mitigate the incoming damage.
The higher your resistance in kinetic, the less damage you take from kinetic weapon. The trick is that each faction whether it's player ship or pirate ship will make specific damage. If you are fighting against serpentis or grist's, two pirate factions you often encounter as a gallente, you will want kinetic and thermic.

Once you have mitigated damage, you will want to repair the taken damage. Then you want to use a small armor repairer for your frigate. There are two tricks here. The first one is that cap stability is pretty meh. Given you have enough resistance, you won't need constant reparation on your armor. Therefore, you can shut down the armor repairer more or less often.

Since you will have put some cap recharger on your ship, your cap will regenerate pretty fast when the rep is off. Thus off, repeat and profit.

2) Now you know how to survive the mission. I know most of the bittervet consider it trivial but it's a big step up for a lemming (i.e.: you).

As other poster said, blasters are meh for missions. The thing about blasters is that they are kick ass at close range. The bad things about mission rats is that those folks aren't exactly the helpful kind. Therefore, they tend to start as far as possible from you and require something as insane as you traveling to melt them. The thing is that blaster are short range, thus there is a LOT of traveling to do and since rats are some sort of hipster that don't want to hang out in pack, that's even more traveling to do.

There come the alternative ! Railguns. They have terrible dps truth to be told but they also have the longest range from all weapon in game. What does it mean ? You won't have to move much in your ship. Therefore, you will just snipe all those mean rats from afar. No travel time and still damage => success and profit.


On an additional note, there are a couple of things that I would recommend. Don't mix your weapon whether it's armament style or caliber. Weapons in eve (except missils but missils are the root of evil, just like the caldari ship imo) have optimals. Optimals depend upon ammo and caliber. If you have different caliber with the same ammo, you won't be able to get into optimal for all your cannon and .... no success. Well mitigated success so meh and don't mix up your guns.

Also don't mix tank because active tank suck up cap. If you want to armor tank, you want cap rechargers. They take mid slot and so do shield tanking modules. Inversely, armor tank modules take low slots and so do power capacitor relay. Thus don't mix your tank or you will get meeehhhh results from each part of your tank (note the 3 es and 4hs, that's a big meh)

Last thing but not the last, a lot of frigates have been upped lately. For gallente, it's the incursus and the atron. They got better slot layout and capacitor than the old models. I would recommend the incursus to the tristan for missioning.

Now, lemming you know things. ( Okay you don't and my post contain way too many ie and meh to look respectable)

Sincerely

Keith
Keno Skir
#24 - 2012-08-19 06:05:23 UTC
Hey man, contact me in game and we'll get u a nice mission fit sorted out. If you havn't already sorted the peob by then, in which case contact me anyway and we'll get u in a mission gang.

Fly safe o7
Kitty Bear
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#25 - 2012-08-19 21:00:26 UTC
Michell Starstrider wrote:
Sir Livingston wrote:
Michell Starstrider wrote:
I had 2 Hybrid Turrets, 2 Launchers. Afterburner, Cap Recharger, Armor Hardener, Overdrive, Damage Control, and Shield Extender. I was switching and locking targets as quickly as I could, and taking them down as fast as I could. I also had my Drone out assisting me.


From the module types you listed, it appears you were using a buffer tank fit (fit designed to take a limited amount of damage)

I highly recommend using an active tank fit for missions (fit designed to regenerate armor or shield hitpoints by the use of a shield booster or armor repair module)


Regarding the advice to use Active Tank modules, every time I've ever tried to use a small Armor Regain or Shield Regain on my ships (Frigate & Cruiser), my Capacitor Regain goes immediately into the Red during Fitting. This happens even on a ship with no other modules fitted yet. I really don't understand why it's so hard to fit such a basic/inexpensive module to a ship... I seriously lose about -10 in Regain per Sec the minute I fit on an empty ship. Capacitor Recharger modules haven't been able to fix the problem either.

http://postimage.org/image/e8q94s1dx/ (Screenshot of my Engineering Skills)

Thanks for the reply, sorry if I seem agitated... I feel like the tutorials has done nothing to prepare me for how to address these issues.


Capacitor Recharger 1 <-- Medium Slot
Capacitor Flux Coil 1 <-- Low Slot
Capacitor Power Relay 1 <-- Low Slot
Capacitor Control Circuit 1 <-- Rigging Slot

An active tank requires modules that increase the recharge rate of the capacitor.
A small armour repairer combined with some of the above items will enable a more stable capacitor amount.
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#26 - 2012-08-19 21:55:00 UTC  |  Edited by: ShahFluffers
OP... try this fit I just cooked up.

[Catalyst - Newbie]

[Lows]
Micro Auxiliary Power Core I
Small Armor Repair I
Adaptive Nano Plating I

[Mids]
1MN Afterburner I
Cap Recharger I

[Highs]
125mm Railgun I (Lead Charge)
125mm Railgun I (Lead Charge)
125mm Railgun I (Lead Charge)
125mm Railgun I (Lead Charge)
125mm Railgun I (Lead Charge)
125mm Railgun I (Lead Charge)
125mm Railgun I (Lead Charge)
125mm Railgun I (Lead Charge)


Notes:
- It should all fit without a problem. If there is one it's probably going to be powergrid (that red bar on your fitting screen). Train up the skill "Engineering" a bit to fix this problem.
- stay at range and don't let anything get too close to you. With no skills applied to this fit, you should be able to hit things out from 14km.
- pulse your armor repper when you need to. If you are still taking too much damage, pull more range.
- with everything running, you capacitor power lasts for 1 minute and 30 seconds. With the armor repair unit off, your capacitor is stable at 62%.
Gabriel Silk
Elder Race of Man
#27 - 2012-08-20 01:10:50 UTC
Lost Greybeard wrote:
Also, always remember that you can warp out of a room and then come back in after repairing, you're not obligated in any way to stick with it to the end.


^ THAT^ saved my butt on several occasions :)

A life without adventure is likely to be unsatisfying, but a life in which adventure is allowed to take whatever form it will is sure to be short. ~ Bertrand Russell  

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