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Battleships in WH PvP

Author
Paquita Taquita
Doomheim
#1 - 2012-08-11 06:28:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Paquita Taquita
How common is it to fly battleships for small WH-based PvP roams? I usually see far more BC-and under-sized ships for what I assume are reasons of mass, but I may just not have enough data to judge the popularity of BS hulls in WH pew. In, say, smaller gangs of 6 and under, would it battleships be a good asset? I'm considering a Machariel since it packs a punch and is quite fast all things considering, or possibly a Tempest Fleet Issue since, like many WH entities, we generally run armor fleets and the TFI has a nice tank for less ISK than a Mach, seems a little more cost-efficient. I have bad lazor skills at the time so Amarr battleships aren't for me right now, but an Abaddon might also be a nice cheap option.

The reason I'm thinking of a battleship is that it seems like in a small gang of 6 and under the high DPS and good tank will be really good assets, and the mass and mobility drawbacks won't matter as much. Am I wrong? Also, in case I'm not totally crazy and stupid about it, is a Tempest Fleet Issue a good BS for small armor gangs, or am I missing some obvious reason I shouldn't choose it as my go-to WH small armor gang BS?

EDIT: As pointed out below, scanres is an issue but I should have mentioned that we almost always fly with a dedicated sneaky tackler for those surprise ganks Big smile Battleships would be for finishing the deed.
Windorian
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2012-08-11 06:32:21 UTC
battleships CAN work wonders in a wormhole, but it's limiting factor is more then just mass.

For one thing, if you are attacking someone in a WH (ambush) you dont want them getting out before you can scram them. A BS wil have a hard time landing on grid, and then getting a lock and scram on, most common ships flown in WH's. They simply warp off as soon as you enter grid, usually jsut before your lock lands.

Once off site, they are probably gone since many will either run out of a WH, or hide in a POS.

This is one of the main reasons cloaks, small craft, and HIC's reign in WH's as tackle.

Another problem is mass of course.

There's also the inherant slowness of a BS vessel warping about. WH fights can get mobile fast, and BS tend to fall behind.

Ravan Hekki
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#3 - 2012-08-11 07:34:04 UTC
They are great for cycling WHs though.
Keith Planck
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#4 - 2012-08-11 07:53:57 UTC
You know, I've always wondered what It would be like flying a fleet of Black Ops battleships around in wormholes :X

Bet that would throw the 1 lowly drake for a surprise with 10 battleships appear out of thin air. xD
Derath Ellecon
Washburne Holdings
#5 - 2012-08-11 11:02:57 UTC
Keith Planck wrote:
You know, I've always wondered what It would be like flying a fleet of Black Ops battleships around in wormholes :X

Bet that would throw the 1 lowly drake for a surprise with 10 battleships appear out of thin air. xD


Except that they can't warp cloak so getting on grid with the drake undetected would be tricky.
ROSSLINDEN0
AQUILA INC
Verge of Collapse
#6 - 2012-08-11 11:25:34 UTC
Derath Ellecon wrote:
Keith Planck wrote:
You know, I've always wondered what It would be like flying a fleet of Black Ops battleships around in wormholes :X

Bet that would throw the 1 lowly drake for a surprise with 10 battleships appear out of thin air. xD


Except that they can't warp cloak so getting on grid with the drake undetected would be tricky.


they also have a bigger mass than normal bs
GunnersMate07
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2012-08-11 13:20:18 UTC
Its more than just mass. The real king of w-space is the t3 strategic cruiser. They can have much better tank than the battleships (with a much lower sig radius as well), and with ships like a proteus, the DPS is not far off from a battleship. Add in the fact that they use medium class weapons, and many times the EFFECTIVE dps will actually be a wash since you're shooting targets easier with the higher tracking from a T3 compared to a battleship.

Granted there are always roles for battleships in wh pvp, but generally they belong to the faction ships (Bhaalgorns for epic neuting, the occasional vindi for pure DPS). But if someone wanted to join fleet and was asking to bring say a megathron or tempest, I would tell them bring a proteus or a loki any day of the week instead, even if mass wasnt an issue.
Jack Miton
Perkone
Caldari State
#8 - 2012-08-11 14:15:42 UTC
The only BSs that get used for WH PVP regularly are bhaalgorns and vindicators.
nightmares on occasion for shields.

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Rroff
Antagonistic Tendencies
#9 - 2012-08-11 14:29:05 UTC
As mentioned mass, the pace of WH PVP (often it will come down to who can react the quickest so a lumbering BS hull doesn't help there) and sig radius all make them less attractive for general PVP boats in wormholes, battleships will often still be used for POS bashes typically dominix or the amarr BS.
Lucius Arcturus
Hard Knocks Inc.
Hard Knocks Citizens
#10 - 2012-08-11 17:23:43 UTC
They're not bad for small gang traps, i.e. you doublebubble a WH and on the polarity side you have a BS or two to chug out dps, or for captraps (very rare anyways). For instance, when you catch a pve gang outside of their WH sleepering and trap them on their way home. But like other posters have said, smaller ships can often be just as effective without the mass and bulk.
Soon Shin
Scarlet Weather Rhapsody
#11 - 2012-08-11 18:46:00 UTC
With the exception of the Abaddon, most BS have much weaker RR tanks than T2 and Tech 3 ships. Their large sig size makes them take full damage of most weaponry and lower resist profile and slow movement makes them more likely to die.

Bhaalgorns are used because they are effective anti-capital ships but they are fairly vulnerable to being primary, despite fitting them for massive tank.


Vindicators have very high dps, but the mass could be better used for 10 proteus.
Klarion Sythis
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#12 - 2012-08-11 18:47:00 UTC
Can't stop the Rokh
Godfrey Silvarna
Arctic Light Inc.
Arctic Light
#13 - 2012-08-12 08:38:25 UTC
Megathrons are great against people who obsessively hug wormholes. Enemies demand to be in blaster range? Give 'em blasters!
Lysaeus
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#14 - 2012-08-12 14:38:20 UTC
Godfrey Silvarna wrote:
Megathrons are great against people who obsessively hug wormholes. Enemies demand to be in blaster range? Give 'em blasters!


You live in wormholes, pony up the isk for a vindicator or gtfo.
Arkturus McFadden
Anukar
#15 - 2012-08-16 13:44:35 UTC
Seen Megathrons of various class dominate in WH pvp Smile

..well WH PVP on actual wormholes, never ambush..as many have said.. they are slow as balls to lock the common target.